Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (8/18/2022: iFi GO Blu Review Added)
Nov 16, 2015 at 10:44 AM Post #32,926 of 48,560
Thanks for the info Rudyae!
 
I have spent all day reading this thread and re-reading the first page of reviews. My thoughts have changed a bit now. I somehow missed the AKG K612 Pro's and the K702. The 702's sound they could be the ones for me.
 
If I went with the AKG 612 I may pair it with the SB-X G5 or perhaps the Scarlett Solo, not sure but I guess a Sound Blaster Z may not cut-it as an AMP for these?
 
The other option of course is the G4me-one, although i dont need a mic, nice to have but I never really use them. Despite this the SB-Z has beam forming ic anyway.
 
I suspect I may go for the K702 its the same price here as the g4ame-one!
 
Will I benefit from anything more than the SB-Z AMP?
No, G4ME ONE is the same as the PC360 not the PC350 SE.

As for the PC363, I read somewhere that it's similar to the PC360 difference is that it's impedance is at 32ohm vs 50ohm from the PC360 and you get the sub dongle for surround sound But doesn't do Dolby headphone and uses a different Dolby technology, which I don't remember what it is.

Just stick with the G4ME One

 
Rudyae...please clarify for an audio simpleton :)   the dongle does surround sound but doesnt do "Dolby headphone". The dongle does dolby 7.1 surround. Not sure what you mean, are they 2 different things?
 
The one attractive thing about the PC363 USB sound card is that its external and therefore eliminates risk of EMI.
 
If it is not too much to ask what cables/wires would I need to setup the Schiit Magni from the SB-Z?
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 11:10 AM Post #32,927 of 48,560
  Thanks for the info Rudyae!
 
I have spent all day reading this thread and re-reading the first page of reviews. My thoughts have changed a bit now. I somehow missed the AKG K612 Pro's and the K702. The 702's sound they could be the ones for me.
 
If I went with the AKG 612 I may pair it with the SB-X G5 or perhaps the Scarlett Solo, not sure but I guess a Sound Blaster Z may not cut-it as an AMP for these?
 
The other option of course is the G4me-one, although i dont need a mic, nice to have but I never really use them. Despite this the SB-Z has beam forming ic anyway.
 
I suspect I may go for the K702 its the same price here as the g4ame-one!
 
Will I benefit from anything more than the SB-Z AMP?
 
Rudyae...please clarify for an audio simpleton :)   the dongle does surround sound but doesnt do "Dolby headphone". The dongle does dolby 7.1 surround. Not sure what you mean, are they 2 different things?
 
The one attractive thing about the PC363 USB sound card is that its external and therefore eliminates risk of EMI.
 
If it is not too much to ask what cables/wires would I need to setup the Schiit Magni from the SB-Z?

It has the Dolby headphone logo on the box!
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 12:53 PM Post #32,928 of 48,560
I got my Dolby Headphone with the K701/Q701 the same way I got it for the vast majority of the headphones reviewed: The Astro Mixamp.

Even when I had the Marantz SR5002 receiver which was the only other alternative Dolby Headphone device I used, that was only for a few months, and I don't remember reviewing a pair of headphones with that the Marantz as my surround device.

Up until early last year (I think), it was all Astro Mixamps. Nowadays, I don't use Dolby Headphone, but SBX from the Creative X7, which I'm sure more people would prefer over Dolby Headphone due to less reverb and echo. Personally, I still feel the surround on Dolby Headphone is more realistic and convincing, but SBX undoubtedly sounds higher in fidelity. So all in all SBX has more pros than cons that I feel may sway the typical audiophile compared to Dolby Headphone which can be polarizing.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 1:02 PM Post #32,929 of 48,560
Which Yamaha receiver? I got a fairly entry-level $200 one, but it sounds fairly capable next to dedicated amps, and a fair sight crisper than my older DSS or Recon3D USB. I had a Beyerdynamic DT880 and an AKG K712, Q701, all three of those have a linear impedance response so the receiver's output impedance hardly makes a difference. Having some extra headroom on e volume dial is normal and desirable, though obviously an issue if you can barely turn the volume up at all and the sound is already too loud. You can get better headphone amps but be prepared to spend hundreds to find one noticeably better on a technical level, however I feel there are better surround DSPs than Silent Cinema.

 
Yamaha SR-301, this one:
http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/digital-sound-projector/yht-s401_w/
 
Sometimes I also connect a (cheap) Fiio E6 portable amp between my headphones and the Yamaha AVR and there is a noticeable difference in volume. That´s why I figured that maybe the AVR would benefit from an external amp. However, the Fiio E6 does of course not have an optical in (only stereo in, stereo out), so all it does is make the sound louder. And it also has some equalizer options (more bass, less bass etc.).
 
