[Devodonaldson]

I may be wrong, but I'm assuming that the amp in the SHIFT is more powerful than the DFR.
I know that the amp in the SHIFT is more powerful than the one in the OPPO HA-2 (specifically for driving phones that are 300 Ohms).
If it was all qbout Dac chip, tgwn baswd on what your saying about chip quality, the black woukd be better than the red, 9018 black vs 9016 red. But apparently much more goes inti tge actual implementation. Now i wonder if 9018 is better, why wasnt it used in the red?

See below...


DAC

It looks to me like the DAC chip in the Dragonfly Red (9016) is better than the one on the Peachtree SHIFT (9010), but not as good as the one in the OPPO HA-2 (9018).

How much of a difference are we actually going to hear though when comparing these 3 chips?


--- The OPPO HA-2 uses the SABRE ES9018-K2M DAC chip
http://www.esstech.com/index.php/en/products/sabre-digital-analog-converters/audiophile-dacs/classic-sabre-8-channel-dacs/es9018/


--- The Peachtree shift uses the SABRE ES9010-K2M DAC chip
http://www.esstech.com/index.php/en/products/sabre-digital-analog-converters/sabre-hifi-mobile-dacs/sabre-hifi-stereo-dacs/es9010k2m/


 

AMP

HA-2:

300 mW into 16 Ohm
220 mW into 32 Ohm
30 mW into 300 Ohm

SHIFT:

230 mW into 16 Ohm
136 mW into 32 Ohm
65 mW into 300 Ohm

 

[TAREKFOUAD1]

   
 
Very interesting; a number of people are saying that the DFR sounds better than the OPPO HA-2.
 
 

I compared my DFR with my Gungnir really no different in DAC section, sound very good to me with my pc
My Gungnir is off now.

 

[canali]

my advice..don't get caught up into the most current dac chips used debate....i even had copied an email in this thread a while back from my correspondence with gordon rankin, the genius behind the dragonfly....basically what he said was:
you could get 20 designers in the room, all with the same pieces of tech ...and at the end each would/could
produce something totally different sounding from one another.
 
so the dac chip used, even if the latest and greatest, is only one part of the final product:
....how it's then mixed in with the rest of the recipe, is another.
 
Quote:

   
I may be wrong, but I'm assuming that the amp in the SHIFT is more powerful than the DFR.
I know that the amp in the SHIFT is more powerful than the one in the OPPO HA-2 (specifically for driving phones that are 300 Ohms).
 
See below...
 
 
DAC
 
It looks to me like the DAC chip in the Dragonfly Red (9016) is better than the one on the Peachtree SHIFT (9010), but not as good as the one in the OPPO HA-2 (9018).
 
How much of a difference are we actually going to hear though when comparing these 3 chips?
 
 
--- The OPPO HA-2 uses the SABRE ES9018-K2M DAC chip
http://www.esstech.com/index.php/en/products/sabre-digital-analog-converters/audiophile-dacs/classic-sabre-8-channel-dacs/es9018/

--- The Peachtree shift uses the SABRE ES9010-K2M DAC chip
http://www.esstech.com/index.php/en/products/sabre-digital-analog-converters/sabre-hifi-mobile-dacs/sabre-hifi-stereo-dacs/es9010k2m/

 
 
AMP
 
HA-2:
 
300 mW into 16 Ohm
220 mW into 32 Ohm
30 mW into 300 Ohm
 
SHIFT:
 
230 mW into 16 Ohm
136 mW into 32 Ohm
65 mW into 300 Ohm

 

[Duncan]

It uses the Sabre DAC chip, likely the exact same one as in Dragonfly Red. They included support for higher resolutions though. But as it needs its own battery the amp must be different. Definitely more powerful, right?

Would be interesting to have someone compare the two.

The reason why the DF range do not go above 24/96 is so that they then do not need an external battery (or drain too much from the battery of what it is plugged in to)...

As to whether you would actually note a difference in perceived SQ goes back to the point of DAC implementation!

...Also, the DF does have plenty of power on tap (for its size) - might not be so great for 300ohm+ cans (cannot confirm one way or the other) though as there has to be a limit of what can be squeezed out of the meagre battery drain from its source

 

[TheEldestBoy]

The reason why the DF range do not go above 24/96 is so that they then do not need an external battery (or drain too much from the battery of what it is plugged in to)...

As to whether you would actually note a difference in perceived SQ goes back to the point of DAC implementation!

...Also, the DF does have plenty of power on tap (for its size) - might not be so great for 300ohm+ cans (cannot confirm one way or the other) though as there has to be a limit of what can be squeezed out of the meagre battery drain from its source

 
 
A few posters on this thread say that the DFR drives the HD600's (300 Ohms) with ease.

 

[SpiderNhan]

Also, the 24/96 limitation is so the Dragonfly can function as a plug 'n play device without the need for additional drivers.

 

[TheEldestBoy]

But I'm wondering how the DFR compares in terms of the AMP?
 
 
HA-2:
300 mW into 16 Ohm
220 mW into 32 Ohm
30 mW into 300 Ohm
 
SHIFT:
230 mW into 16 Ohm
136 mW into 32 Ohm
65 mW into 300 Ohm
 
 
The only spec I see for the DFR AMP is 2.1V.

