New Beyerdynamic T1 (2nd Generation)
Aug 23, 2018 at 5:09 PM Post #2,671 of 3,911
I cannot imagine that it would suddenly turn into gold on an a20 or something.
You obviously don’t know the T1.2 very well then...
 
Aug 23, 2018 at 7:41 PM Post #2,672 of 3,911
I have had the Beyer T1.2 for 6+ months and drive them either with a Benchmark DAC3 HGC or Oppo HA-1. I also have Senn HD600, HD650, HD700, HD800s (returned), B&W P3, P5, P7w, P9, Oppo PM1, PM3, Shure SRH1840. My sources are TIDAL streaming, Roon, Audrivana Plus 2, Yamaha CD-S1000 CD/SACD player, Marantz CD6005, NAD DVD/SACD player, YBA CD player, Sony DAT A8, Pioneer D-05 DAT high speed recorder. With all of the above DACs and sources my go to headphones are the T1.2. Are they perfect? Of course not but they work the best for me.
 
Aug 28, 2018 at 5:00 PM Post #2,673 of 3,911
I just got my new T1.2 in today. Immediately like the sound of these more than the first T1.2(which I always suspected was a bad pair) I had. Out of the box, this pair is lot darker and bassier than my first pair was and I used them on the same system. Sounds great on the Sony UDA-1.
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Aug 29, 2018 at 1:45 PM Post #2,674 of 3,911
So, I had the T1, 2nd Generation for two weeks now.

What the hell?

I own a ten year old dt990 that sounds WAY better.. The T1 only sounds good and flagship-like on a very selected few kinds of music. Gospel sounds breathtakingly good. Very small jazz ensembles also sound fantasic. As soon as more instruments come into the scene things fall aparat very quickly. Most Beatles-Songs (and not just the bright early ones) are almost unbearable with the T1s. They sound boring, dull, and almost with every song extremely sibliant and overly bright, like a pair of very cheap plasticy cans. Every can I own sounds better, from the DT990ies to the Fidelio X2s to the Grado RS2e.

Yes I know that many of you might love the T1s, and please do not taqke this as an attack on your preferences, but this is my honest opinion. I am very grateful for amazon's policy of letting me return products easily. And I am not the kind of guy who takes advantage of this. I do not order stuff and more stuff just to send it back again. But these cans are so bad I have no choice.

I do not know what happend to german and austrian headphone manufacturers. Okay, Sennheiser is still going strong, allthough I personally never fell in love with their house sound. But Beyerdynamic and AKG really messed up. I also had a pair of AKG K712, and I LOVED how they sounded. Only thing: After two weeks (!) the mini-xlr-connector fell apart. Litereally.

And now this horrible experiance with the T1. Most of the music I listen to (Tidal master, flacs, LPs) is unbearable with these. Most music sounds harsh and distorted even. Only quiet songs with little instrumentation shine. This is not acceptable for a flagship.

And before you ask: No, I did not drive them through an A1 or some other high class DAC: I put them to use on the headphonje jack of my 2.000-Dollar-AVR. And yes, I think that a headphone MUST show it's good side on an expansive Receiver/Amplyfier.

Maybe I got a lemon? Maybe the price Amazon offered was too good to be true (it was 755 Euro). And yeah, maybe I am a baffoon who cannot tell good cans from bad ones. But in my opinion, these are the worst by far that beyerdynamic every made under the tag "flagship".

Hey Bertobo. I tried a later model T1 like back in 2013 and I was using a Crack amp to power them. Now Ive had some very nice set ups but am currently not going balls out like I used to. I liked the sound of the 990DTs as well and compared them up against Senn 650s and preferred the 990s (but this was in part due to pad wear on the 650s which I suspected but did not confirm until just a little while ago). I used to own MDR-R10s with a Cary 300SEI and a Cary 300 SEI F1 edition with the Senn 650s and Grado GS1000s with a WA2 (the Senns too) as just for example along with a host of others like HP-1s, AT L3000 green edition etc... I have heard a good share of TOTL cans with nice setups since the late 90s so I am not just jumping into this...So back to getting the T1 as an "upgrade". My Thoughts pretty much mirror yours to a T. It was like a nutured DT990. Less highs, less dynamics, less bass, perhaps more foreward mids but not necessarily more detailed. I was definitely underwhelmed and sold them off. So you are not alone in your assessments.

