Lets Talk Metal
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Trogdor

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The thing with vinyl is that there is a tone which is not present in the Cd. So that difference is not 10%, it's 100%. I still have most of my metal on CD as it was the only way to get the music. Also CD is a compression standard. They sat around and thought out what Redbook should be. The bass on vinyl is just better if it has been done right. Sadly some vinyl is just not mastered right. The only time you know is to read reviews before buying. Some vinyl is crap never getting to the true potential the format offers. I purchased Black Sabbath number one in 1976 on vinyl after listening to the cassette for three years earlier. I didn't even have a CD player till about 2000.

What's very sad about this is technically speaking, CD does bass MUCH better than vinyl since there are inherit limitations to what a cart can do (in fact its why I believe sub-bass gets removed via a high-pass to deal with it).

But you would never know it because of the Loudness War.

I have a lot more to say about vinyl and tone but I'm gonna leave that for the site.

Bottom is this though (for me): CD's if mastered right can sound glorious. How many metal CDs are mastered with maximizing fidelity? Not many.

Btw Mr Moose, have you heard the new Torture Division in HD?

If not, please click that and download, listen, enjoy!
 
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post-10032417
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Pritolus

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One of seven songs I recorded at the concert yesterday!
I must say the audio is more than acceptable, considering it was recorded with my phone 

 
Opinions?
 
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post-10032419
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campj

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"The only time you know is to read reviews before buying."
This seems like a problem, because like you say later in your post, only a limited number are pressed; they sell out too fast, so by the time you see reviews, you end up paying $100 on ebay for a second hand record. The day your guys' NeO showed up, I looked on the Blood Music website and they were all sold out. I'm just guessing, but they probably sold out before any even shipped. (I just checked the site: "Records SOLD OUT within 8 hours of pre-order! " So really all you could do was buy blind and hope it was worth the money)

"I still have most of my metal on CD as it was the only way to get the music."
Only certain albums are done correctly on vinyl... so should I start listening to symphonic folk metal, a genre I don't particularly care for (due to the symphonic part), just because it's the only decent vinyl mastering available right now? And the $30 I just blew on music I wouldn't have bought normally can't go towards music I actually want.

"I will never forget when I discovered that only 1% of all my CDs sounded decent on my system."
So say vinyl DOES sound 100% better than MP3/CD... the comparatively few LPs I have are going to ruin the rest of my vast collection because I will always be comparing how bad CD/MP3 sounds to the wonders of vinyl.

I'm not sure why I'm on this anti-vinyl rampage right now. I'm probably trying to convince myself it's not worth it. Plus, a little debate can be fun.

Here is an ideal situation: every album gets released on vinyl, mastered correctly, and costs close to CD. Booyah, I'd be all over it. Or, after reading Trog's post, every album gets mastered correctly on CD/digital.
 
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post-10032424
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macrocheesium

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The day your guys' NeO showed up, I looked on the Blood Music website and they were all sold out. I'm just guessing, but they probably sold out before any even shipped. (I just checked the site: "Records SOLD OUT within 8 hours of pre-order! " So really all you could do was buy blind and hope it was worth the money)
The black ones sold out in 8 minutes. 

 
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post-10032429
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Trogdor

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I'm gonna give Portal of I one more shot.

I was very meh on this record. I thought it had tons of potential but it was more progressive wankery than real craftsmanship. Like really awesome bits string together instead of real songs.
 
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Trogdor

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One of seven songs I recorded at the concert yesterday!
I must say the audio is more than acceptable, considering it was recorded with my phone :o2smile:

Opinions?

What phone? :)
 
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post-10032448
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Pritolus

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"The only time you know is to read reviews before buying."
This seems like a problem, because like you say later in your post, only a limited number are pressed; they sell out too fast, so by the time you see reviews, you end up paying $100 on ebay for a second hand record. The day your guys' NeO showed up, I looked on the Blood Music website and they were all sold out. I'm just guessing, but they probably sold out before any even shipped. (I just checked the site: "Records SOLD OUT within 8 hours of pre-order! " So really all you could do was buy blind and hope it was worth the money)

"I still have most of my metal on CD as it was the only way to get the music."
Only certain albums are done correctly on vinyl... so should I start listening to symphonic folk metal, a genre I don't particularly care for (due to the symphonic part), just because it's the only decent vinyl mastering available right now? And the $30 I just blew on music I wouldn't have bought normally can't go towards music I actually want.

