[joelongwood]

Snufkin, I like your style! Your honesty is refreshing.
Thank you.

 

[lord of volume]

chupa se lo

 

[morphsci]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snufkin Yet without some kind of proof that a writer has indeed used the equipment that he states or actually listened to the music stated, how do we know they actually have such equipment or listened to such music? I could say I have *insert best CD player in the world* plugged into a *best amplifier in the world* with *most expensive interconnects in the world* and I listened to *a hundred CDs of varying genre* - it'd be then up to you to prove I didn't. The problem with stating exact equipment is there's always some idiot who chimes up with "oooh, you didn't hear a difference because you have the BLACK version of the CD player and you didn't listen to a particular CD by some obscure band... if you'd done that the differences would have been HUGE!!" I wasn't listening for preferences, I was listening for differences. As I've said before - if the differences were indeed as great as some people have stated, it really shouldn't have mattered what kind of music I was listening to or what equipment I was using - silly extremes aside. I can hear the difference between, for example, the HD600 and HD650 straight from an ipod. Likewise I can hear the difference between the DT860 and the DT880 straight from AC97 onboard audio. I could list more examples if you like. If you'd bothered to check my profile you'd see the range of equipment I have at my disposal as well as the types of music I listen do. I do more than "one song" tests and I try different sources - I assume (obviously incorrectly) that people who read my reviews know this. I was listening for differences, I listened well - I got other people to listen as well, the results were conclusive regardless of equipment so I didn't bother listing my equipment. In addition - the weight differences between the old and new aren't big enough to easily be able to tell the difference blind. I'd notice after an hours constant use I guess, but otherwise I couldn't pick which was which based on weight - not when swapping back and forth fairly frequently. We even swapped earpads at one stage just in case one was more "scratchy" than the other. Besides, even if I could, I was doing my best to be impartial - I was actually convinced that I would hear a difference after all the hype.

There is always the chance that someone would lie about a review. However it seems to me that the liklihood of someone lying is greater for a "quick and dirty" review than for a lengthy well-written one that included information on associated equipment as well as specific impressions regarding the music they used.

I did check your profile but I do not see how that is relevant. Check my profile and then tell me what I am listening to right now. I also do not care if you can hear differences between other headphones. I can hear a difference between my MS-2's and MS-Pro's, so what it is not relevant to my statement.


Let me state this again, very slowly. I do not question what you heard or did not hear. I do not consider your review either right or wrong. I am also not stating that your results would change with different sources or music, I have no way of judging that nor would I attempt to make such a ridiculous statement. HOWEVER, I do consider it your review useless for me to make a generalization from your listening experience to how it may sound to me. I believe I have the right to consider the relevance of any review I may read to my own listening situation


Quote:

Originally Posted by Snufkin It's funny how when someone comes along to say negative things people try to pick flaws in the testing process - in most cases I agree with being really particular. The apparent "huge" differences between the old and new versions of this headphone shouldn't require such minute details - I should have been able to tell the difference easily. For the sake of testing, I did a few experiments to test any possible psychological "you just didn't WANT there to be a difference" effects, but the results were always the same. Think about it people, if anything I should be raving on about how much better the new version is - it would mean more sales.

One final time. I am not picking flaws in your testing procedure. There is not enough information in your review to do that. I could care less what your final conclusion is it makes no difference to me if you heard a difference or did not hear a difference. You state what you wanted to test and your conclusions but without the details of your procedure I have no way to judge for myself how much weight to give them. At this time I do not know if there are differences bewteen the two headphones since I have not heard the MS-2i. Also the magnitude of differences is a subjective measure, the same absolute difference may seem large to one person and small to another so that should always be viewed in that context

You have the right to do your review any way you please but I have the right to determine its usefulness to me. FYI HERE is a link to review that I consider useful to me since it allows me to put the reviewers impressions into a context that I can use to relate it to my listening preferences and to make an informed decision on how much weight to give the review.

 

[morphie]

So could anyone actually make a review of 325 vs 325i? Cause this thread goes on and on and on about language skills and way to say things without hurting the poor people's feelings who actually do hear differences between them, but what about the CANS??

Personally I dont think Grado would release new versions of their cans that r bigger and weight more if there is no change in sound. But I havent yet heard the new cans so I can't give an opinion, unlike people who make reviews on cans they havent heard *winks*

Anyways, comments on cans plz, sorry to put it so bluntly but your skills of reviewing come in second

 

[LTUCCI1924]

.

 

[Snufkin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphsci *snippety*

When I do long, in depth reviews or comparisons of truly different headphones I generally list things in more detail.

Listing things in the case of this comparison would have been pretty dull.

CD Player A - no difference.
CD Player B - no difference.
CD Player C - no difference.
CD Player D - no difference.

Music Style A- no difference.
Music Style B - no difference.
Music Style C - no difference.

Amp A - no difference.
Amp B - no difference.
Amp C - no difference.

I would make for a pretty damn boring "in-depth" comparison if you ask me, so for the sake of not boring everyone to death I cut all the pointless parts out.


