Need HELP on DAC between Soundcard and DIY Dac !

[donjiva]

Hi guys! newbie here, before asking some question, this is my listening habit:

1. Music playback is my highest priority. [game and movie aren't that important].
2. I always listened in FLAC with my computer [not laptop]
3. Right now my soundcard is a realtek 7.1 build-in to the motherboard [very very bad crap]
4. RIght now I am listening using grado sr80, but maybe in the future I will buy a pair of A5 Audioengine, still not sure.
5. My budget for DAC is around 100-200$. If I am not satisfied with DAC only then maybe I will buy amp like PPAv2 in the future

I have been doing a lot of research about DAC recently, and I can not decide which one I should buy.

So my questions are :

1. between EMU-0404-usb and EMU-0404-PCI > Is the usb much better since it is outside the case?
2. between the M-audio/esi Juli/EMU0404/Omega Claro and all the DIY dac that is listed B]here[/B] for around 100-200$, which one is better ? I do not mind building it by myself if it has much better sound quality than those soundcard for that price range
3. How about soundcard like Auzentech Prelude and Asus Xonar d2/d2x? Are they better than EMU/Esi Juli/Omega Claro for music playback? Or external DIY DAC are better since it is outside the case?

Thanks! Hope somebody reply soon!

 

[Nocturnal310]

EMU 0404 USB is for professionals or people who carry a laptop.

if u are using a desktop then get PCI.

PCI is little better also for performance.

 

[donjiva]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nocturnal310 /img/forum/go_quote.gif EMU 0404 USB is for professionals or people who carry a laptop. if u are using a desktop then get PCI. PCI is little better also for performance.

So in term of quality output both of them is the same? isn't external is better in sound quality? because i read that internal soundcard has a lot of interference from the computer hardware.

You said PCI has better performance, is it for gaming? My priority is music playback. I have 4gb RAM and pentium core2duo overclocked to 3.8ghz

and how about my other question? thanks!!

 

[Hookem]

Since you are listening to FLAC's with Grado cans you would be much better served to buy something like the Fubar III.

Fubar III USB DAC / Headphone Amplifier - USB DAC - Headphone Amp - USB Audio - Headphone Amplifier

It cost about 240 shipped but would serve your purpose much better than any "computer" PCI sound card.

Very versitile...Has a headphone amp and should you decide to get the A5's you are in like flint...The only thing you will need is a mini to RCA interconnect.

You are right the USB/DAC-Headphone amp is going to blow just about any computer soundcard in the weeds when it comes to high quality sound for music.

There are several other products that fit you needs...But for you application for sure by an external device.

Being able to roll the opamp is another huge plus in my humble opinion.

 

[donjiva]

yes the product fits all my need perfectly!

I read that Fubar III already has an Headphone Amp, how is the quality of the amp? Is separate DAC and Amp better?

My original plan was to buy 100-200$ DAC and then if I am not satisfied with the sound I will buy another 100-200$ Amplifier.

I'm kinda confused, which is more important? DAC or Amplifier ? if you buy a 100$ DAC and 300$ amplifier or the other way around, which has better sound?

Thanks for the reply !

Quote:

Being able to roll the opamp is another huge plus in my humble opinion.

sorry i am a newbie, what do u mean by being able to roll the opamp?

 

[Hookem]

"I'm kinda confused, which is more important? DAC or Amplifier ? if you buy a 100$ DAC and 300$ amplifier or the other way around, which has better sound?"

Well if you look at the Fubar II...It is just a USB/DAC...It provides high quality sound with RCA's as being the output...Great for computer as source use with powered or "active" speakers like the Audioengine A5's.

It runs about 150 shipped

Same company makes the Cute headphone amp...It is about 180 shipped.

The Fubar III is like both of those seperate components combined into one unit.

The Fubar III does bust your budget by about 40 duckies...But in that price range it gives you a lot of bang for the buck.

There are some other intresting USB/DAC Headphone Amp solutions out there...The Fubar III is just one of the easier solutions as far as connectivity.

