Isolation feet for high end amps?
Dec 23, 2008 at 1:45 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 44

Spareribs

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Is it a good idea to do this, even for the seperate power supply too? I see some people doing it. Since isolation feet are cheap I figure why not?
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 5:45 AM Post #2 of 44

panda

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no, take those feet and throw them at the people who suggested it to you in the first place. the only thing that you should even consider isolating vibrations from is a mechanical device such as turntable or cd player...
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 2:41 PM Post #3 of 44

Larry I

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Amps, linestages, etc., have some mechanical aspects, such as a power transformer that is a pretty substantial source of vibration. A lot of footers and platforms are designed primarily to dissipate internally generated vibration, rather than isolate the equipment from external sources of vibration.

I've found that the use of devices, such as energy absorbing platforms and couplers (primarily Symposium products) do have a subtle impact on the sound of my system. However, it is a matter of tuning, so improved vibration control can actually sound worse in certain situations. So, it is really a matter of trial and error (a good dealer helps here).

Vibration control/isolation under mechanical devices, such as a CD player will have much more substantial impact. Again, whether the result is positive or not depends on the product and system tuning. In a friend's system, any sort of footer, isolation platform, etc. under an Aero Capitale CD player made it sound dry and sterile. In fact, we considered removing the cone feet that come attached to the player (looks like a Black Diamond footer).
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 5:07 PM Post #4 of 44

883dave

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Why not try and then give us your impression?
Asking the general population what you will hear is akin to someone saying the music you listen to is crap because they don't like it.
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 6:05 PM Post #5 of 44

dura

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In general it depends on the amp; my 20 kg+ Primare A30 is build like a safe and the only vibration that can move that thing is an earthquake and we don't have those very much around here; besides it got optimized feet already, three of them. But on f.i. tube-amps with their rattling tubes vibration can be a serious problem.
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 6:38 PM Post #6 of 44

Uncle Erik

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I tried some of the DIY ones. No change in sound.

I imagine that no isolation feet would work the same across all systems. First, there's a wide variety of gear. Second, the amount and type of vibration varies by location; no two are the same. So any claim of equal results across all settings is suspect. Third, this stuff tends to cost a few dollars to produce. My rule of thumb for evaluating audio gear is twofold: 1. consider the ratio of actual cost: price, and 2. consider the ratio of testimonial "evidence":measurements. The higher the ratios, the more likely you're being served snakeoil.

I think a lot of audio products are sold because people just can't accept that they're actually done with their system. There *has* to be something more to do, some tweak, something. If you get to that point, it's probably time to get into a new genre of music or take up another hobby.
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 6:43 PM Post #7 of 44

CrazyRay

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry I /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Vibration control/isolation under mechanical devices, such as a CD player will have much more substantial impact. Again, whether the result is positive or not depends on the product and system tuning. In a friend's system, any sort of footer, isolation platform, etc. under an Aero Capitale CD player made it sound dry and sterile. In fact, we considered removing the cone feet that come attached to the player (looks like a Black Diamond footer).


I am using the Disc of Silence isolation foot for my Meridian 506 CD Player.
I got them for a steal!!!
They are suppose to be $275 for a set of four.
I bought all four for $90 bucks!!
I have my CD player on the floor, so I wanted something to get it away from the carpet.
I thought of using hockey pucks, but when I saw these I just had to get them!!

sodisiblkhandlargems9.jpg
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 7:16 PM Post #8 of 44

panda

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90 bucks for a piece of cork and three springs, rofl...
you could have made that from ten dollars worth of stuff from home depot.
did that actually do anything for you?

i heard a 506.20 both played on the carpet and on a wall mounted rack with cone feet and absolutely zero difference except it was more aesthetically pleasing to have it sitting on the rack.
 
Dec 23, 2008 at 8:11 PM Post #9 of 44

CrazyRay

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As I was typing this, I knew someone would give me s**t.
If you can build them for a reasonable price, ($22.50 each) I will buy them from you!
I needed to get the CD player off the floor so that I would not kick it when I walked by.
The hockey pucks seems a little too primitive for me.
I was at the store, they were on sale, I bought it.
That’s all, nothing more to it.
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 12:50 AM Post #10 of 44

Spareribs

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Why not try and then give us your impression?
Asking the general population what you will hear is akin to someone saying the music you listen to is crap because they don't like it.



No. It's not that much opinion oriented as in appreciation of music. It's more about the physics.
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 1:44 AM Post #11 of 44

fzman

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Spareribs /img/forum/go_quote.gif
No. It's not that much opinion oriented as in appreciation of music. It's more about the physics.


are you suggesting that physics proves there's no such thing as vibration? that no components or electronic assemblies are microphonic? that adding extra voltages to the signal isn't distortion?

or do we just use physics to prove that suggestability cuts both ways? and people will refuse to hear differences 'just because' they fail to fit their world view?

since physics is a branch of science, and science is empirical, shouldn't we prioritize the empirical over the hypotheses? otherwise we are being ad hoc?

once again, people can't seperate cause-effect, value, and musical priorities. just because something is expensive doesn;t make it bad. just because you "could build it for less" does not make it a rip-off.

i use (and sell) vibration control products which are backed up not only by a money back guarantee, but also by shake table/accelerometer published measurements. guess that must be something othr than physics?
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 2:15 AM Post #12 of 44

Spareribs

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Quote:

Originally Posted by fzman /img/forum/go_quote.gif
are you suggesting that physics proves there's no such thing as vibration? that no components or electronic assemblies are microphonic? that adding extra voltages to the signal isn't distortion?

or do we just use physics to prove that suggestability cuts both ways? and people will refuse to hear differences 'just because' they fail to fit their world view?

since physics is a branch of science, and science is empirical, shouldn't we prioritize the empirical over the hypotheses? otherwise we are being ad hoc?

once again, people can't seperate cause-effect, value, and musical priorities. just because something is expensive doesn;t make it bad. just because you "could build it for less" does not make it a rip-off.

i use (and sell) vibration control products which are backed up not only by a money back guarantee, but also by shake table/accelerometer published measurements. guess that must be something othr than physics?



Vibration is a part of physics. I'm just asking what others have experienced and their feedback. I have no idea actually about any of this. I'm still a newbie when it comes to big amps. I saw Ray Samuels use isolation feet on his B52 amp. It looked facsinating and the sound was so lush. So I was curious if others do it too.
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 2:23 AM Post #13 of 44

slwiser

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Vibration control certainly effects any component with tubes.
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 3:12 AM Post #14 of 44

mape00

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Quote:

Originally Posted by fzman /img/forum/go_quote.gif
since physics is a branch of science, and science is empirical, shouldn't we prioritize the empirical over the hypotheses? otherwise we are being ad hoc?


There's this quite famous paper by this quite famous guy Fisher that you might be interested in reading. I think something along the lines of his procedure would be more relevant than accelerometers. I mean, I could DEFINITELY detect whether the milk was added before or after by just measuring temperature (milk added before => hotter tea, by a simple thermodynamical argument), but that doesn't mean that I can do what the lady claimed (and proved to Fisher!), only that there is a possible scientific explanation. Just like with your accelerometer data etc.
 
Dec 24, 2008 at 3:51 AM Post #15 of 44

AudioDwebe

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I've used Cereballs under most of my equipment for years. It brought subtle, but noticeable, improvements when placed under all my equipment (tubed preamp, tubed monoblocks, CDP and monitor speakers) individually, as well as collectively. I tried it under an Audio Research phono amp, but due to its light weight, it made no difference in sound.
 

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