Is it really worth getting the he-560 over the he-400i?

[GonzoArtist]

Just sold my Beyerdynamic T-90's after an episode where my ears were left ringing for a few days. I've decided to give Hifiman a try being a big fan of open headphones. My problem is that I can't decide to go with the he-400i or the he-560. Everything I’ve read says that sonically there is not that much of a difference between the two. So I’m throwing this question out there, is the he-560 worth it or am I better off with the he-400i? The he-400i is running around $300 used and I can get the he-560 for $550 used.
 
I will be running them off a Magni 2 and Modi 2 Stack. They will be used equally between music and movies.
 
Thanks!

 

[pbui44]

Just sold my Beyerdynamic T-90's after an episode where my ears were left ringing for a few days. I've decided to give Hifiman a try being a big fan of open headphones. My problem is that I can't decide to go with the he-400i or the he-560. Everything I’ve read says that sonically there is not that much of a difference between the two. So I’m throwing this question out there, is the he-560 worth it or am I better off with the he-400i? The he-400i is running around $300 used and I can get the he-560 for $550 used.

I will be running them off a Magni 2 and Modi 2 Stack. They will be used equally between music and movies.

Thanks!

Since you had ringing in your ears for several days, I recommend picking the HE-400i, as the HE-560 has a generally brighter sound signature.

 

[GonzoArtist]

Thanks! That’s the kind of advice I was looking for. I've also heard that because the HE-400i isn’t as balanced it handles bass a little better than the HE-560. That would also be a plus for me if that’s the case.

 

[TMRaven]

They're not too far apart on technicalities and refinement, though I would give the general nod to the 560 there.
 
The main difference is whether or not you want a different coloration of the sound and want wood veneer on your cups or not. The 400i can be seen as slightly u-shaped compared to the 560, which has less mid-bass emphasis, more energy centered around 4khz, and less of a spike in the treble around 9khz.

 

[GonzoArtist]

At one point in time I was really concerned with appearance, I had a pair of Grado’s and had a lot of fun completely modding them out. Now days I’m more interested in how the headphone actually sounds and less with how they look. If I had to pick a favorite headphone or at least one that I constantly go back to it would be the Beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO’s . They are pretty much the definition of a colored headphone.
 
Thanks for all the input guys, sounds like I’m leaning towards the HE-400i.

 

[Music Alchemist]

Yes, the HE400i is a great value. I auditioned the HE1000 for hours (with all types of music) on a DAC/amp that cost over $4,000...and I honestly thought it sounded only slightly better than my grill-modded HE400i driven by a humble Schiit Fulla.

 

[MLGrado]

Well, I can't exactly say.  BUT, I did go from a 400s to the HE560.  
 
The 400s acquits itself very nicely.  Actually, I probably prefer the tone and balance of the 400s. But, the HE560 is simply just a better headphone.  For instance, enclosure resonances.  The HE560 unfortunately isn't perfect in that regard, but it is miles ahead of the 400s which loves to rattle and vibrate sympathetically with certain mid-centric or upper bass tones.  Also, the BASS response, amount and quality is WAY ahead.  
 
 
Now, how much better is the 400i than the 400s?  I don't know.  Leave that to some one else. 
 
I will say the HE-560 is a very nice set.  Not my final destination, though.  As great as they are, I still feel they leave a little bit on the table.  So I am looking at the next level of phones, the One Grand and up range.

 

[James Myers]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHQnaZFLPHk
could be useful

 

[maul]

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHQnaZFLPHk
could be useful

 
Zeos has said highly questionable things that directly contradict measurements and well-known facts, and he hypes up products to sell with his affiliate links. I would not trust his opinion.

 

[Fearless1]

As an owner of the 400i and the 560, on the same gear, the 560 is a clearer more concise experience, is it 2-300 hundred dollars better, that's up to you/your budget. The 560 is harder to drive and exposes flaws in gear/recordings more then the 400i.

