[MacDEF]

Quote:

Originally posted by bkelly but I think I have sen an overwheelming amount of unfavorable comment about them around Head-Fio when thye clearly don't seem to merit it.

Brian, where have you seen (and someone else said the same thing) all these unfavorable comments about the V6/7506 on Head-Fi? I ask because I see them being recommended left and right.

As for their sound, I think Kelly's message was probably the best and most succinct summary of them I've seen: they're very good headphones, especially for the money and for things like monitoring. But there are a lot of better headphones that people use when they want to enjoy the music

 

[TobsTec]

Hi there!

Just got my HD-590 on Friday (after cancelling the HD-280Pro order, which was a mistake i guess) and i somehow agree with Eagle_Driver:

The mid-bass is awfully boosted on the HD-590 and also everything above 2KHz is much too present. That means: Exactly the range you get from each cheap crappy set of cans: 250Hz-2KHz is somehow "missing"...

I am quite disappointed, though i´ve tested the HD-590 in the shop before (unfortunately connected to a Bose-System which i bet had an equally worse frequency response) and they sounded pretty decent and neutral.

But now with my stuff at home, connected to my Denon AV-Receiver it´s no real fun at all anymore. You cannot listen to TV or Radio, because the sound is so boomy and muddy and too bright. Only very few CDs in my collection sound ok. So i guess the mid-bass boom you get from every radio or tv station in addition to the HD-590 boom-bost is simply too much.*sigh*

Well... maybe these cans sound better on "cheaper hardware"... So let´s see what happens, when i connect them to my PC at work..

I strongly doubt that the HD-590 are "neutral" sounding, so most probably i´ll have to get some real studio phones for listening at home in addition to the HD-590. But which... the AKGs and Beyerdynamics phones seemed to lack treble and also sounded sort of damped. However thats a different thread.

Cheers
Tobias <-Sitting hear with an bright&muddy 590 and wondering why they sounded so cool in the shop :-?

P.S.: Just made the mad mans test - Connected the 150€ HD-590 to a 5€ radio. Wow thats a decent nice well balanced soundstage.. NO JOKE! Can anybody explain this weired behaviour?

 

[Eagle_Driver]

Quote:

Originally posted by TobsTec Just got my HD-590 on Friday (after cancelling the HD-280Pro order, which was a mistake i guess) and i somehow agree with Eagle_Driver: The mid-bass is awfully boosted on the HD-590 and also everything above 2KHz is much too present. That means: Exactly the range you get from each cheap crappy set of cans: 250Hz-2KHz is somehow "missing"...

I've upgraded from the HD 590 to the HD 600, and the HD 600 totally blows away the HD 590 in terms of coherency. But you REALLY need a decent amp in order to get the most out of the HD 600 - most portable gear and some home components are unable to drive the HD 600 to moderately loud levels.

Quote:

I am quite disappointed, though i´ve tested the HD-590 in the shop before (unfortunately connected to a Bose-System which i bet had an equally worse frequency response) and they sounded pretty decent and neutral. But now with my stuff at home, connected to my Denon AV-Receiver it´s no real fun at all anymore. You cannot listen to TV or Radio, because the sound is so boomy and muddy and too bright. Only very few CDs in my collection sound ok. So i guess the mid-bass boom you get from every radio or tv station in addition to the HD-590 boom-bost is simply too much.*sigh* Well... maybe these cans sound better on "cheaper hardware"... So let´s see what happens, when i connect them to my PC at work..

Blame that on the high output impedance of your A/V receiver's headphone output jack. Sennheiser headphones really perform best from a headphone output with a near-zero-ohm output impedance. (A good solid-state dedicated headphone amplifier should deliver just that, along with a sufficiently high voltage swing to properly drive a good set of headphones - but most portables and many home components just don't have a high enough voltage swing to do justice to the HD 600.) But I am guessing that the output impedance of your Denon A/V receiver's headphone output, as well as virtually all headphone outputs on receivers and integrated amps, is well over 100 ohms - in fact, some have an output impedance of 500 or even 1000 ohms!

And all that is because the headphone output jack on receivers and most integrated amps is run directly off of the very same internal amp used to drive loudspeakers, and is filtered by a few cheap resistors and capacitors.

By the way, it really sucks to have the HD 590 headphone's impedance (120 ohms) being lower than that of the headphone output jack (roughly 200 to 300 ohms, on average). It should be the other way around in order to sound decent - and the lower the jack impedance is relative to the headphone's impedance, the better.

