[scytheavatar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Seems like a lot of the neutral people think bright and thin = neutral and accurate.

So in another words dark, slow and veiled = neutral and accurate?

 

[saintalfonzo]

it all depends on what you're listening to. I can't think of too many live performances I've seen where the horns had less "weight" than the kick drum though.

 

[rds]

oh no, here it comes

 

[olblueyez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Its kinda like a cop said to me in the hospital after getting drunk and flipping a car upside down. "There is nothing I can do to you that you haven't done to yourself". The deal is they both have short comings but the 650 has problems that are very easily over come with a little patience and trial and error. I don't believe the 701 will ever scale as well as the 650. Anyone saying voices and piano are more natural on the 701 has never heard the 650 surrounded by the proper equipment. Anyone who has would never make a statement like that. I was thinking today that its strange how most people fit into two categories, "I want neutral, accurate headphones" and "I want headphones I can enjoy". Seems like a lot of the neutral people think bright and thin = neutral and accurate. I can hear the silverware tapping the plates in front of Frank when he plays live at the Sands. I'm not missing any detail, I also have proper amounts of impact associated with each instrument unlike the 701's where a voice or horn has more weight than a kick drum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by scytheavatar /img/forum/go_quote.gif So in another words dark, slow and veiled = neutral and accurate?

Who said anything about dark, slow and veiled?. Those are words you picked up on the internet for describing the 650. Some people swap headphones and amps endlessly looking for synergy, some people experiment with cables and tubes untill it all comes together. Which are you?

Quote:

Being lean and "distant-sounding" is part of the magic of the K701.

Being lean and "distant-sounding" is natural? Or, neutral?

 

[olblueyez]

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/gre...0/#post5803591

 

[brokensound]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rds /img/forum/go_quote.gif oh no, here it comes

Lets be honest. Neither of these headphones sound "natural". I've gone to plenty of concerts. If it's a large concert, the sound is dependent on the amps, speakers, venue, et al... In this case, loud speakers would sound most natural.

However, if we're in a small venue or in a buddy's house, where they play an acoustic guitar, piano, or any other instrument without amps driving speakers, I will give the nod to the k701. And yes, I do understand listening to a drum set live will always have more impact than the k701, but all the details are still there. The hd650 has recessed vocals on certain tracks that makes me disenchanted, even though I enjoy its silky smoothness.

As a frame for reference, I'm currently using an OMZ -> Darkvoice 332 -> hd650/k701

 

[olblueyez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brokensound /img/forum/go_quote.gif Lets be honest. Neither of these headphones sound "natural". I've gone to plenty of concerts. If it's a large concert, the sound is dependent on the amps, speakers, venue, et al... In this case, loud speakers would sound most natural. However, if we're in a small venue or in a buddy's house, where they play an acoustic guitar, piano, or any other instrument without amps driving speakers, I will give the nod to the k701. And yes, I do understand listening to a drum set live will always have more impact than the k701, but all the details are still there. The hd650 has recessed vocals on certain tracks that makes me disenchanted, even though I enjoy its silky smoothness. As a frame for reference, I'm currently using an OMZ -> Darkvoice 332 -> hd650/k701

Slap an equinox cable on those 650's, the veil will disappear and the bass will tighten up for you.

 

[Berlioz]

I'd have to agree with olblueeyes there. I haven't spent a ton of time with either of the cans, but the HD650 struck me as much more natural.

Maybe I just find the laid back sound of the HD650's to be more natural, but the soundstaging on the K701's just seems too contrived. Also, the K701 just seems too distant for me. I really liked their neutrality the first time I heard them, and while it's probably a very good buy for classical, I found it to just totally suck the life out of jazz music.

The HD650's put a little too much emphasis on the bass end of things, but they have an impact, which is nice. In real life, you get a bass impact (if you've got good seats). We all know the same story, too much and it just sounds bloated, however, I think a small impact helps add to the immersion experience.

 

[saintalfonzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/gre...0/#post5803591

What's the difference between these 2 threads? I guess you emphasized "proper amping" in one, but other than that what is the difference?

 

[brokensound]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Slap an equinox cable on those 650's, the veil will disappear and the bass will tighten up for you.

In that case, we should re-cable the k701 too? Then the question becomes of budget and how far each will scale.

 

[olblueyez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by saintalfonzo /img/forum/go_quote.gif What's the difference between these 2 threads? I guess you emphasized "proper amping" in one, but other than that what is the difference?

I think its pretty self explanatory.

 

[olblueyez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brokensound /img/forum/go_quote.gif In that case, we should re-cable the k701 too? Then the question becomes of budget and how far each will scale.

I wonder if a recable will fix the lack of impact and shift the mids down lower where they belong? Seems like a tall order for a cable. It wouldnt hurt, that is for sure.

 

[saintalfonzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think its pretty self explanatory.

Sorry, I thought that "life-like" and "natural" were the same thing.

 

[rds]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brokensound /img/forum/go_quote.gif Lets be honest. Neither of these headphones sound "natural". I've gone to plenty of concerts. If it's a large concert, the sound is dependent on the amps, speakers, venue, et al... In this case, loud speakers would sound most natural. However, if we're in a small venue or in a buddy's house, where they play an acoustic guitar, piano, or any other instrument without amps driving speakers, I will give the nod to the k701. And yes, I do understand listening to a drum set live will always have more impact than the k701, but all the details are still there. The hd650 has recessed vocals on certain tracks that makes me disenchanted, even though I enjoy its silky smoothness. As a frame for reference, I'm currently using an OMZ -> Darkvoice 332 -> hd650/k701

Being able to sound like a PA system is not natural, it's just being able to sound like a PA system.

I think the only really way to measure naturalness is in reproducing un-amplified sound.

 

[scytheavatar]

Wait, so what you are implying is that you can fix the issues of the HD650 with recabling/changing your source and you can't with the K701? Despite the fact that there's plenty of good, warm amps, both tube and solid state, that pairs well with the K701? Some at a very affordable price?

This is the biggest load of BS I have ever seen on head-fi. I'll tell you what I thinl about the HD650: it's a downgrade from the HD600. I am not the only one with that opinion. But you don't see me go around creating topics slamming the HD650.