I thought the the DT1990s were an improvement and more in line with a successor. The treble can sometimes be harsh for split seconds even on my Crack amp just like the DT990s but in general I think its better on all fronts including the treble, and the vocals are more forward. One of the down sides was that vocals could be dry on more dynamic passages. I thought the Amiron sounded like crap. Like a less resolving T1 or a more bassy AKG 501. Id really like to try the T1.2 but it looks like I might go back to the DT1990 or maybe try the 800S.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 2:21 PM Post #2,675 of 3,911
Hey Bertobo. I tried a later model T1 like back in 2013 and I was using a Crack amp to power them. Now Ive had some very nice set ups but am currently not going balls out like I used to. I liked the sound of the 990DTs as well and compared them up against Senn 650s and preferred the 990s (but this was in part due to pad wear on the 650s which I suspected but did not confirm until just a little while ago). I used to own MDR-R10s with a Cary 300SEI and a Cary 300 SEI F1 edition with the Senn 650s and Grado GS1000s with a WA2 (the Senns too) as just for example along with a host of others like HP-1s, AT L3000 green edition etc... I have heard a good share of TOTL cans with nice setups since the late 90s so I am not just jumping into this...So back to getting the T1 as an "upgrade". My Thoughts pretty much mirror yours to a T. It was like a nutured DT990. Less highs, less dynamics, less bass, perhaps more foreward mids but not necessarily more detailed. I was definitely underwhelmed and sold them off. So you are not alone in your assessments.

I thought the the DT1990s were an improvement and more in line with a successor. The treble can sometimes be harsh for split seconds even on my Crack amp just like the DT990s but in general I think its better on all fronts including the treble, and the vocals are more forward. One of the down sides was that vocals could be dry on more dynamic passages. I thought the Amiron sounded like ****. Like a less resolving T1 or a more bassy AKG 501. Id really like to try the T1.2 but it looks like I might go back to the DT1990 or maybe try the 800S.

Good to know that I am not alone with my assesement of the T1. :)

I heard good things about the HD800S, though I heard a lot of good things about the T1 too. I was considering the AKG K812, but since my experiance with the K712, I do not really trust the AKG quality control. I now bought a pair of Denon AH-D7200 and I am very pleased with them. They are bright, but not unbearable bright like the T1. They have a pretty balanced sound over the whole frequency range and a surprisingly well controlled bass. Yes, those are closed backs, and I usually prefer open back designs, but to my ears, these really shine and deliver far more of the flagship performance I sought after in the T1s. With the T1s, it was like one out of ten songs sounded fantastic and the other nine were "meh" or right out bad. With the Denons, it is reversed. Only one out of ten songs sucks on them.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 3:03 PM Post #2,676 of 3,911
Hey Bertobo. I tried a later model T1 like back in 2013 and I was using a Crack amp to power them. Now Ive had some very nice set ups but am currently not going balls out like I used to. I liked the sound of the 990DTs as well and compared them up against Senn 650s and preferred the 990s (but this was in part due to pad wear on the 650s which I suspected but did not confirm until just a little while ago). I used to own MDR-R10s with a Cary 300SEI and a Cary 300 SEI F1 edition with the Senn 650s and Grado GS1000s with a WA2 (the Senns too) as just for example along with a host of others like HP-1s, AT L3000 green edition etc... I have heard a good share of TOTL cans with nice setups since the late 90s so I am not just jumping into this...So back to getting the T1 as an "upgrade". My Thoughts pretty much mirror yours to a T. It was like a nutured DT990. Less highs, less dynamics, less bass, perhaps more foreward mids but not necessarily more detailed. I was definitely underwhelmed and sold them off. So you are not alone in your assessments.

I thought the the DT1990s were an improvement and more in line with a successor. The treble can sometimes be harsh for split seconds even on my Crack amp just like the DT990s but in general I think its better on all fronts including the treble, and the vocals are more forward. One of the down sides was that vocals could be dry on more dynamic passages. I thought the Amiron sounded like ****. Like a less resolving T1 or a more bassy AKG 501. Id really like to try the T1.2 but it looks like I might go back to the DT1990 or maybe try the 800S.

Honestly I have found the T1's had some inconsistency issues in terms of how they sound, my first T1.2 which was an older one and honestly kinda sucked, relatively thin with a treble haze and excessive brightness that ruined it's transparency. I can tell I got a good one this time around. This one I have now is a different level than other Beyers on my system. It's far more dynamic, solid, 3-dimensional, smoother, and detailed than my DT 990 - 600 Ohm and Amiron. I also found the DT 990 better than the HD 650. If there is one thing that bothers me about Tesla Beyers is I found they can be a bit inconsistent, a drawback of the drivers being assembled by hand I guess. I owned the DT 1990 as well in the past.
 
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Aug 29, 2018 at 3:47 PM Post #2,677 of 3,911
Good to know that I am not alone with my assesement of the T1. :)

I heard good things about the HD800S, though I heard a lot of good things about the T1 too. I was considering the AKG K812, but since my experiance with the K712, I do not really trust the AKG quality control. I now bought a pair of Denon AH-D7200 and I am very pleased with them. They are bright, but not unbearable bright like the T1. They have a pretty balanced sound over the whole frequency range and a surprisingly well controlled bass. Yes, those are closed backs, and I usually prefer open back designs, but to my ears, these really shine and deliver far more of the flagship performance I sought after in the T1s. With the T1s, it was like one out of ten songs sounded fantastic and the other nine were "meh" or right out bad. With the Denons, it is reversed. Only one out of ten songs sucks on them.

