LCD-X and XC Update
Jun 17, 2022 at 10:02 PM Post #1,936 of 2,311

DW75

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lol...I';m just laughing because when I bought my first high end earphone, the SS Andromedas, I said it was 'end game' for me...then when I sold them I met the guy in starbucks, and he opened the box and said "this is end game' lol, round and round it goes...... My lcd-x is end game, until I upgrade to the 4z, lol, enjoy!

The two headphones I mentioned will definitely be the stopping point for me. I would take a 4000 dollar pair of speakers over a 4000 dollar pair of headphones any day.
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 10:28 PM Post #1,937 of 2,311

szore

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The two headphones I mentioned will definitely be the stopping point for me. I would take a 4000 dollar pair of speakers over a 4000 dollar pair of headphones any day.
edited...
 
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Jun 17, 2022 at 10:36 PM Post #1,939 of 2,311

szore

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Jun 17, 2022 at 10:53 PM Post #1,940 of 2,311

jonathan c

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This will definitely be the last one for me. Owning a high end planar magnetic driver headphone, and now a high end dynamic driver headphone should keep me satisfied for years.
….🤔….
 
Jun 18, 2022 at 12:14 AM Post #1,941 of 2,311

Ham Sandwich

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An issue I have with digital EQ is that digital EQ requires that the music be resampled and/or upsampled in order for the digital EQ to work with it. The digital input signal needs to be resampled and/or upsampled in order for the EQ filters to do their thing. That resampling and/or upsampling is not audibly transparent. There is an audible cost to doing that upsampling.

I’ve tried different digital EQ plugins and none of them are audibly transparent even when doing a flat EQ profile. Just running the sound through the EQ plugin without doing any actual EQ will affect the sound because just running the sound through the plugin will resample/upsample and affect the digital sound. And it affects the sound for the worse. Doesn’t make it better.

The resampling/upsampling that the EQ plugins use is chosen based on low CPU use and low latency rather than on best sound quality. The resampling algorithm used by the EQ plugin is chosen based on CPU use and low latency rather than on best sound quality. Because choosing a good resampling method would require high CPU use and high ringing and higher latency. All of those options are a positive for digital processing metrics but a negative for audiophile listening metrics.

I’ve tried different digital EQ plugins and even when doing a flat EQ they have an negative audible aspect to the sound quality.

The current digital EQ methods are not audibly transparent. They have a negative affect on the sound quality.

Until we can figure out ways to do digital EQ that is audibly transparent then digital EQ is a net negative and a net negative on sound quality. You aren’t going to get a headphone and DAC and amp to sound better with digital EQ. You may be able to get the headphones to sound more neutral with digital EQ, but at what cost. I don’t consider that cost to be worth it.
 
Jun 18, 2022 at 11:08 PM Post #1,942 of 2,311

Ham Sandwich

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Audeze headphones are amazing headphones for audiophile listening. The way Audeze does the planar magnetic drivers and they way they tune the sound allows you to hear things in the recordings and in the gear that other driver technologies and other headphones are unable to convey.

For example, Audeze headphones make it easier to hear how different digital filters sound. Like the different filter options that some DACs have. But when you enable digital EQ the ability to hear those differences largely goes away. I really like the Schiit multibit filter. There is a special sound quality that it does that I sometimes call “multibit magic”. When I enable digital EQ that multibit magic goes away. And then the Schiit multibits become just another DAC.

The Audeze headphones also allow me to hear absolute polarity aka absolute phase. To hear whether the sound blows or sucks. When the absolute polarity is correct a bass drum hit will blow. If it is wrong the bass drum hit will suck. The Audeze headphones (and some other planar magnetics and electrostatics) makes it possible to hear the subtle sonic changes that happen when you flip the absolute polarity. But if you do too much digital EQ of the bass that goes away. Even gentle and tasteful digital EQ of the bass will make it harder to hear.

The Audeze headphones combined with a very good amp (like the big Cavalli amps) and a very good DAC makes it possible for me to hear how high-res and CD-res sound different (it has to be properly recorded and mastered high-res), and how lossy and lossless sound different. But when I enable digital EQ that all goes away.

Without digital EQ the Audeze headphones provide an audiophile listening experience where you can hear and appreciate the differences in things like digital filters, absolute polarity, and high-res vs. CD. With digital EQ the Audeze headphones become a glorified mid-fi headphone that is no longer able to provide those audiophile listening experiences.

A quick way to convert a $1200 Audeze LCD-X headphone into a glorified upper tier mid-fi headphone is to enable digital EQ. You’ll get a fixed frequency response, but at the cost of losing the audiophile listening experiences that the headphone is capable of when paired with suitable amps and DACs.
 
