[EmojilessPsykop]

In my humble audio journey it seems like I identified some of the parts I like - the mids of HD650, the highs of MSR7, but I've yet to find the bass I like.

I kinda thought it must be I'm not much of a basshead until recently I was in a blues concert and heard the bass I seem to enjoy - the kind that I felt left a void after each kick. If I understand the terms correctly, it was deep, fast, had a good kick, I think that's described as bass slam.

On the contrary, the bass I seem to dislike is slow, boomy, if it bleeds into the mids, if it rumbles, too much mid bass (?). For example I didn't enjoy Fidelio X2, ATH M50 which are some of the most loved headphones in the community I found to have some of the disliked traits.

Is such bass signature even possible in headphones? What would be examples of this within 1000EUR? Is anyone aware of a sound signature that would combine such bass with the things I liked of HD650/MSR7?

 

[FastAndClean]

try some planars, most of them have excellent bass response and creamy lush mids, the trebles will be the hard part to find in planar to sound like a dynamic headphone

 

[Rhamnetin]

Yup you need a planar magnetic headphone. The ZMF Ori is within that price range, I think it might even be your end game headphone based on your tastes. It requires a good, powerful amplifier with low output impedance though.

 

[whirlwind]

Yup you need a planar magnetic headphone. The ZMF Ori is within that price range, I think it might even be your end game headphone based on your tastes. It requires a good, powerful amplifier with low output impedance though.

Yeah, from what he is saying that he likes...he is kind of describing the ZMF Ori.

I am listening to mine right now and my main genre is blues....these are excellent cans for it.

Like you said though....you need to power them properly.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I kinda thought it must be I'm not much of a basshead until recently I was in a blues concert and heard the bass I seem to enjoy - the kind that I felt left a void after each kick. If I understand the terms correctly, it was deep, fast, had a good kick, I think that's described as bass slam.

What you need for that is a slightly boosted bass response that goes deep enough (at least around 40hz), but the boost can't be too high or...

On the contrary, the bass I seem to dislike is slow, boomy, if it bleeds into the mids, if it rumbles, too much mid bass (?). For example I didn't enjoy Fidelio X2, ATH M50 which are some of the most loved headphones in the community I found to have some of the disliked traits.

...this is what it ends up as.

Is such bass signature even possible in headphones? What would be examples of this within 1000EUR? Is anyone aware of a sound signature that would combine such bass with the things I liked of HD650/MSR7?

The HD650 is practically it for that. I have the HD600 but I boost it below 40hz to make that kick sound deeper (so basically, along with cutting its 3500hz peak, I have the HD650), plus I have it on the Brainwavz HM5 angled pads and driven by a Meier Cantate.2. If you're not getting that sound, try the HM5 angled pads (note: you need to gut worn out OEM pads to mount these) and/or an amplifier that doesn't distort the low end.

That said, as much as it has that punchy bass, you can't expect it to be identical to what you get from a speaker system like that concert or a Focal Stella Utopia/Sonus Faber Stradivari Homage/Dynaudio Contour S5.4 or Evidence since speakers are pressurizing air in the room that will hit your whole body. There's no way to get that chest-thumping effect on a headphone that is firing into your ear canals.

 

[Mhog55]

Massdrop Sennheiser hd 58x Jubilee

 

[Rhamnetin]

Massdrop Sennheiser hd 58x Jubilee

What the OP is describing seems far beyond what any Sennheiser is capable of delivering, aside from HD 650 like mids.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

What the OP is describing seems far beyond what any Sennheiser is capable of delivering, aside from HD 650 like mids.

Given a powerful enough amp those Sennheisers can deliver a thump that is just as eye opening as a Grado's but sounds deeper. My HD600 does and it just gets better with the HM5 angled velour pads.

 

[Sonic Defender]

I must admit, I don't think of Grado's having thump, so you must be talking about the most expensive models. I have heard only as high as the PS1000e and in terms of bass, it had nothing that was remotely close to thump. It lacked the slightest impact and just portrayed music without any weight and body to the notes. Lots of clarity and detail, but no flesh on the notes.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I must admit, I don't think of Grado's having thump, so you must be talking about the most expensive models. I have heard only as high as the PS1000e and in terms of bass, it had nothing that was remotely close to thump. It lacked the slightest impact and just portrayed music without any weight and body to the notes. Lots of clarity and detail, but no flesh on the notes.

RS thumps. Even SR has a thump if a bit more like if a bass drum sounds more like a tomtom stuffed with a pillow, hence the "but sounds deeper" since the Sennheisers sound more like an actual bass drum save for that kick in the chest sensation that you'll never get in a headphone.

