[DrpsDrpr]

What throws me off about the Elex neutrality is the dynamics. I think if the Elex had a smaller dynamic range, it would indeed sound very much neutral as we expect or at least gather a more unified following of it's neutrality. The dynamic presentation was the hardest thing to adjust to with this headphone and sometimes I feel it's as much a strong point as a weak point. I wouldn't change it, it's just what was first apparent the first time I listened to my pair.

My sentiments exactly- you wouldn’t necessarily want to mix/master on these because the presentation is so dynamic and distinct to the Elex, even though the frequency range is well-balanced and neutral on the whole.

 

[BrokeSkoolBoi]

It definitely throws me off a bit too, along with the dramatic imaging/staging. Lack of unity may be good way to describe it. I just want to hear music presented to me in full without having the headphone performing acrobatics while I'm listening, for most of my modest library the effect is lost on me anyway.

Also the vocal mix just makes me wish I was listening to the 6xx. Vocals are so close to being at the center of the mix but they seem to originate from behind me a lot of the time like a constant tease. The Elex also have a lot of air but don't capitalize on the clarity for me in a way that I feel hd650 does (though I like the hd600 because it's slightly less biased to vocals and bass). If the Elex were more concerned with being more subtle and inviting VS demanding with their clarity I would appreciate them more.

 

[gLer]

It definitely throws me off a bit too, along with the dramatic imaging/staging. Lack of unity may be good way to describe it. I just want to hear music presented to me in full without having the headphone performing acrobatics while I'm listening, for most of my modest library the effect is lost on me anyway.

Also the vocal mix just makes me wish I was listening to the 6xx. Vocals are so close to being at the center of the mix but they seem to originate from behind me a lot of the time like a constant tease. The Elex also have a lot of air but don't capitalize on the clarity for me in a way that I feel hd650 does (though I like the hd600 because it's slightly less biased to vocals and bass). If the Elex were more concerned with being more subtle and inviting VS demanding with their clarity I would appreciate them more.

Some people just prefer the safe, inoffensive sound of the 6XX series, and there's nothing wrong with that, especially given the current prices of the now vintage Sennheisers. For me the Elex is a significant upgrade on the Sennheisers in every possible way, making my music more engaging, enjoyable and dynamic. Older recordings have never sounded so good. For a more 'laid back' listen with even more musicality I put on my Auteurs, which are again a massive step up from the Sennheisers in every way. Just my opinion, of course, and naturally the price paid for these 'improvements' is appreciably higher.

 

[DrpsDrpr]

It definitely throws me off a bit too, along with the dramatic imaging/staging. Lack of unity may be good way to describe it. I just want to hear music presented to me in full without having the headphone performing acrobatics while I'm listening, for most of my modest library the effect is lost on me anyway.

Also the vocal mix just makes me wish I was listening to the 6xx. Vocals are so close to being at the center of the mix but they seem to originate from behind me a lot of the time like a constant tease. The Elex also have a lot of air but don't capitalize on the clarity for me in a way that I feel hd650 does (though I like the hd600 because it's slightly less biased to vocals and bass). If the Elex were more concerned with being more subtle and inviting VS demanding with their clarity I would appreciate them more.

I think the Elex has its own unique place in the sub-$1k lineup and really encourages a more active listening experience than most other headphones in that range. It’s definitely not what I’m reaching for if I’m looking for subtlety because it plays into its presentation so flagrantly. I find its dynamics pretty engaging to a point, but also somewhat inauthentic to musical representation at the end of the day (at least my own perspective of how I best enjoy music representation, anyway). It could never be my daily driver or “one headphone,” but if I had a larger collection I’d certainly keep it around because it doesn’t sound like much else in the range.

I agree with you about the vocals, as well, and the general assessment of preferring the Sennheisers, though.

 

[BrokeSkoolBoi]

I think the Elex has its own unique place in the sub-$1k lineup and really encourages a more active listening experience than most other headphones in that range. It’s definitely not what I’m reaching for if I’m looking for subtlety because it plays into its presentation so flagrantly. I find its dynamics pretty engaging to a point, but also somewhat inauthentic to musical representation at the end of the day (at least my own perspective of how I best enjoy music representation, anyway). It could never be my daily driver or “one headphone,” but if I had a larger collection I’d certainly keep it around because it doesn’t sound like much else in the range.

