[StudioSound]

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It just so happens I have a jRiver MP3 player and it came with their PC software to manage MP3s with, can't say I noticed SQ being better over foobar. Did you use wasapi in foobar? That is bit perfect playback and I can't see how you can imporve that unless you change soundcard or use DSPs to enhance the audio. But the software that came with it is old now and they want money to update it so haven't used newer version.

You're probably thinking of iRiver? I don't think JRiver sold MP3 players.
 
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Just use the volume knob on your amp and set everything before that to 100% or whatever its default is. You should only be adjusting one control at the end of the chain. In jriver I disable the volume control.

JRiver's volume control is probably better than a lot of device's volume controls. Analog volume controls are very difficult to manufacture that work well without adding noise or channel balance issues.
Digital volume controls will not be any better than JRiver's, unless the DAC uses more internal precision than it accepts as an input. E.g. 32-bit internally, but only accepts a 24-bit signal.
 
If you insist on playing music at 100% volume, you risk inter-sample clipping, and you're missing out on the awesome R128 volume leveling that JRiver offers.

 

[Sherwood]

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If you insist on playing music at 100% volume, you risk inter-sample clipping, and you're missing out on the awesome R128 volume leveling that JRiver offers.

 
You can, of course, disable the volume control and still enable R128 in DSP settings.

 

[Schonen]

 
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You're probably thinking of iRiver? I don't think JRiver sold MP3 players.
 

 

 
Oops, brain fart on my part. Yes, it is iRiver and not Jriver I have, I actually installed the iRiver software and was scratching my head trying to figure out what is so good about it because the iRiver  software is not even on par with Microsoft Media Player.
 
"If you insist on playing music at 100% volume, you risk inter-sample clipping, and you're missing out on the awesome R128 volume leveling that JRiver offers."
 
Oh yea? That Meir guy of Meir audio that makes headphone amps and DACs said that all volume levels should be at 100% and you control volume on the hardware device only. He said that lowering volume in the software affects dynamic range negatively.
 
I am dloading JRiver now and will check it out for myself.

 

[Tony1110]

If you set the bar to max on the preamp it definitely degrades SQ. Set the standard volume control and the system control to max yes, but the preamp is best left as it is.

 

[jarrett]

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JRiver's volume control is probably better than a lot of device's volume controls. Analog volume controls are very difficult to manufacture that work well without adding noise or channel balance issues.
Digital volume controls will not be any better than JRiver's, unless the DAC uses more internal precision than it accepts as an input. E.g. 32-bit internally, but only accepts a 24-bit signal.
 
If you insist on playing music at 100% volume, you risk inter-sample clipping, and you're missing out on the awesome R128 volume leveling that JRiver offers.

 
Oh I hadn't read about jriver's own internal control before. Right now I'm connected to an HRT microStreamer that is connected to a Bryston B60. It's a bit confusing too that the microStreamer can perform an analogue control, but I think disabled is the best way for me right now.
 
http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Volume

 

[AladdinSane]

I have my powered monitors hooked up Coax from my Asus STX using "Internal Control" in JRiver 18. Speakers are at near max volume (analog dial).  For SQ is this the optimum setup? Downer is my keyboard volume controls don't work in this set up but I'd rather optimize SQ. Kind of new to JRiver so still tweaking.

 

[ferday]

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I have my powered monitors hooked up Coax from my Asus STX using "Internal Control" in JRiver 18. Speakers are at near max volume (analog dial).  For SQ is this the optimum setup? Downer is my keyboard volume controls don't work in this set up but I'd rather optimize SQ. Kind of new to JRiver so still tweaking.

 
ideally you'd turn jriver volume up to 100% (turn internal volume off) and use the volume knob on the speakers to control
 
i've heard that the volume control inside jriver is actually really good and it's not necessary to do this...it's an old habit most audio geeks will do

 

[AladdinSane]

Considering JRiver's volume control is allegedly pretty solid I'll probably use it for adjustments unless it gets too bothersome without keyboard controls. Volume knob on speakers is on the back so not ideal as the main volume control. Doable but not awesomely convenient. I might have to actually lean forward and, gasp, leave my chair! I'll run with this setup for awhile and see how I like it. Previously I ran RCA to 3.5 jack in the back of the speaker and could control easily from my keyboard. Likely I won't hear the difference anyway but that little voice in my head that says "optimize" can be very annoying.

 

[StudioSound]

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You can, of course, disable the volume control and still enable R128 in DSP settings.

 
Yes, but this will not play back the files at 100% volume. (because R128 reduces volume)
 
Quote:

Oh yea? That Meir guy of Meir audio that makes headphone amps and DACs said that all volume levels should be at 100% and you control volume on the hardware device only. He said that lowering volume in the software affects dynamic range negatively.

