[astrostar59]

Not using any of the filters since indeed they ruin the sound. That's just how the LCD-4 is, seems you identified the same dip I'm referring to. Audeze has always had that, that's their intention I suppose. I used EqualizerAPO to add to that region, and while it helps it's not enough. It's alright, I'll take those funds and listen to the SR-009S in a few months and maybe wind up with one eventually.

The Bipolar doesn't seem to have high and low gain for 200ohms. Is that correct? Not having impedance switcher may cause FR suckout? I have no idea for sure, but hearing the Audeze on amps with impedance switcher it always sounded best on high for the 200 ohms. I am understand a design route of Audeze have engineer in a 4-5Khz dip, as it is in the all important presence region where many digital source can sound harsh and over the top. If you have a great source, it can be corrected without issues IMO. Have you tried the Roon LCD4 200 ohm curve?

 

[buzzlulu]

Source is important, and there are source that is $16,000 or $17,000 out there
Check out Aurender W20 , just one of them, for fun and giggling.

Google Linn two channel sources- you will see what I am talking about. Extremely interesting reading.

Linn LP12 turntable - introduced in 1973, continuously manufactured today, still considered the reference standard for vinyl replay. I don't think Chord Hugo or Dave has been continuously manufactured for 45 years and still holds its rank as #1

Linn Klimax DS
http://www.hifiplus.com/articles/linn-klimax-ds-network-music-player/

"In fact, the first three words I wrote on my note pad sum up the Klimax DS/3 effect better than all the other 1997 or so words written here. And I wrote them in capitals and underlined them twice for good measure: Holy. Living. ***. That’s the ten-second later comment, and it was still relevant at the time I put away the note-pad. I’ve not heard every single digital device, but I’ve heard a lot of them, and Klimax DS/3 is the best of the ones I’ve heard, or at least the best I’ve heard that don’t cost as much as a decent luxury car. And even at the super-lofty end of high-end digital, the Klimax DS/3 stands with the best of them, and even shows a clean pair of heels to some of audio’s upper echelon with ease. It might even be the best of all of them, and therefore comes profoundly recommended."


There is a much bigger world out there in Two Channel land than what many encounter here on Headfi with headphone oriented DACS. The DAVE is still a "baby" in terms of age and longevity.

One other AMAZING statistic. One could have bought a LP12 turntable back in 1973 and even today ALL updates which Linn have come up with - motor, power supply, sub chassis, top plate etc. can still be retrofitted. A turntable one purchased in 1973 can still be brought up to 2018 spec.

The Klimax DS streamer was introduced in 2007 when Linn was the FIRST to make the bold move and stop manufacturing CD players. It has seen 4 iterations. Each version can be sent back to the factory for a full board replacement and brought up to current specification. The word obsolete does not exist - customer service and support is over and above 5 star and no customer is ever told to throw out their existing kit and buy the latest and greatest. The Klimax line can, and has always been, able to be retrofitted and brought up to current spec. An investment for life. A company with a pedigree just like - STAX!

 

[arnaud]

Not using any of the filters since indeed they ruin the sound. That's just how the LCD-4 is, seems you identified the same dip I'm referring to. Audeze has always had that, that's their intention I suppose. I used EqualizerAPO to add to that region, and while it helps it's not enough. It's alright, I'll take those funds and listen to the SR-009S in a few months and maybe wind up with one eventually.

I could not make the comparison but I also suspect an SR009S with no eq (Mac > SU-1 (usb) > Holo L1 (i2s) ) will surpass my equalized 009 (Mac > SU-1 (usb) > Deq24/96 (aes) > Holo L1 (aes) ) from the little I could sample.

Not sure if that’s the benefit of going i2s to the dac but adding this deq via aes connection does take its toll on transparency.

As for spending 10k+ on the source, that was true 10 years ago but I having actually compared in my home, my opinion these days is that, for headphone audio at least, it only is mandatory if you don’t know what to do with your money and/or feel insecure about the actual SQ of your rig .

In the grand scheme of things, I can hear way more differences between transducers than sources and, while the 009 and 009S are not that different, money is better spent there than on the dac imo . Too bad it was priced so high unfortunately.

Arnaud

 

[Whitigir]

Wait...what ? It is priced the same as 009 at release!

 

[buzzlulu]

Arnaud
I believe you are in Japan? Have you demoed the 009S?

 

[joseph69]

He mentioned he spent a little time with them.

 

[arnaud]

In Japan at least, the 009S at launch is 1500usd more expensive than 009. I paid 345kJPY for my 009 I recall while the 009S is 495kJPY...
Perhaps part of this is the strategy to kill grey market (price went down over 15% overseas but going up by same amount in Japan for newly released products...)

As for my impressions of the 009S, they’re out there on head-fi, 009 successor thread maybe?