"I will never forget when I discovered that only 1% of all my CDs sounded decent on my system."
So say vinyl DOES sound 100% better than MP3/CD... the comparatively few LPs I have are going to ruin the rest of my vast collection because I will always be comparing how bad CD/MP3 sounds to the wonders of vinyl.

I'm not sure why I'm on this anti-vinyl rampage right now. I'm probably trying to convince myself it's not worth it. Plus, a little debate can be fun.

Here is an ideal situation: every album gets released on vinyl, mastered correctly, and costs close to CD. Booyah, I'd be all over it. Or, after reading Trog's post, every album gets mastered correctly on CD/digital.
 
I know how you feel. I don't have a vinyl rig because of the costs. Not because I don't think it'll be worth it, but because I'm afraid I'll spend all my spare cash on records and thus never again have the money to upgrade my equipment 

As it is I don't listen to enough music at home, and I have a few parts of both my home stereo and HP rig I want to upgrade first.
One day, though. One glorious day...
 
What's very sad about this is technically speaking, CD does bass MUCH better than vinyl since there are inherit limitations to what a cart can do (in fact its why I believe sub-bass gets removed via a high-pass to deal with it).
 
I'm not that versed when it comes to vinyl, but isn't a big part of the pre-pre-amplifiers (phono stage) job to compensate for the lack of sub bass on the record? From what I understand the sub bass isn't completely removed from the record, it's just significantly dampened so that the pre-pre-amp with its built-in bass boost can restore it. Obviously the CD is still better equipped as it has no lower frequency limit, but the way I understand it LPs can come very close with the right recording and equipment.
 
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Pritolus

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What phone? :)
 
Nokia Lumia 1020. I love the hell out of that thing 

 
The concert was great, and speaking of vinyl my friend got himself one of the last signed copies of the Infestissumam yellow vinyl limited edition LPs.
 
 
I was very pleased with this clip as well 

 
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post-10032560
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MorbidToaster

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"The only time you know is to read reviews before buying."
This seems like a problem, because like you say later in your post, only a limited number are pressed; they sell out too fast, so by the time you see reviews, you end up paying $100 on ebay for a second hand record. The day your guys' NeO showed up, I looked on the Blood Music website and they were all sold out. I'm just guessing, but they probably sold out before any even shipped. (I just checked the site: "Records SOLD OUT within 8 hours of pre-order! " So really all you could do was buy blind and hope it was worth the money)

"I still have most of my metal on CD as it was the only way to get the music."
Only certain albums are done correctly on vinyl... so should I start listening to symphonic folk metal, a genre I don't particularly care for (due to the symphonic part), just because it's the only decent vinyl mastering available right now? And the $30 I just blew on music I wouldn't have bought normally can't go towards music I actually want.

"I will never forget when I discovered that only 1% of all my CDs sounded decent on my system."
So say vinyl DOES sound 100% better than MP3/CD... the comparatively few LPs I have are going to ruin the rest of my vast collection because I will always be comparing how bad CD/MP3 sounds to the wonders of vinyl.

I'm not sure why I'm on this anti-vinyl rampage right now. I'm probably trying to convince myself it's not worth it. Plus, a little debate can be fun.

Here is an ideal situation: every album gets released on vinyl, mastered correctly, and costs close to CD. Booyah, I'd be all over it. Or, after reading Trog's post, every album gets mastered correctly on CD/digital.

Blood sells out fast, but unless the record they're doing had a decent sounding CD already their LP will probably wreck it. I've bought most of their releases this year and not 1 has disappointed.

Plus, if it sucks, sell it on eBay.

Another one is Earache's FDR stuff. THEY WILL NOT SOUND BAD. You can buy those without a 'review' and chances are you won't get a dud.

Also, don't start listening to stuff you wouldn't like...but again, don't kid yourself, there's PLENTY of non-folk metal vinyl. Death is my favorite and I have lots on vinyl.

If every CD was mastered right I'd for sure buy less vinyl...but they're not.