I agree with you about the vocals, as well, and the general assessment of preferring the Sennheisers, though.

Inauthentic is what comes to mind for me for me as well, but that isn't always a bad thing. It leaves me feeling kind of strange though, it is engaging, but it's also dictating what is exciting about my music at the same time. The clarity and airiness keep me coming back to it for now.

 

[DrpsDrpr]

Inauthentic is what comes to mind for me for me as well, but that isn't always a bad thing. It leaves me feeling kind of strange though, it is engaging, but it's also dictating what is exciting about my music at the same time.

Yes, that’s actually pretty spot on. It’s not a natural sound, nor is it trying to be, but that’s why it’s interesting and different to listen to.

 

[antdroid]

To me, they sound like how a loudspeaker generates sound, which to me, is more natural. To me, it's taking advantage of the full dynamic range of recorded material to make it sound more live. This is most evident in tracks that aren't as affected by loudness wars.

 

[CoFire]

It definitely throws me off a bit too, along with the dramatic imaging/staging. Lack of unity may be good way to describe it. I just want to hear music presented to me in full without having the headphone performing acrobatics while I'm listening, for most of my modest library the effect is lost on me anyway.

Also the vocal mix just makes me wish I was listening to the 6xx. Vocals are so close to being at the center of the mix but they seem to originate from behind me a lot of the time like a constant tease. The Elex also have a lot of air but don't capitalize on the clarity for me in a way that I feel hd650 does (though I like the hd600 because it's slightly less biased to vocals and bass). If the Elex were more concerned with being more subtle and inviting VS demanding with their clarity I would appreciate them more.

The Elex is a keeper because of it demanding attention to music. I think it's dynamic presence is even more present than the Clear. I need to review my notes but from memory, I think this is accurate. @phthora can you comment? On the other hand, I think the Elear over did this and of course to me has other issues with coherence.

In any case, if I want listen to music in the background while multitasking, the Elex is about near the last headphone I'd get for this (unless I'm feeling like I want a challenge). The Nighthawks, HD6XX, even my 400i make for a less distracting but fulfilling background.

I think the 400i and HEX V2 are especially good at background duty because they have enough detail and dynamic range to keep me happy yet aren't entirely distracting. The Elex has this quality of dynamics coupled with attack and impact with weight that makes you listen. The planar sound has the dynamic range and attack but I feel lacks the impact and weight the Elex and Focal in general brings. In fact, I can't think of any planars that have such weight (Ether 2, HE560, HE400i, HE4XX, EL8, LCD2, LCDX, Sine are what I've heard).

It's amazing how subtleties in driver design/technology can make seemingly small changes to sound to make a larger change when listening to that change over an entire FR. Focal headphones I feel follow their speaker house sound. If you haven't heard high end Focal speakers, upon first listen, what drew my attention is the attack, impact and weight of each note across the frequency spectrum. Even vocals come across this way, perhaps even more so. Oddly, for floor standing speakers, I prefer planars as well for their imaging, attack and decay but the Focals are special if you have $100K laying around under your mattress or something and want to feel punch everywhere.

 

[antdroid]

The Elex is a keeper because of it demanding attention to music. I think it's dynamic presence is even more present than the Clear. I need to review my notes but from memory, I think this is accurate. @pthora can you comment? On the other hand, I think the Elear over did this and of course to me has other issues with coherence.

In any case, if I want listen to music in the background while multitasking, the Elex is about near the last headphone I'd get for this (unless I'm feeling like I want a challenge). The Nighthawks, HD6XX, even my 400i make for a less distracting but fulfilling background.

I think the 400i and HEX V2 are especially good at background duty because they have enough detail and dynamic range to keep me happy yet aren't entirely distracting. The Elex has this quality of dynamics coupled with attack and impact with weight that makes you listen. The planar sound has the dynamic range and attack but I feel lacks the impact and weight the Elex and Focal and general brings. In fact, I can't think of any planars that have such weight (Ether 2, HE560, HE400i, HE4XX, EL8, LCD2, LCDX, Sine are what I've heard).