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Jun 19, 2022 at 8:10 AM Post #1,943 of 2,311

szore

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Audeze headphones are amazing headphones for audiophile listening. The way Audeze does the planar magnetic drivers and they way they tune the sound allows you to hear things in the recordings and in the gear that other driver technologies and other headphones are unable to convey.

For example, Audeze headphones make it easier to hear how different digital filters sound. Like the different filter options that some DACs have. But when you enable digital EQ the ability to hear those differences largely goes away. I really like the Schiit multibit filter. There is a special sound quality that it does that I sometimes call “multibit magic”. When I enable digital EQ that multibit magic goes away. And then the Schiit multibits become just another DAC.

The Audeze headphones also allow me to hear absolute polarity aka absolute phase. To hear whether the sound blows or sucks. When the absolute polarity is correct a bass drum hit will blow. If it is wrong the bass drum hit will suck. The Audeze headphones (and some other planar magnetics and electrostatics) makes it possible to hear the subtle sonic changes that happen when you flip the absolute polarity. But if you do too much digital EQ of the bass that goes away. Even gentle and tasteful digital EQ of the bass will make it harder to hear.

The Audeze headphones combined with a very good amp (like the big Cavalli amps) and a very good DAC makes it possible for me to hear how high-res and CD-res sound different (it has to be properly recorded and mastered high-res), and how lossy and lossless sound different. But when I enable digital EQ that all goes away.

Without digital EQ the Audeze headphones provide an audiophile listening experience where you can hear and appreciate the differences in things like digital filters, absolute polarity, and high-res vs. CD. With digital EQ the Audeze headphones become a glorified mid-fi headphone that is no longer able to provide those audiophile listening experiences.

A quick way to convert a $1200 Audeze LCD-X headphone into a glorified upper tier mid-fi headphone is to enable digital EQ. You’ll get a fixed frequency response, but at the cost of losing the audiophile listening experiences that the headphone is capable of when paired with suitable amps and DACs.
I always say the sound looses its 'fidelity' with eq, but very well put.
 
Jun 19, 2022 at 5:15 PM Post #1,945 of 2,311

szore

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Is it worth buying the Lcd X 2021 model or are there any alternatives in the same price range

Need a planar
I dont have extensive headphone experience but my advice would be to grab an X...many say its the best under $2K. And I've heard more expensive cans I didn't like more than the X like the Empyrean... The X is great, and its easy to drive. Some people feel you have to EQ it a little, but I listen to it natural most of the time.

20220327_041528.jpg
 
Jun 19, 2022 at 6:07 PM Post #1,946 of 2,311

Jonne Haven

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Is it worth buying the Lcd X 2021 model or are there any alternatives in the same price range

Need a planar
The only other headphone I own right now in this price range is the XC '21 and if you don't need isolation the X wins in almost every category in my opinion. Even bass. It might not have as much sheer body at times that the XC can have but it sounds more authentic and layered to me.

The X also exhibits some sort of 3D-like magic in its soundstage and imaging that is pretty much unique to the X as far as I've heard...even cans with wider soundstage like the Ananda don't present the image as magically.

If you're reading this thread then you know I'm a proponent of EQing which has drawn some controversy. If you're against EQing, which is fine, I will say that perhaps the XCs have better stock tuning than the Xs, but EQ'd I prefer the Xs once again.

So if you need a planar and aren't into the Hifiman line's super wide soundstage, IMO the LCD-X is the one to get!

Blessings,
-J
 
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Jun 19, 2022 at 7:03 PM Post #1,947 of 2,311

Ham Sandwich

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I always say the sound looses its 'fidelity' with eq, but very well put.

A general loss of fidelity is a way to explain it. But I wanted to give some specifics since "loss of fidelity" is somewhat vague.

Another challenge with recognizing a loss of fidelity is that to notice that some fidelity is missing you have to be very familiar with how the headphones and music sound with higher fidelity. And that means having experience listening with high quality high fidelity amps and DACs. Amps like my Cavalli amps make it easier to hear when the EQ takes away fidelity. But if I was listening to something like a Schiit Modi & Magni stack I wouldn't notice the loss in fidelity with digital EQ.
 
Jun 19, 2022 at 7:51 PM Post #1,949 of 2,311

szore

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A general loss of fidelity is a way to explain it. But I wanted to give some specifics since "loss of fidelity" is somewhat vague.

Another challenge with recognizing a loss of fidelity is that to notice that some fidelity is missing you have to be very familiar with how the headphones and music sound with higher fidelity. And that means having experience listening with high quality high fidelity amps and DACs. Amps like my Cavalli amps make it easier to hear when the EQ takes away fidelity. But if I was listening to something like a Schiit Modi & Magni stack I wouldn't notice the loss in fidelity with digital EQ.
Having said all this I am listening to my X right now off my M8 and I have a modest bass shelf applied and it sounds amazing! The bass on the X is massive! So maybe eq has its place after all...
 

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