Really, to be honest, I don´t want to spend hundreds and I also don´t want to go through a lot of hassle getin everything connected. I have a neat setup right now that I like. I simply figured that, with my current setup in mind, if there is an easy and affordable ($ 150 max.) way to get more out of my headphones, then I would go for it. If not, than I simply will roll with what I have and be good with it.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 2:16 PM Post #32,930 of 48,560
I got my Dolby Headphone with the K701/Q701 the same way I got it for the vast majority of the headphones reviewed: The Astro Mixamp.

Even when I had the Marantz SR5002 receiver which was the only other alternative Dolby Headphone device I used, that was only for a few months, and I don't remember reviewing a pair of headphones with that the Marantz as my surround device.

Up until early last year (I think), it was all Astro Mixamps. Nowadays, I don't use Dolby Headphone, but SBX from the Creative X7, which I'm sure more people would prefer over Dolby Headphone due to less reverb and echo. Personally, I still feel the surround on Dolby Headphone is more realistic and convincing, but SBX undoubtedly sounds higher in fidelity. So all in all SBX has more pros than cons that I feel may sway the typical audiophile compared to Dolby Headphone which can be polarizing.


A shame the X7 is ridiculously expensive though, at least here in the UK.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 2:23 PM Post #32,931 of 48,560
A shame the X7 is ridiculously expensive though, at least here in the UK.

That's a matter of perspective. If all You need is a gaming soundcard then yes. if all You need is a headphone dac/amp then also yes. But if You need a virtual surround device, a DAC, a headphone and speaker amp with USB, optical, Bluetooth and line inputs/outputs then I believe the price is fair for such a versatile product.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 2:39 PM Post #32,932 of 48,560
Sorry, I know this is a repeat question. How would you connect the x7 to a ps4 for lossless surround sound?
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 2:55 PM Post #32,933 of 48,560
  Thanks for the info Rudyae!
I have spent all day reading this thread and re-reading the first page of reviews. My thoughts have changed a bit now. I somehow missed the AKG K612 Pro's and the K702. The 702's sound they could be the ones for me.
If I went with the AKG 612 I may pair it with the SB-X G5 or perhaps the Scarlett Solo, not sure but I guess a Sound Blaster Z may not cut-it as an AMP for these?
The other option of course is the G4me-one, although i don't need a mic, nice to have but I never really use them. Despite this the SB-Z has beam forming ic anyway.
I suspect I may go for the K702 its the same price here as the g4ame-one!
Will I benefit from anything more than the SB-Z AMP?
Rudyae...please clarify for an audio simpleton :)   the dongle does surround sound but doesn't do "Dolby Headphone". The dongle does Dolby 7.1 surround. Not sure what you mean, are they 2 different things?
The one attractive thing about the PC363 USB sound card is that its external and therefore eliminates risk of EMI.
If it is not too much to ask what cables/wires would I need to setup the Schiit Magni from the SB-Z?

 
The SB-Z can drive the 120-Ohm K612 Pro, maybe not the best amplifier for driving the K612 Pro, but with the price you pay for the SB-Z, makes it a good value.
 
Dolby Headphone will take in a 6 or 8 channel source and convert it into a something that can be sent to a stereo headphone.
Someone figured out how our 2 ears (stereo input) process surround sound and designed (programmed?) it into Dolby Headphone.
 
There is the older Dolby Pro Logic, which does Dolby Surround 7.1, which I believe is more of a faked surround sound.
I believe Dolby 7.1 Surround can take in 2 channels of audio and do an Expanded Stereo, which is like a fake 7.1 surround sound.
Something a long the lines of when a receiver takes in 2-channel music audio and expanded it out to all 6-channels of a 5.1 speaker setup, or the 8 channels of a 7.1 speaker setup.
Some how Dolby adapted it for headphones.
 
There have been 5 or 6 versions of the Dolby Pro Logic chip, the latest version might offer more headphone surround sound processing then I might know about
Dolby might ask for different amounts of royalties depending on which chip and what features are used.
 
I'm guessing the Dolby Pro Logic audio processing chip used in the USB sound cards is one of the older and cheaper versions, this way the word "Dolby" can be printed on the front of a retail box, that the headset comes in.
 
Technically to try to get the best audio quality out of a SB-Z/Magni setup, you would want to plug the Magni into the SB-Z's Front Speaker jack. it should feed a better analog audio signal (line-output signal), to the Magni, then plugging the Magni into the SB-Z's headphone jack.
When you plug the Magni into the headphone jack, your double amping.
But the SB-Z can not send it's SBX Headphone surround sound thru the Front Speaker jack.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 3:09 PM Post #32,934 of 48,560
  Sorry, I know this is a repeat question. How would you connect the X7 to a PS4 for Lossless surround sound?

 
 
Compression is needed to send more then 2-channels of digital audio, thru optical, but the compressed audio (up to 6-channels) it's maxed out at 24-bit/48K.
Not sure if that answers you question.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 4:44 PM Post #32,936 of 48,560
Thank you Mad Lust very good to know, and may I thank you for all your hard work, genuinly, this thread has probably saved me several purchase regrets!!! probably many times over, free hugs!
biggrin.gif

 
Good to know about the mixamp too thank you for replying.
 
