[ufospls2]

I might have it wrong, but it looks like Campfire Audio and LH Labs had been doing something together on the "Asteria" which fell apart, and was clarified on another website, and posted earlier in this thread. Now this LH Labs, or Light Harmonic "Stella" shows up, looking quite a lot like a Campfire Audio IEM. "STELLA's unique Back Hexagonal Acoustic Chamber design (HBCC)" sounds a lot like "Tuned Acoustic Expansion Chamber™ (T.A.E.C.)" from Campfire Audio.

The whole thing kinda seems fishy. I wonder what Ken Balls take on the situation is?

Also, 10,000 yuan? Thats like 2K USD right?

 

[marflao]

.
I was hired for LH Labs specifically, but I've kind of shifted into more responsibilities at Light Harmonic (chiefly dealing with Tesla amps/speakers and the Stella IEM).

Jarek,
regarding the Stella: what is it in particular you're dealing with?

 

[stuck limo]

Jarek,
regarding the Stella: what is it in particular you're dealing with?

I am in contact with retailers and reviewers, arranging/building marketing materials, etc. We are working on getting available reviewers (print/online and YouTube) and retail shops to consider carrying the Stella. The main PDF marketing has been completed and we'll release that soon to the reviewers and retail shops. That will also be available at the can-jam type shows as well.

 

[marflao]

I am in contact with retailers and reviewers, arranging/building marketing materials, etc. We are working on getting available reviewers (print/online and YouTube) and retail shops to consider carrying the Stella. The main PDF marketing has been completed and we'll release that soon to the reviewers and retail shops. That will also be available at the can-jam type shows as well.

Thanks for sharing this info.

 

[hola]

I wonder what Ken Balls take on the situation is?

Interesting that you asked. My post includes his thoughts on the topic; too bad it's "too personal" and thus is being edited out.

 

[Brubacca]

If anyone is interested in reading the reviews, I can post the links. Otherwise, we can leave this a Geek Wave thread.

Ok. When can I expect my Geek Wave to be delivered? You have had my money for 4+ years and I haven’t even seen one completed prototype. You had a nice false advertising video of one that was complete fiction to get my money.

Get on it. You raised the money you said you needed for it. Get it done. I don’t care how LH Labs and Light Harmonic are not the same company. I don’t care about your problems they are yours. I and many others want the products we paid for.

End of rant.

 

[hola]

Or perhaps no one needs to worry. As @stuck limo stated over five times in the past three days at IGN, "LH labs still exists".

Very reassuring thing to hear, I'd say.

 

[KB]

The Campfire IEM and the LH Stella IEM are completely different products. The IEM you're linking to has been in development since 2016 and is an LH design, not a Campfire design. The Campfire IEM was a collaboration, meant to introduce the market to the idea of LH IEMs. Stella is a different design, made by Light Harmonic.

If you have proof that the designs are the same IP (instead of just confused speculation), please post exact information.

Come on man, really?... your not fooling anyone here.

I was going to let all this go but the whole thing just keeps burning and your post is more deception. I was really trying to let it go but, ugg.

So yeah, I will tell you my take here... First, flat out the LH Labs IEM is a total rip off, in fact even down to the promotional materials, use of the night sky background and fonts wording etc...Some time ago we sent LH Labs ONE DD BA hybrid sample for him to try out during our brief period of communication as we were going to do some collaboration. After we split due to reasons that are too much for this post (but would also make people pretty pissed) the one sample was never returned, despite us asking LH Labs repeatedly to return the sample. LH Labs asked us to continue the collaboration (supply LH Labs with the cobranded IEMs) we declined. Fast forward several months later and LH Labs announces the "Stella". Which remarkably is a DD BA hybrid with a "rectangle" "Hexagonal Acoustic Chamber" or (HBCC). Clearly LH Labs did a tear down and copied the one sample I had sent them. For LH rip off our design and to charge $1500+ for copied IP is pretty scummy, low life, bad taste and should be an insult to anyone who enjoys this hobby.

Everything I state here is 100% true and should be known for the sake of the customers (you) Of course you can decide for yourself here but honestly, lets pull up the history and known shenanigans of LH. Same on LH Labs.