Arnaud

 

[AnakChan]

Did the price go up!? I thought this was going for Yen 446k.

 

[arnaud]

Actually, the stores selling are all providing 10% cashback through points so it does indeed come out to 446k. Fujiya also may provide 30k discount when trading in a stax product it’s almost tempting

 

[astrostar59]

On DACs, I have found there are big gains to be had. I had a few top DACs at home last year and there is a big different between them IMO, sound signature and amount of realism to my ears. Totally personal journey but I would rate the ones I heard like this:

1. Aries Cerat Kassandra: 100
2. Audio Note DAC 5: 85
3. TotalDAC6: 80
4. Chord DAVE: 75
5. CH precision C1: 70
6. Lampizator Golden Gate MK1: 70
7. AMR DP-777: 60
8. Esoteric K-01: 55

I would say between the Esoteric for example to the Kassandra it is huge, massive difference in the final sound. In that list the DAVE is great value, and if I only had HPs I would possibly have bought it, but on my 2 channel the Kassandra is well ahead in terms of realism and weight / body / timbre, a total lack of any processing to the sound.

 

[astrostar59]

I could not make the comparison but I also suspect an SR009S with no eq (Mac > SU-1 (usb) > Holo L1 (i2s) ) will surpass my equalized 009 (Mac > SU-1 (usb) > Deq24/96 (aes) > Holo L1 (aes) ) from the little I could sample.

Not sure if that’s the benefit of going i2s to the dac but adding this deq via aes connection does take its toll on transparency.

As for spending 10k+ on the source, that was true 10 years ago but I having actually compared in my home, my opinion these days is that, for headphone audio at least, it only is mandatory if you don’t know what to do with your money and/or feel insecure about the actual SQ of your rig .

In the grand scheme of things, I can hear way more differences between transducers than sources and, while the 009 and 009S are not that different, money is better spent there than on the dac imo . Too bad it was priced so high unfortunately.

Arnaud

Respect Arnuad, but I found the DAC does affect the sound a lot. I had a cluster of different DACs over the last 5 years, mostly tubed R-2R, and also tested the DAVE, Golden Gate, CH Precision, Esoteric K-01, MSB Platinum, Naim CD555, Audio Note UK DAC 5, Audio Note DAC 4.1 kit heavily modded, searching for my destination source. The sound in all cases was different, the presention different. I finally found nirvana with the Aries Cerat Kassandra.

I would say a lot of DACs out there are not good enough for a top headphone setup. Not to push them to the full potential anyway. That is my own view. For example DAC are not just bits is bits. The gain stage integrity is key, the power supply. The conversion architecture is part of it all.
I keep banging on about DAC designs but they are really 60% pre-amplifier with a DAC board. And we all know there are really rubbish pre-amps put there, and a few great ones. My point.

The presentation on headphones is clearly different to top speaker rigs, but it has it's own analytical and micro sensitivity to the source IMO. I believe get the source right, then attack the amp and HPs. It seems no point to me to amplify a source that is not up the scratch, then base all the system on 'tuning' to fix it. This is my experience.

We all come to different conclusions, and different destinations. In an ideal world any transparent DAC with a flat FR should work with any amp that is 'wire with gain' that then powers any headphone that is again flat FR. It never seems to work like that. Half the reason this hobby is so fun and also frustrating, and in some cases buy selling frenzy or just plain expensive LOL. There is a system synergy in all this chaos to factor in as well.

 

[koven]

For 009, is it worth stepping up to Carbon from KGSSHv for double the price essentially?

 

[paradoxper]

No. BHSE or T2 would be worth it.

 

[astrostar59]

For 009, is it worth stepping up to Carbon from KGSSHv for double the price essentially?

I would say the BHSE and Carbon is very close. They sound different though.

The BHSE can be 'tuned' or tamed so to speak for the energetic 009 treble. I use to run my 009 out of the Carbon and eventually sold it as the treble brightness in the end was too much.

The KGSShv with the 009 is more balance IMO, not as fast or detail frenzy, but warner and more natural. TBH I regretted selling my KGSShv. It was the Sanyo version 450v off-board. The others may (will) sound different.

The BHSE IMO has to be used with the NOS MUllards and the 009, it is too bright without on stock tubes to my ears, so factor that in the costs.

Or try the Abyss and a powerful SS or tube amp to drive it. I like the Abyss and it is close to the 009 in detail but has real bass power and dynamic, more realistic timbre IMO.

I went more the other way for the LCD4 and the V281 amp. Liquid and smooth, enough detail (with my DAC) to be end game for me.

Yes, no doubt the T2 and 009 is the end game Stax, but not really practical or possible re cost or availability to some.

hope this helps.

 

[koven]

That is helpful, thanks for the insight!