Quote:

Originally Posted by morphsci At this time I do not know if there are differences bewteen the two headphones since I have not heard the MS-2i. Also the magnitude of differences is a subjective measure, the same absolute difference may seem large to one person and small to another so that should always be viewed in that context

In which case reading any reviews except those that list the exact equipment you have and the exact types of music you listen to would be a waste of time.
Even discussing the differences with people who don't have your ears, your tastes and your equipment becomes pointless.

Dude - try to see what I'm saying here.

I did extensive testing, the results didn't warrant an extensive writeup.
It wasn't a review, it was a comparison. I wasn't writing up my opinions on how the MS-2 sounds, I was writing up any differences I could hear between the old MS2 and the new. That's all, nothing more.

I could crap on all day about which direction I was facing, the colour underpants I was wearing, what I had for breakfast, what colour the LED on the amp was - it would have no effect on the outcome of my test results.
If it were a matter of opinion that I was pushing here it would be a different matter - ie: "with X genre of music I preferred headphone 2", this wasn't preference - it was difference.

Now just for you - read my profile again, I used every CD player I have for at least one cd (ignore the DVD player and soundcard, I didn't use them), I tried many genres of music (one of my test CDs that I use has around 13 tracks varying from hard rock to jazz to classic rock to dance and more) I used 2 high-ish end amps and one "low end " and I did my testing over a period of 2 days in a quiet environment.

None of these details have any effects whatsoever on the outcome.

It was never my intention to post a review, many people asked me to compare the old MS2 to the new - so I did, I then posted my results. Writing up a super detailed review of MS2 v MS2i would have been a waste of everyone's time when all they wanted to know was the differences between the two models.

 

[morphsci]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snufkin ... Long Boring Rationalization

Dude, read my lips. I do not care how you do your review, that's up to you. What it means to me is up to me, get over it. It's not rocket science, move on.

 

[SNR]

I know Grado has a harsh high end but I do not know they can have a harsh comments on them too

chill out

my review is almost ready to be unleashed

 

[morphie]

Thank you for that review - it is exactly the kind of review I was looking for, and exactly the review i anticipated, although now I will have to buy 325i. You just killed my wallet.... again

 

[Snufkin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphsci Dude, read my lips. I do not care how you do your review, that's up to you. What it means to me is up to me, get over it. It's not rocket science, move on.

Good god man, it wasn't a review! Figure it out already!
Your lack of understanding this issue is truly astounding.
It's not rocket science but it may as well be to you it seems.
There's not much more I can do to get it through to you, your idea of "what it means to me" must confuse you often when everyone else is on a different page.

Here's some help;
review (see def. 4) - what my comments were NOT.
vs
comparison what my comments WERE.

 

[LTUCCI1924]

.

 

[morphsci]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snufkin Good god man, it wasn't a review! Figure it out already! Your lack of understanding this issue is truly astounding. It's not rocket science but it may as well be to you it seems. There's not much more I can do to get it through to you, your idea of "what it means to me" must confuse you often when everyone else is on a different page. Here's some help; review (see def. 4) - what my comments were NOT. vs comparison what my comments WERE.

Sigh ... OK your COMPARISON is useless to me. I am not confused at all about my preferences since I do not care if they agree or do not agree with anyone else's preferences. I guess that is one of the few advantages of getting older

Actually a standard review is usually a comparison by reference and yours was a comparsion by contrast see THIS link. A comparison by contrast review is not necessarily better or worse than a comparison by reference review (although the author above actually makes a case for them being better) when done correctly.

 

[crazyfrenchman27]

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphsci Sigh ... OK your COMPARISON is useless to me. I am not confused at all about my preferences since I do not care if they agree or do not agree with anyone else's preferences. I guess that is one of the few advantages of getting older Actually a standard review is usually a comparison by reference and yours was a comparsion by contrast see THIS link.

This exchange is pointless. Snufkin provided his qualified and valued impressions in comparing the MS2i to the MS2.

I personally don't care that you don't care for his impressions; they were valuable to me, nonetheless. Let's hear other people's impressions now.

I'd especially like to hear a comparison between the SR325i and the MS2 or MS2i.

 

[morphsci]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazyfrenchman27 This exchange is pointless. Snufkin provided his qualified and valued impressions in comparing the MS2i to the MS2. I personally don't care that you don't care for his impressions; they were valuable to me, nonetheless. Let's hear other people's impressions now. I'd especially like to hear a comparison between the SR325i and the MS2 or MS2i.

That is my point exactly. It is for the individual to determine if a review or comparison is valuable or not to them, not the reviewer (even if some see him as a head-fi demi-god) and you should not care about my caring (since I do not care that you dont care

).

If you actually look at my first post in this thread you will see that I stated I am waiting for the Grado 325i's and Alessandro MS-2i's to be delivered so that I can do a comparison by contrast review between the 325i, MS-2i, MS-2 and HP-1.

I also call for more reviews (comparisons) but I also suggest the reviews 1. Be actually posted here on Head-Fi and 2. Contain enough detail that a reader can make a valid judgement to weight the relevance of the review (comparison) to them.

 

[DUSZA]

Hi

Just received my new Alessandro Ms2i from Alessandro today. When I open the box they where sliver not gold in color is this right? If so how can I tell
if these aren't the old Ms2 shipped by mistake.

DAN