Im glad you found something you like. It was hard coming from a very good monitor-sub set up, nothing sounded full and punchy, or ambient; because they just cant.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 3:59 PM Post #2,678 of 3,911
Honestly I have found the T1's had some inconsistency issues in terms of how they sound, my first T1.2 which was an older one and honestly kinda sucked, relatively thin with a treble haze and excessive brightness that ruined it's transparency. I can tell I got a good one this time around. This one I have now is a different level than other Beyers on my system. It's far more dynamic, solid, 3-dimensional, smoother, and detailed than my DT 990 - 600 Ohm and Amiron. I also found the DT 990 better than the HD 650. If there is one thing that bothers me about Tesla Beyers is I found they can be a bit inconsistent, a drawback of the drivers being assembled by hand I guess. I owned the DT 1990 as well in the past.

The inconsistency in sound seems to be a common thing. It would be kind of funny if it all amounted to the 1/4 inch jack not screwed on completely to the 3.5mm base like it was with one of the members above.... Id really like to try, but all those inconsistencies make me want to just go back to the 1990 or suck it up(financially wise) to go to the 800S. I tried the Aeon Flow opens and pretty much all of my dynamic cans I preferred. Save the amiron, they were kind of similar if I think about it, the Aeon had more detail and openness... Similar presentation though. Not easy to drive at all though.... Maybe with a better amp than the IFI nano I had, theyd open up. It is not a bad amp at all, but for those planars not a good match electronically.

i just contacted ZMF to see if they will modify my Eikons and make em Aueturs. If not, then Its either 1990s or Senn 800Ss (and sell the Eikons cause I dont have the disposable income for both...). I have some 58xs to tide me over. They are good enough that I wont miss the Eikons too much if I send em away for a bit. For $150 shipped, thats just freaking amazing.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 4:00 PM Post #2,679 of 3,911
Im glad you found something you like. It was hard coming from a very good monitor-sub set up, nothing sounded full and punchy, or ambient; because they just cant.

Yeah. I run a 4.0-configuration here with the Teufel Definion 5 as fronts and a pair of old Elac Edition Ones as backs. The Teufels (a german company) to me sound a bit like good monitors, very neutral, but with a strong bass foundation, and the Elacs are just like nice old Hifi-Bliss for Surround-SACDs, DVD-Audio or Blurays. The Denons falls in the sound-cathegory I love, which is "Studio Monitors, but slightly warm" (if that makes any sense). The AKG k712 are, in my opinion, also very reminscent to good monitors btw. The T1, 2nd generation is a completely different beast and I'd say it is more for those guys who use a different set of cans for different music, because they only sound good on very few select tracks. I too have and had several phones, but I demand of any headphoine that is more than 100 bucks that it is at least listenable with every music I throw at it. It does not have to be great with every music, but it definately should not suck with a lot of music. And with "a ot of music" I do not mean good or bad quality sources, but different genres.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 4:34 PM Post #2,680 of 3,911
Damn straight, thats my philosophy too. Senn 650s and dt 990s sound good with all sorts of music. So did my MDR-R10s and 1990s. Making it a necessity, not just merely a preference to change headphones for a difference in genre is a no go for me and for you too it seems.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 5:18 PM Post #2,681 of 3,911
The inconsistency in sound seems to be a common thing. It would be kind of funny if it all amounted to the 1/4 inch jack not screwed on completely to the 3.5mm base like it was with one of the members above.... Id really like to try, but all those inconsistencies make me want to just go back to the 1990 or suck it up(financially wise) to go to the 800S. I tried the Aeon Flow opens and pretty much all of my dynamic cans I preferred. Save the amiron, they were kind of similar if I think about it, the Aeon had more detail and openness... Similar presentation though. Not easy to drive at all though.... Maybe with a better amp than the IFI nano I had, theyd open up. It is not a bad amp at all, but for those planars not a good match electronically.

i just contacted ZMF to see if they will modify my Eikons and make em Aueturs. If not, then Its either 1990s or Senn 800Ss (and sell the Eikons cause I dont have the disposable income for both...). I have some 58xs to tide me over. They are good enough that I wont miss the Eikons too much if I send em away for a bit. For $150 shipped, thats just freaking amazing.

It is, I found some inconsistency with the DT 1990's, I owned two, they did sound a bit different and one was very sensitive to amp noise while the other wasn't at all. I tried different cables and 1/4inch adapters on the original T1.2 I had, it had nothing to do with the external cable. Honestly all headphones vary from unit to unit, just some more than others. I personally found the Amiron fantastic, but I have noticed mixed impressions on it.