It's amazing how subtleties in driver design/technology can make seemingly small changes to sound to make a larger change when listening to that change over an entire FR. Focal headphones I feel follow their speaker house sound. If you haven't heard high end Focal speakers, upon first listen, what drew my attention is the attack, impact and weight of each note across the frequency spectrum. Even vocals come across this way, perhaps even more so. Oddly, for floor standing speakers, I prefer planars as well for their imaging, attack and decay but the Focals are special if you have $100K laying around under your mattress or something and want to feel punch everywhere.

^ great post. I came from planars -- I switch back and forth between the HE560 (and previously Sines, Mobius, etc) and the Elex/Elegia for pretty much the same reason you describe here. I also have Focal speakers -- they are wonderful -- though, just the bottom of the market stuff and not Grand Utopias or anything.

 

[BrokeSkoolBoi]

I think the 400i and HEX V2 are especially good at background duty because they have enough detail and dynamic range to keep me happy yet aren't entirely distracting. The Elex has this quality of dynamics coupled with attack and impact with weight that makes you listen. The planar sound has the dynamic range and attack but I feel lacks the impact and weight the Elex and Focal in general brings. In fact, I can't think of any planars that have such weight (Ether 2, HE560, HE400i, HE4XX, EL8, LCD2, LCDX, Sine are what I've heard).

Have you not heard the Hifiman X V2? This is an interesting comparison with the 400i because it seemed that many agreed that those sound 'live' (I've never heard them) though I can certainly see how the Elex is more 'live' and loudspeaker like to me as well.. Far as the HE X V2 comment goes, that just makes me anticipate the Massdrop revision even more . I definitely agree about the weight of sound coming from the Elex.

 

[DrpsDrpr]

To me, they sound like how a loudspeaker generates sound, which to me, is more natural.

You may be right about that- I’ve never had the means or living space to accommodate a good set of loudspeakers, so I’ve come up only listening to headphones, which surely have a different sense of cohesion to their sound on a fundamental level.

 

[CoFire]

Have you not heard the Hifiman X V2? This is an interesting comparison with the 400i because it seemed that many agreed that those sound 'live' (I've never heard them) though I can certainly see how the Elex is more 'live' and loudspeaker like to me as well.. Far as the HE X V2 comment goes, that just makes me anticipate the Massdrop revision even more . I definitely agree about the weight of sound coming from the Elex.

I own and love the HEX V2. I'd say it's my favorite at the moment. They are clearly a step up from the 400i in terms of technicalities and also a different sound. I would not say, the HEX V2 takes everything the 400i does and improves, not the case. The 400i's presentation is different and the HEX V2 is from what others have said probably the biggest departure from Hifiman's house sound.

What I was trying to focus on in my comment is that planar headphones as a technology I feel lack the impact and weight Focal brings in their offerings and specifically as we are discussing, the Elex in particular. Focal's line with the Elear, Elex, Clear and Utopia aren't your typical dynamic driver design either, as far as headphones are concerned.

I'm excited, anxious and devastated at the same time by the Hifiman XX. I haven't heard enough of Hifiman's higher end stuff such as the Ananda, Arya and HEX V2 to get a feel for how different they can be since they all use more or less the same platform. I've heard that the Hifiman XX is going to be a less detailed, tuned down version of all others I mentioned but the jury is out.

 

[PopZeus]

All this talk about the Elex's intense dynamics demanding one's attention. I think the counterpoint is-- that's why the Elex pairs so well with ladder DACs and/or tube amps. It allows you to get that smoother, more harmonically pleasing sound without feeling like you're sacrificing detail or authenticity inherent in the recording.

That said, I totally want a closed back like the Meze 99 Classics or the Ether CX to complete my collection. Not sure if my opinion above will change once I get a decent non-Focal closed back, but what fun it will be figure that out!