It's true that digital volume control does reduce dynamic range, but analog volume controls are far from perfect, often having less dynamic range to begin with due to thermal noise, and suffering from linearity problems. A good digital control should be better than most analog controls. Theoretically you could build a better analog control, but it would require a lot of R&D and very careful component selection.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYjHKv2_OqQ
 
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If you set the bar to max on the preamp it definitely degrades SQ. Set the standard volume control and the system control to max yes, but the preamp is best left as it is.

You will have inter-sample clipping on most devices if you leave the digital volume at 100%.
 
Quote:

I have my powered monitors hooked up Coax from my Asus STX using "Internal Control" in JRiver 18. Speakers are at near max volume (analog dial).  For SQ is this the optimum setup? Downer is my keyboard volume controls don't work in this set up but I'd rather optimize SQ. Kind of new to JRiver so still tweaking.

It's difficult to say without testing the hardware. Digital controls are best near 100%, but analog controls are worst at low levels... but higher levels of amplification are worse.
As long as the digital control is not doing more than -48dB of adjustments, you're probably fine with a digital control if your output is 24-bit.
 
Quote:

ideally you'd turn jriver volume up to 100% (turn internal volume off) and use the volume knob on the speakers to control
 
i've heard that the volume control inside jriver is actually really good and it's not necessary to do this...it's an old habit most audio geeks will do

I have files which will clip unless you reduce the digital volume control by 5.2dB.

 

[Sherwood]

   
It's true that digital volume control does reduce dynamic range, but analog volume controls are far from perfect, often having less dynamic range to begin with due to thermal noise, and suffering from linearity problems. A good digital control should be better than most analog controls. Theoretically you could build a better analog control, but it would require a lot of R&D and very careful component selection.
 
You will have inter-sample clipping on most devices if you leave the digital volume at 100%.
 
I have files which will clip unless you reduce the digital volume control by 5.2dB.

 
I have to point out, your use case is somewhat unique.  Most of us are not running unmastered music through a DAW, we're playing back mastered stereo.  We're also doing so, often, on sophisticated devices that have detented stepped attenuators or high-quality potentiometers where channel linearity is not a major concern.  It is certainly true that bad pots exist, but so does kmixer.  We can't just assume people have one problem and not the other.
 
If this was the sound science forum, they would asking for documentation on inter sample clipping, as it is something of an article of faith among engineers.  I'm perfectly willing to go along with it, but you are the only person I've seen advocating outputting at anything less than peak volume to avoid it.  I recognize that you have files which clip.  That does not mean that anyone else necessarily does.
 
I sort of feel like you're trading Head-Fi's articles of faith for Gearslutzs'.

 

[StudioSound]

  I have to point out, your use case is somewhat unique.  Most of us are not running unmastered music through a DAW, we're playing back mastered stereo.  We're also doing so, often, on sophisticated devices that have detented stepped attenuators or high-quality potentiometers where channel linearity is not a major concern.  It is certainly true that bad pots exist, but so does kmixer.  We can't just assume people have one problem and not the other.
 
If this was the sound science forum, they would asking for documentation on inter sample clipping, as it is something of an article of faith among engineers.  I'm perfectly willing to go along with it, but you are the only person I've seen advocating outputting at anything less than peak volume to avoid it.  I recognize that you have files which clip.  That does not mean that anyone else necessarily does.

 
I am not playing unmastered music. Most music is now mastered so that the sample peaks are -0.1dB. This results in inter-sample peaks which are greater than 0 dB.
 
Check the values that the JRiver 19 beta produces after analyzing your library. I guarantee you will have a number of tracks with an R128 Peak Level above 0 dB - and they have to be played back an additional 1 dB lower than that to account for potential variations.

 

[imeem]

just downloaded it. Got crossover working with my A2 and directed the bass to my sub

. B4 i had to connect my audioengine A2 and sub together.
 
But now, i can't use my fiio e17 cuz it only supports 2.0 

..... so i have to use my onboard sound (ALC 888s)
 
which setup should i stick with? 

 

[StudioSound]

  just downloaded it. Got crossover working with my A2 and directed the bass to my sub

. B4 i had to connect my audioengine A2 and sub together.
 
But now, i can't use my fiio e17 cuz it only supports 2.0 

..... so i have to use my onboard sound (ALC 888s)
 
which setup should i stick with? 

You can set up separate zones for each device.

 

[imeem]

  You can set up separate zones for each device.

 
so u are saying that i can 2 soundcards active at the same time? Like my audioengine A2 would be using the fiio e17 and my sub would be using my onboard sound card? 

 

[ferday]

so u are saying that i can 2 soundcards active at the same time? Like my audioengine A2 would be using the fiio e17 and my sub would be using my onboard sound card? 

Post in the Jriver forums, those guys are super helpful. I'm not sure you can run 2 cards at once, but it may be possible with zones...