Myth: HDCD Discs Sound Better Even in a Regular CD Player?

[AdamCalifornia]

Counter Example: I've got an HDCD-encoded CD which sounds
bad on my non-HDCD Pioneer DV-578A-S dvd/cd player.
Johny Cash: Platinum Collection, Prime 1975. From the booklet:
"... HDCD-encoded CDs simply sound better, even in a regular CD player!"

Also the Microsoft site 'hdcd.com' states:

"HDCD overcomes the limitation of the 16-bit CD format by using a sophisticated system to encode the additional 4 bits onto the CD while remaining completely compatible with the existing CD format.
....
HDCD-encoded recordings sound better on all digital player products ..."

The above statements regarding the 'compatiblity' are not true!

First, I've found the following in the manual of the Panasonic DVD-F87 dvd/cd player (which I returned after 20 days, last year for a full refund):

"The unit is compatible with HDCD, but does not support the Peak Extended function. (A function which expands the dynamic range of high level signals)
HDCD-encoded CDs sound better because they are encoded with 20 bits,
as compared with 16 bits for all other CDs."

At least Panasonic is honest and says implicitly that F87 is not fully compatible with HDCD-encoded discs.

Second, I've found the explanation of this incompatiblity in
the book by Bob Katz, 'Mastering Audio. The Art and Science', 2002:

"HDCD - High Definition Compatible Digital
...When an HDCD DAC is not used, the sound quality is reduced to that
of a standard CD. However, if the mastering engineer manipulates
some extra features of the HDCD system, known as peak extension and low level,
then the music sounds compressed on a standard CD player and can
only properly reproduced (without compression) on an HDCD palyer/DAC.
Despite its name, HDCD, if manipulated aggressively, is not compatible with regular playback."

I've got also HDCD-encoded CDs by Roxy Music 'Avalon', 'The Best of Roxy Music'
and 'The Best of Jethro Tull' and they sound fabulously on my universal non-HDCD Pioneer cd/dvd player.

See you on the HDCD

Side of the Mnon

Adam

 

[applebook]

Thanks for posting something both relevant and informative

 

[rocktboy]

what I have found is that there ISN'T a HDCD encoded disk that I think sounds bad...

it has to do with the quality of the recording itself. If the recording label/engineer even bothered to use HDCD encoding then they definitely pay good attention to other parts of the recording process.

 

[Canman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocktboy what I have found is that there ISN'T a HDCD encoded disk that I think sounds bad... it has to do with the quality of the recording itself. If the recording label/engineer even bothered to use HDCD encoding then they definitely pay good attention to other parts of the recording process.

Absolutely. All of the HDCD recordings I have were mastered very well and sound excellent on any CD player.

 

[jpr703]

A lot of HDCDs aren't even marked. After I bought a HDCD player, I noticed that several of the discs that I had really enjoyed for their sound quality were causing the HDCD light to come on. They sounded even better in true HDCD, but they were still darn good on my old non HDCD equipment.

 

[drarthurwells]

I think my HDCD CDs sound better on my E5 than regular ones in general.

In one case I upgraded a recent non-HDCD version of Mike Oldfield's Amarok with the HDCD version and the HDCD version sounds better in subtle ways.

Could have been remastering differences other than HDCD however.

 

[AdamCalifornia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamCalifornia " ...Despite its name, HDCD, if manipulated aggressively, is not compatible with regular playback."

This is the point I tried to make in my post.

Yes, it could be that this particular HDCD-encoded cd was badly mastered
(nothing to do with the HDCD encoding) yielding bad sound.
But on the other hand, the bad sound could be caused by
'aggressive manipulation of some extra information' HDCD-encoded on the disc
by a mastering engineer. If, someone has this particlar HDCD cd and could play it
on a fully compatible HDCD player (not like the Panasonic F87, displaying HDCD logo,
which is not fully compatible) then, and only then, we would know for sure!
I don't have an HDCD compatible player.

See you at the Winter Olympic Games

in Torino, Italy

Adam

 

[Jahn]

I only hae one HDCD - Dire Straits' Greatest Hits. And it sounds amazing! On my Computer!

 

[Ferbose]

Bob Katz also stated, in his book, that Pacific Microsonics' HDCD system has a superb A/D converter. That explains a lot.

 

[Garbz]

Adam you could verify this yourself. Windows Media Player 9 is fully compatible with HDCD when used with a modern soundcard.

 

[Tachikoma]

Quote:

Adam you could verify this yourself. Windows Media Player 9 is fully compatible with HDCD when used with a modern soundcard.

Does WMP9 play HDCDs at 20 bits like a "true" HDCD player, or is it simply "compatible"? If yes, can foobar2k do the same?

 

[gloco]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canman Absolutely. All of the HDCD recordings I have were mastered very well and sound excellent on any CD player.

Yep, my ears have noticed the same thing.

 

[FalconP]

Is it possible to do an A/B using windows media player 9 (by turning HDCD encoding on and off?). I won't be able to do it on my machine: my PC speakers suck.

As for bad HDCDs: some HDCD-encoded Hong Kong pop music do sound bad, but this has more to do with recording than from mastering.

 

[NightWoundsTime]

Yes WMP is truly compatible. Also an interesting fact is that a WAV ripped in EAC will still have the extra info for WMP to read as an HDCD. Foobar does not support HDCD since it's a proprietary liscened type thing, until someone hacks the code on WMP that is

.

 

[Druid Healer]

Quote:

Is it possible to do an A/B using windows media player 9 (by turning HDCD encoding on and off?). I won't be able to do it on my machine: my PC speakers suck. As for bad HDCDs: some HDCD-encoded Hong Kong pop music do sound bad, but this has more to do with recording than from mastering

It might be because a lot of the "HDCD" stuff in HK is fake.