 

[antdroid]

I own and love the HEX V2. I'd say it's my favorite at the moment. They are clearly a step up from the 400i in terms of technicalities and also a different sound. I would not say, the HEX V2 takes everything the 400i does and improves, not the case. The 400i's presentation is different and the HEX V2 is from what others have said probably the biggest departure from Hifiman's house sound.

What I was trying to focus on in my comment is that planar headphones as a technology I feel lack the impact and weight Focal brings in their offerings and specifically as we are discussing, the Elex in particular. Focal's line with the Elear, Elex, Clear and Utopia aren't your typical dynamic driver design either, as far as headphones are concerned.

I'm excited, anxious and devastated at the same time by the Hifiman XX. I haven't heard enough of Hifiman's higher end stuff such as the Ananda, Arya and HEX V2 to get a feel for how different they can be since they all use more or less the same platform. I've heard that the Hifiman XX is going to be a less detailed, tuned down version of all others I mentioned but the jury is out.

Have you seen this review? https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/hifiman/edition-xx-massdrop/

 

[phthora]

The Elex is a keeper because of it demanding attention to music. I think it's dynamic presence is even more present than the Clear. I need to review my notes but from memory, I think this is accurate. @phthora can you comment? On the other hand, I think the Elear over did this and of course to me has other issues with coherence.

In any case, if I want listen to music in the background while multitasking, the Elex is about near the last headphone I'd get for this (unless I'm feeling like I want a challenge). The Nighthawks, HD6XX, even my 400i make for a less distracting but fulfilling background.

I think the 400i and HEX V2 are especially good at background duty because they have enough detail and dynamic range to keep me happy yet aren't entirely distracting. The Elex has this quality of dynamics coupled with attack and impact with weight that makes you listen. The planar sound has the dynamic range and attack but I feel lacks the impact and weight the Elex and Focal in general brings. In fact, I can't think of any planars that have such weight (Ether 2, HE560, HE400i, HE4XX, EL8, LCD2, LCDX, Sine are what I've heard).

It's amazing how subtleties in driver design/technology can make seemingly small changes to sound to make a larger change when listening to that change over an entire FR. Focal headphones I feel follow their speaker house sound. If you haven't heard high end Focal speakers, upon first listen, what drew my attention is the attack, impact and weight of each note across the frequency spectrum. Even vocals come across this way, perhaps even more so. Oddly, for floor standing speakers, I prefer planars as well for their imaging, attack and decay but the Focals are special if you have $100K laying around under your mattress or something and want to feel punch everywhere.

I agree that the Elear was a bit overdone in this regard. The dynamic punch there was kind of an unpredictable thing and often sounded artificially intense. Perhaps with a narrow range of genres this would be more enjoyable, but for me it simply translated to a great deal of attention paid to the volume pot to keep the effect from being unpleasant. The Elex still has that problem a bit, but the improvement is dramatic. Only in moments of crescendo with electric guitars and/or vocals did I really find the Elex to crossover into blaring. The dynamics are much more even than the Elear and, while slightly lessened in intensity, seem to be a more constant effect. While not perfect, I liked that dynamism to buy the Elex, just not quite yet.

The Clear does to the Elex what the Elex did to the Elear. The dynamism on the Clear is less, though still potent, but much more even. The leading edge of sounds hit firmly across the board, as opposed to hitting very hard but only in spots. I found the Clear had better coherence in general, a smoother sound signature, and greater detail across the range than the Elex, and ultimately that's why I bought it. I was just so impressed with how right every aspect of the sound was. I've been listening to these feverishly since I bought them and they just sound so excellent with everything. CoFire might disagree with me here, but to me the Clear was also an objectively better headphone, not simply one that is tuned more to my liking. I heard more detail, wider soundstage, and better separation with the Clear. Of course, I'd want more than just a lengthy audition to really stand by that judgment.

Regarding impact, the Elex beats out any planar I've heard, and the Clear noses out all of them except the LCD-X, that's about a draw. But, that's reversed when it comes to bass impact. For very low bass hits, I'll take the 560 or the X over just about anything. Weight, to me, connotes something different, I think, so I'll leave that one off.