PurpleAngel: Yes that more or less does answer my question. I ordered the AKG K702, SB-E5 external soundcard/Amp/DAC and the  FiiO E10 today, should be with me tomorow. I will probably return the E5 as i understand the new version BlasterX G5 comes out end of this month or probably December. So I will try the FiiO to see what all the fuss is about gaming in pure stereo using the characteristics of the phones to do the job of positioning for me. Although I am not sure how well they will perform as I was not aware until after I ordered the kit, that Mad Lust used an Astro Mixamp for his reviews on the first page.
 
I have spent time today also listening to surround comparisons from different manufacturers, I have to say I think SBX environmental audio is the best. Granted, I was listening on my crappy Razer Krakens but SBX was a clear winner. However I heard CMSS-3D also and I thought that sounded better than the SBX!! What the hell is wrong with Creative? I played with their Sound Blaster Live EA 16 in 1992 when it first came out and it was VERY good at positional audio, in a different class!
 
Oh well I just hope that the G5 surpasses my expectations because this solves all of my potential issues. Whatever the case I cant get the Magni out of my head because it is sooooo beautiful!
deadhorse.gif

 
Nov 16, 2015 at 10:52 PM Post #32,938 of 48,560
  Thank you Mad Lust very good to know, and may I thank you for all your hard work, genuinely, this thread has probably saved me several purchase regrets!!! probably many times over, free hugs!
biggrin.gif

Good to know about the mix-amp too thank you for replying.
PurpleAngel: Yes that more or less does answer my question. I ordered the AKG K702, SB-E5 external sound card/Amp/DAC and the  FiiO E10 today, should be with me tomorrow. I will probably return the E5 as i understand the new version BlasterX G5 comes out end of this month or probably December. So I will try the FiiO to see what all the fuss is about gaming in pure stereo using the characteristics of the phones to do the job of positioning for me. Although I am not sure how well they will perform as I was not aware until after I ordered the kit, that Mad Lust used an Astro Mix-amp for his reviews on the first page.
I have spent time today also listening to surround comparisons from different manufacturers, I have to say I think SBX environmental audio is the best. Granted, I was listening on my crappy Razer Krakens but SBX was a clear winner. However I heard CMSS-3D also and I thought that sounded better than the SBX!! What the hell is wrong with Creative? I played with their Sound Blaster Live EA 16 in 1992 when it first came out and it was VERY good at positional audio, in a different class!
 
Oh well I just hope that the G5 surpasses my expectations because this solves all of my potential issues. Whatever the case I cant get the Magni out of my head because it is sooooo beautiful!
deadhorse.gif

 
In the Creative Labs newer SBX Headphone surround sound verses the older CMSS-3D Headphone surround sound.
 
My best guess and two cents
Years ago, PC CPUs came with one core and it was slow (by today's standards), so a sound card needed to have a powerful audio processor (Creative EMU20K) to get good headphone surround sound (CMSS-3D?) for gaming
Now that all the CPUs now a days have 4 or 6 or 8 core and run way faster, the headphone surround sound processing can be switched more over to the CPU (SBX?)
Creative seems to have removed some of the features of the EMU20K audio processor (but kept the Quartet DSP) that powered CMSS-3D and integrated other features normally done by other chips on the sound card PCB, like DAC, ADC, I/O, on to the newer SoundCore3D audio processor.
Integrating features that other chips use to do brings down the cost of making a sound card.
 
Nov 16, 2015 at 10:54 PM Post #32,939 of 48,560
I want to get the HD598s to use with my Xbox One. What Amp or DAC (or both?) Should I get? I want to keep the cost as much down as I can

 
For a gaming console, get the Astro Mix-amp.
Or to save some cash, buy a used Turtle Beach DSS (eBay).
 
Nov 17, 2015 at 12:24 AM Post #32,940 of 48,560
In the Creative Labs newer SBX Headphone surround sound verses the older CMSS-3D Headphone surround sound.

My best guess and two cents
Years ago, PC CPUs came with one core and it was slow (by today's standards), so a sound card needed to have a powerful audio processor (Creative EMU20K) to get good headphone surround sound (CMSS-3D?) for gaming
Now that all the CPUs now a days have 4 or 6 or 8 core and run way faster, the headphone surround sound processing can be switched more over to the CPU (SBX?)
Creative seems to have removed some of the features of the EMU20K audio processor (but kept the Quartet DSP) that powered CMSS-3D and integrated other features normally done by other chips on the sound card PCB, like DAC, ADC, I/O, on to the newer SoundCore3D audio processor.
Integrating features that other chips use to do brings down the cost of making a sound card.


That's not exactly what happened. Before Vista, audio subsystem in Windows was created in a similar way to graphics subsystem, meaning the soundcard handled all sound related calculations and not the cpu. Then Vista came and from that point on the sound calculations are handled by the cpu abd only then sent to soundcard for final tweaks such as virtual surround.
 

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