Damn straight, thats my philosophy too. Senn 650s and dt 990s sound good with all sorts of music. So did my MDR-R10s and 1990s. Making it a necessity, not just merely a preference to change headphones for a difference in genre is a no go for me and for you too it seems.

Honestly I agree, if a headphone doesn't sound good with all genres, then I will get rid of it as I listen to a huge variety of genres and use headphones for video games, shows, etc. It has to be enjoyable in all these aspects for me to keep and enjoy a headphone long term. I never understood the whole listen to this headphone for this genre and that for another. For me different headphones are about having different presentations and experiences and listening to what headphones presentation I am in the mood for.
 
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Aug 29, 2018 at 5:50 PM Post #2,682 of 3,911
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It is, I found some inconsistency with the DT 1990's, I owned two, they did sound a bit different and one was very sensitive to amp noise while the other wasn't at all. I tried different cables and 1/4inch adapters on the original T1.2 I had, it had nothing to do with the external cable. Honestly all headphones vary from unit to unit, just some more than others. I personally found the Amiron fantastic, but I have noticed mixed impressions on it.



Honestly I agree, if a headphone doesn't sound good with all genres, then I will get rid of it as I listen to a huge variety of genres and use headphones for video games, shows, etc. It has to be enjoyable in all these aspects for me to keep and enjoy a headphone long term. I never understood the whole listen to this headphone for this genre and that for another. For me different headphones are about having different presentations and experiences and listening to what headphones presentation I am in the mood for.

The guy who bought the Amiron's from me loved em. I was like.... "well thats excellent!!" I was very glad he liked em and made me think, I guess I just dont like that can! To me it didnt sound like a warmer 1990, it sounded totally different. But yeah maybe coming from speakers, I expect them to perform well in all genres. To me its a no brainer. Yeah sure some might be better at one than the other but not to the extent that it makes everything else sound like dog poo. In a speaker system that simply isnt happening and really isnt necessary because most may sound better at one genre than another but they wont be far off in others. Like you said you just need to tailor it to your preferred presentation.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 6:27 PM Post #2,683 of 3,911
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The guy who bought the Amiron's from me loved em. I was like.... "well thats excellent!!" I was very glad he liked em and made me think, I guess I just dont like that can! To me it didnt sound like a warmer 1990, it sounded totally different. But yeah maybe coming from speakers, I expect them to perform well in all genres. To me its a no brainer. Yeah sure some might be better at one than the other but not to the extent that it makes everything else sound like dog poo. In a speaker system that simply isnt happening and really isnt necessary because most may sound better at one genre than another but they wont be far off in others. Like you said you just need to tailor it to your preferred presentation.

The Amiron is a completely different headphone than the DT 1990. The DT 1990 carries a bit more of the traditional Beyer sound, the Amiron is well different. I did find on high-end system the Amiron did change for the better, the headphone does like nice gear, as does the T1. My experience with dynamic headphones, more power doesn't necessarily mean better sound. Some headphones labeled as notoriously hard to drive such as the K7xx series and the T1.2 are honestly fairly easy to drive, but rather I find them a bit fickle, half the time the best amps for them are not all that powerful on paper. Exactly it's expected different headphones to sound better on different songs, but a headphone shouldn't sound like crap on everything but a select few songs. If a headphone sounds like crap on a lot of stuff, then something is wrong. It needs to be tailored to your preference and it also needs to be the right system for the said headphone, which honestly is easier said than done. I'm just happy this T1.2 seems to be a great match with my system, it sounds like what I expect a flagship headphone should sound like. Though I do find the T1 one of the more controversial headphones, I don't know if it's mainly variance with individual headphones, it's system fickleness, and/or it simply not working for some peoples ears.
 
Aug 29, 2018 at 7:35 PM Post #2,684 of 3,911
Id really like to try, but all those inconsistencies make me want to just go back to the 1990 or suck it up(financially wise) to go to the 800S.

Its either 1990s or Senn 800S

Those are different headphones.
Keep in mind HD800S has less bass and less treble sparkle than T1 (2nd Gen) and it's also drier sounding overall.

Those who find the T1 (2nd Gen) too analytical or even lacking bass tend to prefer DT1990, so you get the idea.

HD800S and DT1990 have a considerably different type of sound.
 
Aug 30, 2018 at 2:14 AM Post #2,685 of 3,911
By your description, It sounds like the T1 is the can I should try versus the HD 800... but I do have a OTL amp and that defiantely makes Senns way more liquid and bloomy. Id imagine thats what it would to with a 800s, and it seems by testimony that is infact what it does according to owners of the 800Ss who pair them with OTL amps. Id consider the Clear, but since I have the Crack, Im figuring Id get better synergy with the higher impedence cans, and on top of that save $$$ not buying another amp.

Hows them k812s?
 

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