Quote:

I strongly doubt that the HD-590 are "neutral" sounding, so most probably i´ll have to get some real studio phones for listening at home in addition to the HD-590. But which... the AKGs and Beyerdynamics phones seemed to lack treble and also sounded sort of damped. However thats a different thread.

Keep trying.

Cheers!

Randy

 

[TobsTec]

Hi Eagle_Driver...

Thanks for your feedback. I guess you are right. There could be really an impedance problem with the Denon. (I looked in the manual, and the do not even mention the headphone output there.. so i expect the worst).

Looks as if it´s time to build a decent headphone amplifier for the HD-590 and for whichever headphone comes afterwards.

I found several projects on HeadWize. Does anybody here have a favourite design for low-impedance cans?

Cheers
Tobias

 

[bkelly]

I think what may be happening when you compare the headphones you bought to the ones in the store is that the demo is broken in more than yours, (quite a bit more I suspect). If you have read around on Head-Fi you will read that most 590 owners think that upgrading their cable to the Equinox made a significant difference in these phones.

Eagle-Driver may aslo be right in that even a decent manufacturer like Denon is not taking the headhone section of their recievers seriously. In fact, to them it is probably nothing more than a sales plus and certainly not a real amp.







Best
Brian

 

[bifcake]

I agree. I have the Denon AVR-5700 receiver and there is a night and day difference between the receiver's headphone output and Creek's OBH-11 headphone amp. There is no comparison.

 

[TobsTec]

Hi Guys...

Yep, it was the crappy Denon headphone output.. On my PC at work the HD-590 is connected to small harman/kardon speakers and now the headphones sound much much much better. The treble is still a bit crystal crisp... and the bass slightly too strong, but for just for fun listening it´s 100% ok. It´s a change like day and night...

So i really should consider building a headphone amp for the Denon. Maybe this META42 thingy...

Cheers
Tobias

 

[PinkFloyd]

 

[wallijonn]

Eagle_Driver,

I think that you may be under the wrong impression. Almost all receivers made in the past 10 years probably do not connect the headphone output to the amp section. What they usually connect to are 2 cent op amps.

In my own case I find a world of difference between my Technics SUV96 integrated amp and my Denon 810 CD headphone jack. With my DT931 the Technics has a better bass presence but also a brighter and harsher highend. On the Denon it sounds more natural and a lot of the high end harshness disappears.

If you really need to compare the sound on an integrated amp, just get a $2 1/4" stereo jack from Radio Shack, solder 4 wires and connect it directly to the speaker output terminals (house in a cardboard or wooden box). You should perceive a difference in sound. I think that the resistors were originally added in case someone plugs in a headphone without first turning down the volume, as many of the old vintage gear didn't output more than 30 watts, and many of the old headphones were driving 600 ohms.

 

[PinkFloyd]

Baaaahhhhhhhhhh! Baaaaaaahhhhhhh!

Sorry, I just felt the urge to make sheep like sounds

Pinkie

 

[bifcake]

Quote:

Originally posted by PinkFloyd Baaaahhhhhhhhhh! Baaaaaaahhhhhhh! Sorry, I just felt the urge to make sheep like sounds Pinkie

Why do Scottsmen wear kilts?


Because sheep can hear zippers!

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

Originally posted by TobsTec The mid-bass is awfully boosted on the HD-590 and also everything above 2KHz is much too present

You need to run them in good, and those drivers need to be flexed. After this is done, the hump goes down and the lower treble is smoothed out and the HD590 becomes a bit more transparent. I'm giving this phone a fair shot. It's so light and comfortable and I feel compelled to give them a chance and play ball with them.

 

[Jasper994]

I'm gonna have to support Bkelly's opinion, I recently got a pair of 590's and I think they are great. I can't for the life of me understand what everybody is complaining about as far as them being overly bright. They are detailed, but the only time the trebles become to much is when they have been overboosted on the recording. One thing I should mention though is that they definately sounded brighter in the store, so maybe it depends on how they are driven. I currently have mine hooked to the headphone jack of an Audigy Platinum ex, and they sound very very good . I also listened to the 580's at the store, and wasn't impressed, they they were bassy, and the detail was okay, but they weren't very comfortable. Something to note though is that like music, food, and cars, which headphones are best is very subjective. Everyone will like something different, and while some things are distinctively in a better class than some other things, which thing is the best can only be determined by the individual that has to listen to it, eat it, drive it or hear it.

 

[Prizm]

I, too, also love my 590s. As I have stated before, when I first got my pair, they were a little bright - but after breaking them in the extra brightness went away and they sound excellent.

And they are *outstanding* for movies.

Prizm