Vinyl is a huge money pit that takes a decent chunk of change to start. It's also the most rewarding thing I've done with audio I can remember. Knowing I have the best version of an album I love (Gojira's latest for instance) is a great feeling.
 
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campj

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Blood sells out fast, but unless the record they're doing had a decent sounding CD already their LP will probably wreck it. I've bought most of their releases this year and not 1 has disappointed.



Plus, if it sucks, sell it on eBay.



Another one is Earache's FDR stuff. THEY WILL NOT SOUND BAD. You can buy those without a 'review' and chances are you won't get a dud.



Also, don't start listening to stuff you wouldn't like...but again, don't kid yourself, there's PLENTY of non-folk metal vinyl. Death is my favorite and I have lots on vinyl.



If every CD was mastered right I'd for sure buy less vinyl...but they're not.



Vinyl is a huge money pit that takes a decent chunk of change to start. It's also the most rewarding thing I've done with audio I can remember. Knowing I have the best version of an album I love (Gojira's latest for instance) is a great feeling.
 


You're not helping me convince myself that I don't need a vinyl rig! Aaahhhhhhhh!!!
 
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keepitsimple

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post-10032625
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Redcarmoose

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What's very sad about this is technically speaking, CD does bass MUCH better than vinyl since there are inherit limitations to what a cart can do (in fact its why I believe sub-bass gets removed via a high-pass to deal with it).

But you would never know it because of the Loudness War.

I have a lot more to say about vinyl and tone but I'm gonna leave that for the site.

Bottom is this though (for me): CD's if mastered right can sound glorious. How many metal CDs are mastered with maximizing fidelity? Not many.

Btw Mr Moose, have you heard the new Torture Division in HD?

If not, please click that and download, listen, enjoy!


Yes, I have not heard the newest Torture Division but heard everything else they have done. I do like em. For me I just think vinyl has a more natural presentation where all the instruments fall into a better presentation and timing. I first seemed to notice the bass from vinyl when I was playing dance music, vinyl has a more rounded tone of bass. IMO.


I agree that 16 bit if done right is pretty nice. That's why there is so much argument about wondering if higher resolutions reveal better sound.


Part of the vinyl thing has always been taking a chance. I also have to say in my years of collecting I have had my fair share of let downs. Even if the mastering is good or not, there is always a chance that they are warped. I can't tell you how many times I've bought used records that looked perfect only to find they were really scratched. The problems with vinyl make that score when you find the perfect record all that much rewarding.

So I guess you kind of have to do what we are reading about in this thread. Buy from a label that has a known level of quality. Take a chance and get a pressing before it's gone and just hope for the best.
 
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macrocheesium

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One of seven songs I recorded at the concert yesterday!
I must say the audio is more than acceptable, considering it was recorded with my phone 

 
Opinions?

That looks great. I hate it when all you can hear is the drums and some faint vocals. Looks like you got a nice spot, too.
 
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post-10032647
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MorbidToaster

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Blood sells out fast, but unless the record they're doing had a decent sounding CD already their LP will probably wreck it. I've bought most of their releases this year and not 1 has disappointed.



Plus, if it sucks, sell it on eBay.



Another one is Earache's FDR stuff. THEY WILL NOT SOUND BAD. You can buy those without a 'review' and chances are you won't get a dud.



Also, don't start listening to stuff you wouldn't like...but again, don't kid yourself, there's PLENTY of non-folk metal vinyl. Death is my favorite and I have lots on vinyl.



If every CD was mastered right I'd for sure buy less vinyl...but they're not.



Vinyl is a huge money pit that takes a decent chunk of change to start. It's also the most rewarding thing I've done with audio I can remember. Knowing I have the best version of an album I love (Gojira's latest for instance) is a great feeling.
 


You're not helping me convince myself that I don't need a vinyl rig! Aaahhhhhhhh!!!

Yeah...I tend to have that effect. :D

I'll always warn not to get into it as a 'trial tun' though. Once you get a taste it's hard to go back...and it's expensive.

I just recently started buying CDs again after about a year of not even having a CD player. Lol.

It's just that Metal is probably the #1 genre in my mind that actually gets proper vinyl releases. You picked the wrong music to love if you're trying to avoid vinyl. :)
 
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