[vincentm66]

Hi Hipnick,
 
What sources / player do you use?
 
Cheers

 

[Duncan]

That's the main problem with these. And it's definitely not a fit issue (that would make the bass missing). Fortunately that's fixable (by digital means), but unacceptable for the price.

this puzzles me, coming from the 1p2 the Layla's have mid-range in spades...

What is the reference point for IEMs with a great mid-range?

 

[hipnick]

  Hi Hipnick,
 
What sources / player do you use?
 
Cheers

 
They are listed on my profile. Unfortunately no Cowon P1 

 

 

[Rico613]

Ok, got my Layla's in this morning.  Playing from an AK 240, I did a quick comparison to my well used JH 16 Pro's that have a Silver Dragon cable installed.  (The Silver Dragon make a HUGE difference in SQ.)  To be fair I'll have to burn-in the Layla's, but so far I'm disappointed.
 
EDIT:  The custom Layla feels as though it doesn't go as deep in my ear canal as the 16 Pro's.  It also appears the speakers are positioned at a different angle than the 16 pro's.  If these are significant factors, then obviously no amount of burn-in will help.  
 

 

 

[tumburu]

this puzzles me, coming from the 1p2 the Layla's have mid-range in spades...

What is the reference point for IEMs with a great mid-range?

 

 
Well, they can't be literarily missing, they are lower in volume (of course, in an uneven way) and that only happens from 1500Hz above. This gives the effect that some describe as 'smooth' sounding. Also contributes to putting (artificially) things in perspective, making the soundstage bigger and deeper.
 
So because you have half of the mids properly presented but also because the treble is boosted, if your ear is not very well trained, it can fool you, but at a close listen one can notice that's harder to pick details in the high mids. For me, it was difficult to really understand what's happening in that register, if something needed corrections or not, that's why in the end I went to my old and trusted tool, the eq, and then 'miraculously', every detail appeared in its whole glory (or shame, from case to case).

 

[Buddhahacker]

I had a similar issue when I first received my Laylas.  I thought it was probably the worst purchase I have ever made.  After changing to Comply tips for better fit, swapping my iPhone(to eager to listen to the IEMs) to an AK and burning it in for a few hours(~20) the Laylas came to life. I have about 200 hours of listening using both my AK and Sony ZX2 and I find the Layla nearly flawless.  

 

[cantara256]

   
That's the main problem with these. And it's definitely not a fit issue (that would make the bass missing). Fortunately that's fixable (by digital means), but unacceptable for the price.

I'm no audiophile by any means, but I find this very hard to believe. The Laylas are astonishingly good, they blew my mind when I first heard them, and I've had Etys, SE846, and Roxanne. Are you completely certain it's not your source or a fit issue?

 

[tumburu]

100% sure. Fit issues manifest differently.
 
I posted my impressions earlier in this thread. That being said Layla is, indeed, the most unpredictable IEM regarding its response to the source, probably because the big number of drivers. The said problem is consistent, with some variations from source to source. 

 

[hipnick]

Thanks tumburu for this information. I find it very interesting.
 
It is quite normal to find this hard to believe. The needs of a music producer is different from a music listener. For most having a neutral sound and good tonal balance is enough. But if you are mixing, you need a flat frequency response across the spectrum. I am sure it would be more difficult to come to this conclusion without using flat near field monitors as a reference.
 
If I understood correctly, using an eq in this way will add more details in this register, which may result in the recording sounding harsh, at the expense of soundstage width and depth. I am not sure, if I would like to have that, but I am willing to try and hear for myself.
 
So my questions are, do you think the dips affect the timbre of the instruments? Can you eloberate a bit more on the eq that you use? The amplitude and bandwidth of these dips and some example frequencies? (I know my mileage may vary, but I am interested in your findings)
 
Thanks

 

[shotgunshane]

There is definitley a dip around 1.5k, give or take depending on insertion depth and ear anatomy. It gives vocals a bit of a veil. It's very distinct when comparing directly to something like the UERM.

For music enjoyment this is not necessarily an issue but certainly a concern with 2.5k tool marketed for mastering.

 

[tumburu]

I identified two significant dips at around 2k and 4k. They are quite deep, but that varies from one amp to another. The whole area between 1.5 and 5k is affected (too many dips there TBH), with these two being the most obvious.
 
As shotgunshane says, that's not really a problem if you're not doing critical listening. You can enjoy these for years (if the cable doesn't break meanwhile) if all you need them for is listening to music. No problems for that kind of application if you're not looking for reference sound.

 

[raypin]

mmm.....got my Layla weeks ago. It was love at first hear. Still is, to this day. Favorite pairing: IPod Classic/Theorem 720/Mass Kobo 395. Only issue is the eartips. Difficult to achieve that perfect seal. Second best: Chord Hugo/AK240. Bass at 12 o'clock.

 

[Duncan]

Only issue is the eartips. Difficult to achieve that perfect seal. Bass at 12 o'clock.

Agreed re seal, sometimes I get it, others not at all

Bass for me is at 2pm, probably a shade high, but wow, great kick at the bottom end, makes the SE846 bass system sound positively bass light...

Further bad news for me is that these outclass the SE846 so badly that it isn't even funny - which means I really cannot see me returning these...

Sometimes ignorance really is bliss ( / as you see fit)

 

[MacedonianHero]

  I identified two significant dips at around 2k and 4k. They are quite deep, but that varies from one amp to another. The whole area between 1.5 and 5k is affected (too many dips there TBH), with these two being the most obvious.
 
As shotgunshane says, that's not really a problem if you're not doing critical listening. You can enjoy these for years (if the cable doesn't break meanwhile) if all you need them for is listening to music. No problems for that kind of application if you're not looking for reference sound.

 
That's likely a fit or HRTF issue with you in particular...or a faulty unit completely? There are no dips whatsoever that I could detect...as flat as there is to my ears. Please have a look at my profile to see the other headphones in my collection to see where I'm coming from.

 

[Rico613]

  I identified two significant dips at around 2k and 4k. They are quite deep, but that varies from one amp to another. The whole area between 1.5 and 5k is affected (too many dips there TBH), with these two being the most obvious.
 
As shotgunshane says, that's not really a problem if you're not doing critical listening. You can enjoy these for years (if the cable doesn't break meanwhile) if all you need them for is listening to music. No problems for that kind of application if you're not looking for reference sound.

2 KHz and 4KHz would be between notes B and C four and five octaves above middle C.  I never had much use for them either  . . .  lol . . .