 

[CactusPete23]

  But I'm wondering how the DFR compares in terms of the AMP?
 
 
HA-2:
300 mW into 16 Ohm
220 mW into 32 Ohm
30 mW into 300 Ohm
 
SHIFT:
230 mW into 16 Ohm
136 mW into 32 Ohm
65 mW into 300 Ohm
 
 
The only spec I see for the DFR AMP is 2.1V.

FYI Not sure how this is calculated...  (probably better to actually measure...)  But From Post # 268...  From Steve Silberman of Audioquest...
 
" How many milliwatts do the DragonFlys output at 600ohm?
DragonFly Red is capable of a peak output of 2.1vac. Into 600ohms, that’s only about 7mW. But most 600-ohm headphones are usually less than that and we can drive these just fine, as well as drive any receiver or integrated amplifier. "
 
I'm sure you could ask him about 300ohm output...  He may even read this post and answer himself.

 

[tekwrx]

The DFB I ordered from Amazon Saturday night just arrived. Love Prime service Only listened for a few minutes so far, but it gets plenty loud out of my LG V10 using UAPP and sounds fantastic with my IEM (Sony XBA-A2), but it is not powerful enough to get as loud as I like for my full size Sony MDR-Z7 (70Ω). I figured that would be the case and it's OK because I have a FiiO E12 I use at home to power them. Now I have 30 days to decide if I should exchange it for the DFR and be able to do away with the E12. We'll see...

 

[TheEldestBoy]

  FYI Not sure how this is calculated...  (probably better to actually measure...)  But From Post # 268...  From Steve Silberman of Audioquest...
 
" How many milliwatts do the DragonFlys output at 600ohm?
DragonFly Red is capable of a peak output of 2.1vac. Into 600ohms, that’s only about 7mW. But most 600-ohm headphones are usually less than that and we can drive these just fine, as well as drive any receiver or integrated amplifier. "
 
I'm sure you could ask him about 300ohm output...  He may even read this post and answer himself.

 
 
Thanks for the info; I'm going to reach-out to Audioquest now with this question.  I'll let you guys know what they say.

 

[Davy Wentzler]

Don't think bubbleupnp is directly integrated with Deezer. Not sure if that's because it's not possible or just that the developers haven't got around to it. Sometimes the particular service don't want to allow it. Spotify for example are reluctant to expose their content except via their own apps and Spotify connect. Google had to make changes to the Chromecast firmware before Spotify would work with them.

 
First of all, glad you guys appreciate the UPnP renderer update of UAPP!
Regarding Deezer, we looked into it (even did some reverse engineering of the code, cough...), but the Deezer API never gives a URL as Tidal and Google Music do. It passes a certain ID to the Deezer app if I remember correctly which also decrypts the stream. So unfortunately, no chance for Deezer in UAPP I think.

 

[waveSounds]

The DFB I ordered from Amazon Saturday night just arrived. Love Prime service

Only listened for a few minutes so far, but it gets plenty loud out of my LG V10 using UAPP and sounds fantastic with my IEM (Sony XBA-A2), but it is not powerful enough to get as loud as I like for my full size Sony MDR-Z7 (70Ω). I figured that would be the case and it's OK because I have a FiiO E12 I use at home to power them. Now I have 30 days to decide if I should exchange it for the DFR and be able to do away with the E12. We'll see...

 
Have you adjusted the 'Hardware Volume' setting within UAPP? It should be able to drive your Z7s easily.
 
Considering returning my Black version. Most of my music is now via Tidal offline and because of Tidal's encryption of offline music I can't listen to it through UAPP and I don't want to stream when I'm out and about because I'd like to have my data allowance to last for more than a day! Tis a shame.
 
"Dear Matt,

Thank you for contacting us. Unfortunately, offline content is encrypted and inaccessible.

Kind regards,

Davy
eXtream Software Development"

 

[tekwrx]

Have you adjusted the 'Hardware Volume' setting within UAPP? It should be able to drive your Z7s easily.

Yeah, I've set the hardware slider to max. Sounds good, but not loud enough. I always like to have a little headroom. My V10 in high impedance mode gets louder. Also tried the DFB with my Windows pc running Foobar2000 and the volume is about the same. Like I said for home listening it's not a deal breaker because I can use the line out to feed the E12. I may just end up exchanging for the red anyway.

 

[TAREKFOUAD1]

I just reinstall the UAPP now the hardware volume work great now it can drive my HE-500 more than enough.

 

[Pedro Dixon]

   
To brent75 the red/mojo have equal sq. For others the mojo rules. Why can't this hobby be objective lol!
 
Having said that, for my desktop I don't really want a battery operated gizmo either.

I have both and agree with many others. Mojo offers more realism and air compared to the Dragonfly Red. I was going to shift one but truth be told they're both so good I cannot bring myself to part with either. Hugo TT for desktop use, Mojo and Dragonfly for my frequent flying/travelling.  
 
Nothing wrong with powering your Mojo either by mains or a battery pack. I carry both with me, should the Mojo and anker battery block lose power I throw the DFR into the chain. Again, the Mojo is better, but YMMV in whether the gains are worthy of the extra cost. Note these findings are with a pair of Senn HD25s and the differences, whilst not night and day by any means but are apparent within a few seconds. What strikes me is how different they are internally, yet sound so similar.