Ken

 

[hola]

@stuck limo, the representative of LH labs here, said that they are going to release the IEMs in the North American market. Indeed, from what I gather, he himself is responsible for the marketing works.

It was a surprise, because I thought LH labs would limit the product to the Asian market, like how they surreptitiously do in their pre-release of Geek Source / Vi Dac ("pre" meaning selling their products before their long-awaiting backers get them). But apparently, American head-fiers can get their hands on their "creation" (of course, that's assuming that "Stella" would not be another crowd-funding thing, in which case people might have to wait for years).

Exciting time!

 

[Zhanming057]

Come on man, really?... your not fooling anyone here.

I was going to let all this go but the whole thing just keeps burning and your post is more deception. I was really trying to let it go but, ugg.

So yeah, I will tell you my take here... First, flat out the LH Labs IEM is a total rip off, in fact even down to the promotional materials, use of the night sky background and fonts wording etc...Some time ago we sent LH Labs ONE DD BA hybrid sample for him to try out during our brief period of communication as we were going to do some collaboration. After we split due to reasons that are too much for this post (but would also make people pretty pissed) the one sample was never returned, despite us asking LH Labs repeatedly to return the sample. LH Labs asked us to continue the collaboration (supply LH Labs with the cobranded IEMs) we declined. Fast forward several months later and LH Labs announces the "Stella". Which remarkably is a DD BA hybrid with a "rectangle" "Hexagonal Acoustic Chamber" or (HBCC). Clearly LH Labs did a tear down and copied the one sample I had sent them. For LH rip off our design and to charge $1500+ for copied IP is pretty scummy, low life, bad taste and should be an insult to anyone who enjoys this hobby.

Everything I state here is 100% true and should be known for the sake of the customers (you) Of course you can decide for yourself here but honestly, lets pull up the history and known shenanigans of LH. Same on LH Labs.

Ken

I've been an ALO customer for the better part of the decade and while I agree that LH is looking pretty guilty here, it would help the argument a lot if hard data from the hybrid prototype is made public, and I'm sure I can find someone with the stella to take some measurements. Not doubting you, just trying to think about how to find more concrete evidence that Stella is a copy of the ALO sample IEMs. I actually thought that Stella was licensed from ALO when I first saw them, there's a lot of stuff that definitely looks kind of Campfire-esq.

@stuck limo, the representative of LH labs here, said that they are going to release the IEMs in the North American market. Indeed, from what I gather, he himself is responsible for the marketing works.

It was a surprise, because I thought LH labs would limit the product to the Asian market, like how they surreptitiously do in their pre-release of Geek Source / Vi Dac ("pre" meaning selling their products before their long-awaiting backers get them). But apparently, American head-fiers can get their hands on their "creation" (of course, that's assuming that "Stella" would not be another crowd-funding thing, in which case people might have to wait for years).

Exciting time!

Stella is absolutely a real thing. They've been on sale in Asian markets for over a month now. I know people who have one and reviews are generally quite positive.

 

[Rlin987]

I've been an ALO customer for the better part of the decade and while I agree that LH is looking pretty guilty here, it would help the argument a lot if hard data from the hybrid prototype is made public, and I'm sure I can find someone with the stella to take some measurements. Not doubting you, just trying to think about how to find more concrete evidence that Stella is a copy of the ALO sample IEMs. I actually thought that Stella was licensed from ALO when I first saw them, there's a lot of stuff that definitely looks kind of Campfire-esq.



Stella is absolutely a real thing. They've been on sale in Asian markets for over a month now. I know people who have one and reviews are generally quite positive.

I think copying the design, advertisement idea is already not acceptable...It doesn't really matter how similar they are in terms of sound. Of course if they sound quite similar, the thing will be even worse.

 

[Hercules]

Come on man, really?... your not fooling anyone here.

I was going to let all this go but the whole thing just keeps burning and your post is more deception. I was really trying to let it go but, ugg.