A/Bing between the two a significant difference is realized, but going from audible memory a lesser distinction is noticed.

 

[GonzoArtist]

That video was actually what caused me to start this thread. I wanted to get the pulse of the Head-Fi community with the hope that everyone here wouldn’t have as much of an axe to grind. I don’t mind spending a bit more money on the HE-560 as long as it’s sonically superior. However, based on what everyone has said it seems once you get past the HE-400i you have reached the point of diminishing returns. Having not heard either headphone I think I could be happy with the HE-400i knowing that the HE-560 is only incrementally better.
 
Thanks again for all the advice!

 

[james6333]

Since you had ringing in your ears for several days, I recommend picking the HE-400i, as the HE-560 has a generally brighter sound signature.

Since you had ringing in your ears for several days, I recommend picking the HE-400i, as the HE-560 has a generally brighter sound signature.

This is good advice. I have heard both and the HD-560 is bright in comparision. The 400i will give you longer listening session.

 

[Music Alchemist]

  However, based on what everyone has said it seems once you get past the HE-400i you have reached the point of diminishing returns. Having not heard either headphone I think I could be happy with the HE-400i knowing that the HE-560 is only incrementally better.

 
I'd say diminishing returns kick in at around $10. Seriously. (But only because there are a select few headphones in that price range with performance comparable to some models that cost ten to twenty times as much.) The thing about this phenomenon is that you generally get improvements across the board, in many categories, so even if they are merely incremental, they also add up to something that is significant and immediately noticeable even if it's not a huge leap, ya know? When diminishing returns are mentioned in audiophile circles, there almost seems to be an implication that the improvements are so small that they aren't noticeable or aren't worth it...and I don't think that's true. The increase in sound quality gained from spending more on a headphone can potentially be sufficient enough to result in an experience that is greater than the sum of its parts, so to speak. But you do pay a premium for that. Whether that's worth it is up to the individual.
 
In the future, it would be a great idea to audition headphones at meets and shops. Just check out the meets section along with dealers listed on headphone manufacturer websites. If you put your favorite music that you are most familiar with on a USB flash drive, you can get a better feel for the sound signature of headphones.

 

[520RanchBro]

I switched from the HE-560 from the 400i a little while ago. Still have my 400i but it never gets used. I got my 560 for $450 so the price difference over the 400i is a bit less than for most but it's a no-brainer for me. The 400i's strength is in the mids, vocals sound great and they work very well for guitar-centric music. Bass is still very solid but the 560 wins in my book, deeper and more defined, less mid bass emphasis though. The HE-560 has the advantage of better detail and imaging as well as soundstage, the 400i now sounds downright congested in comparison. But the 560 leans a bit brighter so if you're sensitive to that, maybe be cautious, I don't mind it personally, I like treble.
 
What do you like to listen to? That'll also factor in here. In my case, the 560 has been the best choice. The differences between the two were pretty clear to me. But what kind of sound signature are you looking for? If you're looking for a more warm and relaxed set of headphones, I don't think either are the best choice.

 

[Fearless1]

I switched from the HE-560 from the 400i a little while ago. Still have my 400i but it never gets used. I got my 560 for $450 so the price difference over the 400i is a bit less than for most but it's a no-brainer for me. The 400i's strength is in the mids, vocals sound great and they work very well for guitar-centric music. Bass is still very solid but the 560 wins in my book, deeper and more defined, less mid bass emphasis though. The HE-560 has the advantage of better detail and imaging as well as soundstage, the 400i now sounds downright congested in comparison. But the 560 leans a bit brighter so if you're sensitive to that, maybe be cautious, I don't mind it personally, I like treble.

What do you like to listen to? That'll also factor in here. In my case, the 560 has been the best choice. The differences between the two were pretty clear to me. But what kind of sound signature are you looking for? If you're looking for a more warm and relaxed set of headphones, I don't think either are the best choice.

Exactly. Well stated from someone who actually owns both as well. Not heard at a meet or watched a review online.

Well said.