[Tragic]

Hence the general story, love it or hate it.[/QUOT

1. 
   
   
   
   in general
   Learn to pronounce
   phrase of general
   
   1. 1.
      usually; mainly.
      "in general, Alexander was a peaceful, loving man"
      synonyms: generally, normally, as a (general) rule, in the general run of things, by and large, more often than not, almost always, in the main, mainly, mostly, for the most part, in most cases, most of the time, predominantly, on the whole;
      usually, habitually, customarily, standardly, routinely, regularly, typically, ordinarily, commonly, conventionally, traditionally, historically

 

[szore]

How could you not believe the graphs? It's the FR that the measuring system picks up. You just happen to really like the FR of the CL2. Nothing wrong with that. That would be like telling someone they are wrong for liking spicy food. Own it.

But, don't say that the graphs are wrong. The people that are critical of the CL2 just don't happen to like that FR. There's nothing wrong with them either. If everybody had to like the same thing, there would only be 1 headphone. Where's the fun in that?

So, where is sound stage in a graph? Please point to it. Where is timbre, layering, space between the notes? Coherencey? Please post the graph to your favorite IEM and point to where these elements are shown, I would love to be educated!

 

[Tragic]

So, where is sound stage in a graph? Please point to it. Where is timbre, layering, space between the notes? Coherencey? Please post the graph to your favorite IEM and point to where these elements are shown, I would love to be educated!

Graphs clearly *hear* music better than you.
Just accept that and carry on.
"Resistance is futile" a wise Borg once said.

 

[szore]

Graphs clearly *hear* music better than you.
Just accept that and carry on.
"Resistance is futile" a wise Borg once said.

Ohhh, OK. Thanks for educating me...

ROFL

 

[McMadface]

So, where is sound stage in a graph? Please point to it. Where is timbre, layering, space between the notes? Coherencey? Please post the graph to your favorite IEM and point to where these elements are shown, I would love to be educated!

I never said that soundstage, resolution or other technicalities can be read on a FR graph. You can keep your words in your mouth and out of mine. The FR graph only shows the FR of a whatever is being measured. The graph doesn't lie. It's just a depiction of the data.

The FR of an IEM is the main component of the overall sound signature of the IEM. If I don't like the way something is tuned, I'm not really going to care about how wide it sounds or how coherent it is. The people that hate the CL2 hate it because the FR is really far from anything else on the market. The people that love it just happen to love that FR. I'm just pointing out how stupid it is for anyone to claim that someone from the other group is wrong. People have different preferences. I accept that. Why can't you?

 

[joshnor713]

Just to chime in, because I don't see this being addressed. My problem (and a lot of others) was not particularly the FR but the metallic, unnatural sound at high mids/low treble region. I was disheartened, because I loved everything else about the CL2's reproduction.

Even those who love it say a copper cable is a must. If you need to use a copper cable for an IEM to be excellent, then it's a flawed IEM. RHA messed up if so many people are saying the same thing.

 

[szore]

I never said that soundstage, resolution or other technicalities can be read on a FR graph. You can keep your words in your mouth and out of mine. The FR graph only shows the FR of a whatever is being measured. The graph doesn't lie. It's just a depiction of the data.

The FR of an IEM is the main component of the overall sound signature of the IEM. If I don't like the way something is tuned, I'm not really going to care about how wide it sounds or how coherent it is. The people that hate the CL2 hate it because the FR is really far from anything else on the market. The people that love it just happen to love that FR. I'm just pointing out how stupid it is for anyone to claim that someone from the other group is wrong. People have different preferences. I accept that. Why can't you?

Who cares.

 

[rutter]

So where in the frequency range is the CL2 deviant? What does that sound like? If a cable changes this shouldn't there be multiple frequency range graphs?

 

[McMadface]

Who cares.

You're the one getting all szore about it. You could just ignore me if you didn't care.

 

[McMadface]

So where in the frequency range is the CL2 deviant? What does that sound like? If a cable changes this shouldn't there be multiple frequency range graphs?

It's mostly in the 15 dB rise from 1K to 2.5K and 20 dB drop from 4K to 5K. For the most part, such steep swings don't sound good to a lot of people. Some people love it. You just gotta find what works for you.

 

[pstickne]

So where in the frequency range is the CL2 deviant? What does that sound like? If a cable changes this shouldn't there be multiple frequency range graphs?

There are ‘reasons’ why one doesn’t find FR graphs for cables.. while different cables may alter perception, well, they are generally not doing a whole bunch on graphs.

https://www.lifewire.com/speaker-cables-make-a-difference-3134902

 

[rutter]

You've already demonstrated you aren't very thoughtful. I'm awaiting more responses. For instance, Kitechaser has apparently either been banned or suspended from this thread but he claims this:

The cable does not change the frequency response, it changes tonality. You can change cables and do a Quick A/B comparison.
What the copper cable does do, is it brings in more sub bass, and mid bass, making the mids thicker overall.
And also it smooths over aggressive peaks in some poorly mastered tracks.

https://ask.metafilter.com/218275/How-does-a-tone-relate-to-a-frequency

It's hard for me to judge. Suffice it to say I've heard a bunch of headphones and a few iems and as also appears to be popularly understood the sound is far from defined by a frequency response graph. You could probably get headphones and even iems from disparate tiers, especially headphones as the ceiling is higher and differences are bigger, with similar frequency response graphs that would sound a lot differently. Thus the term "objectivist" here is an insult, and you appear to be an unapologetic one. Guys like you can sound smart but as soon as you retreat from what you deem to be a knowledge base as Aminus demonstrated a couple nights ago you quickly show your colors. Dude came in huffed up and quickly got smacked around on basic logic. It's a shame mods delete posts. The world would be a lot more interesting of a place without them.

 

[pstickne]

You've already demonstrated you aren't very thoughtful. I'm awaiting more responses. For instance, Kitechaser has apparently either been banned or suspended from this thread but he claims this:



https://ask.metafilter.com/218275/How-does-a-tone-relate-to-a-frequency

It's hard for me to judge. Suffice it to say I've heard a bunch of headphones and a few iems and as also appears to be popularly understood the sound is far from defined by a frequency response graph. You could probably get headphones and even iems from disparate tiers, especially headphones as the ceiling is higher and differences are bigger, with similar frequency response graphs that would sound a lot differently. Thus the term "objectivist" here is an insult, and you appear to be an unapologetic one. Guys like you can sound smart but as soon as you retreat from what you deem to be a knowledge base as Aminus demonstrated a couple nights ago you quickly show your colors. Dude came in huffed up and quickly got smacked around on basic logic. It's a shame mods delete posts. The world would be a lot more interesting of a place without them.

It if it’s not on the FR graph, it seems dubious that the “tonality” is physically changed. Perception (as subjective to ones desires and mind-trickery), perhaps. Maybe pick qualities of sound presentation that are “outside” a FR graph..

Like, timbre. Just say you like the timbre better; or soundstage; or decay. Nothing about tonality or FR graphs in that case.

 

[rutter]

I'd say I like timbre better if I knew what the hell it is as distinct from frequency response and tonality. Even none of these things may explain why the HD800S has a far more defined bass than the Audeze LCD-X for instance. Even the link I provided states there's confusion with tonality and timbre. The one thing that's fairly obvious is that there is much more to sound beside a frequency response graph.

 

[gazzington]

Without spending a fortune, can anybody provide me with a link to a copper cable I can use with these iems?