I will look through some other threads...I am new to all this stuff also and have been experimenting with anything I can get my hands on.

I have a pair of Audioengine A5's and Grado 80's...Onboard sound is horrible...Tried probably no less than 10 pci sound cards...They all sound not so good with the Grado's and the sound coming out of the A5's is all over the place.

I came from the Creative, M-Audio, Chaintech, Klipsch, Logitech world of computer sound before I got hipped to HeadFi.

Had all my CD's ripped as 192kbs WMA's using Windows XP Media Edition...Found out right quick that even 320kbs MP3's made a huge difference in sound quality...I started ripping everything as FLAC's.

Now I have decided to rip everything as WAV's...Hard drives are cheap and I love Windows Media Player 11...Works seamlessly with my OS...Throw in the Microsoft Remote Control and it is pretty much a no brainer for what I want.

The Audiotrak Prodigy HD2 is an intresting pci solution...Only cost about 85 bucks...Has a headphone amp...Has a nice DAC and you can roll the opamps.

Hard as hell to get...I have been trying to get one for a couple of months from Florida Music...They have 40 coming in mid-July...I have had mine ordered since around the 20th of May.

Audiotrak Prodigy HD2 -*High-End 192 kHz Reference HiFi Audio Interface for audiophiles and music enthusiasts.

BadAssBob has one for sale in the classified's with a bunch of opamps.

But for your application...USB/DAC with a Headphone AMP is the only way to fly.

In my humble opinion anyway.

 

[Hookem]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donjiva /img/forum/go_quote.gif sorry i am a newbie, what do u mean by being able to roll the opamp?

WARNING !!!!! I don't even have the Audiotrak HD2 yet...But I have already purchased 24 opamps...So unless you want to hang out with Amy in rehab...Dont even look at this thread...LOL...Just kidding.

Here is a thread that talk's about rolling opamps on the Audiotrak Prodigy HD2...What rolling the opamps does is allow you to change how the HD2 sounds...You can taylor the card to your ears and speakers...Nice feature...I am buying the HD2 just so I can go through opamp rolling addiction business...I am a buy it, try it, sell it, kinda guy.

Way cool pci sound card...I like modding my computer stuff...And the HD2 gives you plenty to play with...Roll the opamps and change the capacitors out...So a great card for the mod squad.

But for your reading pleasure...Drum roll please...Fire works go off...Here you go !!!!!

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/au...s-list-322497/

 

[Hookem]

Another intresting product...There is a inexpensive external power supply that helps sound quality by not powering the unit via the USB port.

USB Audio Converter Description

USB Audio Converter Features

TA-10 Specifications

Here is a review...Nice piece...Trends Audio makes a T-Amp that is bad to the bone...So this should be a great sounding piece and it is much less expensive than the Fubar III...Only draw back is connectivity...Or ease there of I should say.

Trends Audio UD-10 USB audio converter review - [English]

Check out this site...They sell T-Amps, USB/DAC's and the such...So reading through their product descriptions will give you a little insight into what is going on in the external computer as source world.

Product Catalog

 

[donjiva]

thanks for all the information !!

very very helpful and informative

well it seems that we have a similar path in the entrance to the hifi world haha, I was in the klipsch promedia logitech creative etc world and I hate their sound, but I did not know anything about the audiophile world.
And then when I do a research on headphone I decide to buy grado sr80 [after comparing it to hd595] and voila.. I'm addicted to the sound now haha

I love it for rock music.. hendrix..pink floyd.. metallica etc but I want more! that's why i'm trying to find DAC and amp now because I'm having a lot of sibilance and small distortion in my playback.

Right now I'm hearing my music with IPOD because I could not stand my build-in soundcard. So I need to transfer my flac file to my ipod everytime i want to hear music because the file is hella big [my ipod is 95% full with mp3]

Well I think I'll buy Fubar III, it's a good deal for dac and amp. thanks for the recommendation!

out of curiosity, which one will sound better ? the fully modded hd2 or fubar III? and how is the A5 sound? are you using it with fubar III right now?