So yeah, I will tell you my take here... First, flat out the LH Labs IEM is a total rip off, in fact even down to the promotional materials, use of the night sky background and fonts wording etc...Some time ago we sent LH Labs ONE DD BA hybrid sample for him to try out during our brief period of communication as we were going to do some collaboration. After we split due to reasons that are too much for this post (but would also make people pretty pissed) the one sample was never returned, despite us asking LH Labs repeatedly to return the sample. LH Labs asked us to continue the collaboration (supply LH Labs with the cobranded IEMs) we declined. Fast forward several months later and LH Labs announces the "Stella". Which remarkably is a DD BA hybrid with a "rectangle" "Hexagonal Acoustic Chamber" or (HBCC). Clearly LH Labs did a tear down and copied the one sample I had sent them. For LH rip off our design and to charge $1500+ for copied IP is pretty scummy, low life, bad taste and should be an insult to anyone who enjoys this hobby.

Everything I state here is 100% true and should be known for the sake of the customers (you) Of course you can decide for yourself here but honestly, lets pull up the history and known shenanigans of LH. Same on LH Labs.

Ken

Selling in China already, at lease 7 unit sold

 

[stuck limo]

Hi everyone, I spoke to Larry tonight and this is our official response to Ken's post:

The Asteria project ran from Feb. 2017 to Nov. 2017 with the contract signed by both parties. In this contract, Light Harmonic was the technology provider and designer for the new products. However, the project was terminated by Campfire’s CEO Ken Ball himself with no reason given. Light Harmonic put a lot of effort and cost into research and development into this project, and we were upset to see it terminated. (see attached photo)

Re: Asteria’s sound chamber...While we still were partnered, we didn't like and didn't want to use this design at all. We hoped to use another design and reduce the one high frequency peak. But it didn’t work out in that direction. To be perfectly clear: Light Harmonic doesn’t want to use this design and will never use this so called liquid metal design. Both Mr. Ball and we found that design is quite problematic. Mr. Ball even mentioned in an email that this design dragged the production speed and time.

We also have another solid reason that we have zero intention and didn’t use this Asteria’s design. Dealers in Asia found a lot of similar enclosures that has been commonly used by Campfire and other manufacturers. They had strong doubt on that and suggested Light Harmonic don’t get involved. Here are some quick screen captures of these products we got from them. (see attached)

For Asteria’s sample, we didn’t possess it from a long time ago. One distributor in Japanese has that. And they are quite pissed off due to the sudden and uncommon termination of the Asteria project and that cost them a lot in money and marketing. We have tried a few times to let them return to Campfire but currently didn’t get good reply yet.

And for the record, Light Harmonic didn’t open any of Asteria samples and we don’t need to. Asteria was simply an upgraded version of Dorado which we were trying to improve more. We have quite a few sound chamber and enclosure designs from 2015.

HBSC is the Hexagon shape designed and measure by computer simulation. Both outside and inside use the Hexagon shape to reduce any potential resonance surround the dynamic driver. We already applied the design patent for these. If Mr. Ball has any proof that Campfire ever used this kind of hexagon design before us, please send to us at anytime. On the other hand, if he doesn’t, then please withdraw these wrongful accusations.

The name of the IEM, Asteria, also was created and assigned by Light Harmonic. We emailed that name, Asteria, to Mr. Ball on Sep 4, 2017’s email. Light Harmonic never got any background image, or any detail marketing design from Campfire for Asteria. All Asteria marketing design came from our Japanese partner. For Stella, we came up with the marketing and design, and we have all the original hi-res photos, including rendering of Stella done by our designer. Again, since the Asteria project got terminated, we don’t want to associate ourselves with any part of that project.

By using one terminated project to hint or suggest Light Harmonic “stole” any of Campfire’s design or technology is really not acceptable. We urge Campfire to stop this kind of behavior and if they are unhappy that any other vendor including Light Harmonic is entering the earphone market, please compete fairly and reasonably.

 

[stuck limo]

Here are the rest of the photos for comparison between LH and CA. The Asteria had no packaging included with it, so the leather case you see in the photo was designed by us. You will see it's also similar to the case the Stella uses. (also, the IEM pictured first is one of the ones referenced in the first post)

 

[Rlin987]

Here are the rest of the photos for comparison between LH and CA. The Asteria had no packaging included with it, so the leather case you see in the photo was designed by us. You will see it's also similar to the case the Stella uses. (also, the IEM pictured first is one of the ones referenced in the first post)

There are enough Chinese members here. Stop fooling people by making screen shot in Chinese? Your screen shot is Dunu falcon C, 达音科 隼，which is totally irrelevant with what we discuss here.