 

[Sonic Defender]

RS thumps. Even SR has a thump if a bit more like if a bass drum sounds more like a tomtom stuffed with a pillow, hence the "but sounds deeper" since the Sennheisers sound more like an actual bass drum save for that kick in the chest sensation that you'll never get in a headphone.

Gotcha, I can understand better where you are coming from.

 

[EmojilessPsykop]

Very much appreciate the suggestions here.

The HD650 is practically it for that. I have the HD600 but I boost it below 40hz to make that kick sound deeper (so basically, along with cutting its 3500hz peak, I have the HD650), plus I have it on the Brainwavz HM5 angled pads and driven by a Meier Cantate.2. If you're not getting that sound, try the HM5 angled pads (note: you need to gut worn out OEM pads to mount these) and/or an amplifier that doesn't distort the low end.

I have HD6XX that I use with Cavali Tube Hybrid which is a bass lite amp. What you're saying makes me think that for starters I should just buy another amp that doesn't handicap the HD6XX bass. Do you think NFB 11.28 is a good idea to highlight the bass of HD6XX in a way that I want?

Yup you need a planar magnetic headphone. The ZMF Ori is within that price range, I think it might even be your end game headphone based on your tastes. It requires a good, powerful amplifier with low output impedance though.

ZMF Ori is very interesting, unfortunately its not being sold in my country or any country nearby. If I were to jump the gun on them would you think NFB 11.28 is end game amp for this HP?

That said, as much as it has that punchy bass, you can't expect it to be identical to what you get from a speaker system like that concert or a Focal Stella Utopia/Sonus Faber Stradivari Homage/Dynaudio Contour S5.4 or Evidence since speakers are pressurizing air in the room that will hit your whole body. There's no way to get that chest-thumping effect on a headphone that is firing into your ear canals.

Wonder if anyone was crazy enough to use headphones with sub bass cut out only to have it run through a separate subwoofer. Though that would probably sound too unnatural.

 

[Rhamnetin]

ZMF Ori is very interesting, unfortunately its not being sold in my country or any country nearby. If I were to jump the gun on them would you think NFB 11.28 is end game amp for this HP?

The NFB 11.28 will be good enough. While the Ori continues to scale with top tier amplification, with something like the NFB 11.28 it's still going to sound incredible and have a lot of bass slam.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I have HD6XX that I use with Cavali Tube Hybrid which is a bass lite amp. What you're saying makes me think that for starters I should just buy another amp that doesn't handicap the HD6XX bass. Do you think NFB 11.28 is a good idea to highlight the bass of HD6XX in a way that I want?

I wouldn't bet it would do so any than my Cantate.2 does over the O2. It's got a lot to do with what they sound like when cranked up. At 68dB the O2 and the Cantate.2 sound the same; crank them up to 85dB and the O2 is really grating, the Cantate.2 seems bassier; apply an EQ to cut the treble on the O2 and the bass is almost practically the same on my ears.

Alternately, there's the Meier Classic FF. I'm listening to my Cantate.2 and HD600 with HM5 angled pads right now (plus an EQ profile that mimics the HD650's response curve) - drums, including the kick drum, on Mighty Mo Rogers' The Boy Who Stole the Blues and Feist's One Evening (on the Focal-JMLab CD No.6) is like listening through my car with Focal Polyglass 165VR midwoofers+Vifa BC25 on a DD C4 and a JL 10W0 on a mono amp, or my old home system with a Marantz CD60, NAD 304, and Wharfedale Pacific Pi10 (this was even better with the Focal Chorus 716).

Wonder if anyone was crazy enough to use headphones with sub bass cut out only to have it run through a separate subwoofer. Though that would probably sound too unnatural.

That can work for the tactile feel plus having the sub far out in front does the opposite of what a subwoofer does in most cars that have them in the back (but don't have a time alignment DSP).

 

[Raketen]

I don't have a particularly good suggestion*, but you might want to try searching around over on this thread :https://www.head-fi.org/threads/the...nes-are-the-extreme-bass-club.716711/page-697

Their focus is on maximizing bass with EQ & amping but I think you might find some potential options, as they try all kinds of headphones and the type of bass tuning they go for isn't too far off from what you describe.

*(Been a long time since i heard 650 and msr7 - sony z7 maybe-kinda-sorta-a-little-but-not-really, or ultrasone signature DJ, very overpriced portable thats kind of what I would imagine an msr7+ bass but not very 650ish)