 

[donjiva]

ok i'm reading about the ta-10 now

 

[Hookem]

I really like the Trends Audio...Only thing is no volume control and having to go coaxil to mini out to the A5's...Or coaxil to RCA to mini...I really do not know about hooking up the A5's which are mini input.

You can go from the headphone out to mini to get to the A5's...But that would require unplugging and plugging in either the A5's or Grado's.

I love my Audioengine 5's...Have them paired with a Velodyne DX10 subwoofer.

Throw in Electric Ladyland...Wheel on over to Voodo Child...Long version.

WOW !!!!!! If you like Hendrix (nobody on the planet has even approached his stuff in my opinion) It will just throw you back...Absolutley amazing...When Steve Winwood starts cranking on that B3 Hammond with the Leslie box's...WHEW !!!!

I'M TELLING YOU !!!!! If that dont raise hair on the back of your neck and send chill bumbs all over your body.

Dont bother calling 911...Your dead.

And Audioengine is easily the best online vendor I have ever dealt with...30 day test drive...The owners actually answer the phone.

As far as customer service...Second place is way...And I mean way back there...5 stars...No doubt.

I am still debating on which USB/DAC I want...I am leaning hard towards the Fubar III...Just ease of connectivty...RCA to mini...Headphone Amp and volume control...Hard to beat.

Since I am not going to be able to get the Audiotrak for another month, I will be buying a USB/DAC slash HeadPhone Amp.

Just gotta figure out which one...The options are almost mind boggling.

I will make another post with some other options as soon as I can.

And I know what you mean about the Klipsch, Creative thing...I can never go back that is for sure.

 

[donjiva]

hmm do u know the difference in sound quality between fubar 3 and ta-10 ? the price difference is quite a lot 90$ and 220$. Well I guess if the sound quality is the same maybe I'll buy ta-10 although there's the connectivity issue.

Yes i'm looking forward to hearing my music in grado with these dac/amp haha maybe in the future with the A5. hopefully i'm not dead like u said

 

[Hookem]

Nahhh...You will not be dead.

I am fixing to sell the A5's.

Going to buy some Mackie MR5's and give them a couple spins around the block.

http://http://www.musiciansfriend.co...tor?sku=603999

Keep the MR5's for a couple of months and sell them.

Buy a T-Amp to pair with some really nice Polk Audio bookshelf speakers I have sitting in a closet.

I was thinking of just buying the Fubar II to pair with the A5's and then the MR5's and get a Cute Beyond for the Grado's...I would probably actually use them if I had a decent source.

But it is a bunch cheaper to just buy the Fubar III versus buying the II and Cute seperately.

 

[Hookem]

This guy just bought a Fubar III.

http://http://www.head-fi.org/forums...ne-amp-335079/

He certainly seem's impressed.

So what kind of cooling do you have on your E8400 (just a guess) 3 to 3.8 is a nice clock if that is what you have.

 

[Hookem]

Another choice you might consider is the EMU-0202.

It is only 100 duckies.

http://http://www.emu.com/products/p...&product=15186

I am still trying to find how it stacks up against something like the Fubar III

Appears to do everything the Fubar III will and a whole bunch more.

I am trying to find high quality sound, computer as source solutions for computer builds.

Trying to stay in a certain price range...That and actually having experience with what I am recommending.

One of the reasons I buy, try and sell so many computer components.

I will probably post a thread asking about the pro's and con's of the EMU-0202 and Fubar III.

Really trying to keep it simple...So ease of connectivity is really important.

That and of course the sound quality.

That reminds me...Off to go check Guitar Center's here in Houston to see if they have the Mackie MR5's instock.

Hopefully they seem to sound better than the A5's...Kinda hard to tell until you get them side by side in the same enviroment.

If they MR5's beat the A5's that will be saying something.

I like all the options afforded by the EMU-0202...But might be a little bit much for some of my clients.

Gotta love the price compared to the Fubar III.