[Allanmarcus]

Had a little time check out the new gear. It all sounded very good. I think I prefer the tube modes of the pro; the SS mode was a bit dry.

 

[bluesaint]

  FYI, in iFi Audio Pro line thread there's some RMAF coverage worth checking out!

Looking that the pic, so the iDSD Pro will have USB3.0 input?  

 

[DC5Zilla]

Super excited about the iDSD pro.  Great to know that it offers 3.5 TRRS balanced output...!
 
If anyone can give feedback with ps1000 or lcd2, that will be lovely

 

[miceblue]

More photos and some impressions later, but for now:

[video]https://youtu.be/RBpNoSbyzwc[/video]

 

[miceblue]

This is pretty much copy-pasta from my RMAF post.

Whew, iFi Audio's booth was a fun visit. They had two tables, one with the classic iFi Audio products, and a second table with their new Pro series products. I was most interested in their iCAN ESL electrostatic energizer, and I brought with me the SR-207 to give it a listen.






Not bad, not bad at all! Usually e-stat energizer products have seemed more of a miss than a hit compared to full-on amplifiers. Energizers rely on an external power amplifier and step-up the voltage to the correct high-voltage bias (580 V for STAX's Pro bias). Uniquely, the iCAN ESL can accept inputs via speaker taps, 4-pin XLR, or...HDMI. What? HDMI? Yes, the same HDMI you use for a TV.

There are a TON of customization options to toggle with on the Pro series products, actually maybe too much. The iDSD and iCAN Pro both have switches to toggle second-order harmonic distortion amount to emulate a tube sound as well as a gain switch; the iCAN Pro has X-Bass and 3D/Crossfeed toggles; the iCAN ESL has an e-stat bias selector, e-stat output selector, input-source selector, as well as an output impedance(?) selector for the regular XLR output. It's pretty confusing, but all I needed to do is select the 580 V bias on the e-stat bias selector, and adjust the volume accordingly.

The second-order harmonic distortion/tube emulator actually sounds pretty nice. At first they were toggled on and I was noticing the SR-207 to sound warmer than I remember. Then I toggled them off and it sounded more like the SR-207 I know. Sound quality-wise the iCAN ESL was more dynamic than my SRM-252S, and it had a blacker background as to make instrument separation more apparent. That being said, I don't know how much of the sound was attributed to the iCAN Pro since the ESL was using the special HDMI input from it. I'd be interested in giving the iCAN ESL a listen with a less synergistic setup.

It was kind of funny when I was at the iFi booth. I was listening to the iCAN ESL with the SR-207 and iFi Audio representatives from Japan happened to visit. They seemed surprised that an actual STAX headphone was being used with the iCAN ESL. Actually, a good handful of people were surprised to see a non-SR-007/009 STAX headphone at all, including the iFi representatives themselves.

I've always liked how iFi Audio and their Skunkwork Laboratories are constantly creating products that would otherwise be really niche for a more affordable price, while looking really pretty and fully-functional. Talking to Vincent at the iFi booth, it was interesting getting to know a little more about their octopus mascot for 8x (octa) DSD, or 512 MHz sampling rates. I'll have to try up-sampling Daft Punk's "Derezzed" song to DSD512 some day!


Anyway, here's a video of Cotnijoe explaining the Pro series stack.

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBpNoSbyzwc[/video]

 

[EVOLVIST]

This is pretty much copy-pasta from my RMAF post.

Whew, iFi Audio's booth was a fun visit. They had two tables, one with the classic iFi Audio products, and a second table with their new Pro series products. I was most interested in their iCAN ESL electrostatic energizer, and I brought with me the SR-207 to give it a listen.






Not bad, not bad at all! Usually e-stat energizer products have seemed more of a miss than a hit compared to full-on amplifiers. Energizers rely on an external power amplifier and step-up the voltage to the correct high-voltage bias (580 V for STAX's Pro bias). Uniquely, the iCAN ESL can accept inputs via speaker taps, 4-pin XLR, or...HDMI. What? HDMI? Yes, the same HDMI you use for a TV.

There are a TON of customization options to toggle with on the Pro series products, actually maybe too much. The iDSD and iCAN Pro both have switches to toggle second-order harmonic distortion amount to emulate a tube sound as well as a gain switch; the iCAN Pro has X-Bass and 3D/Crossfeed toggles; the iCAN ESL has an e-stat bias selector, e-stat output selector, input-source selector, as well as an output impedance(?) selector for the regular XLR output. It's pretty confusing, but all I needed to do is select the 580 V bias on the e-stat bias selector, and adjust the volume accordingly.

The second-order harmonic distortion/tube emulator actually sounds pretty nice. At first they were toggled on and I was noticing the SR-207 to sound warmer than I remember. Then I toggled them off and it sounded more like the SR-207 I know. Sound quality-wise the iCAN ESL was more dynamic than my SRM-252S, and it had a blacker background as to make instrument separation more apparent. That being said, I don't know how much of the sound was attributed to the iCAN Pro since the ESL was using the special HDMI input from it. I'd be interested in giving the iCAN ESL a listen with a less synergistic setup.

It was kind of funny when I was at the iFi booth. I was listening to the iCAN ESL with the SR-207 and iFi Audio representatives from Japan happened to visit. They seemed surprised that an actual STAX headphone was being used with the iCAN ESL. Actually, a good handful of people were surprised to see a non-SR-007/009 STAX headphone at all, including the iFi representatives themselves.

I've always liked how iFi Audio and their Skunkwork Laboratories are constantly creating products that would otherwise be really niche for a more affordable price, while looking really pretty and fully-functional. Talking to Vincent at the iFi booth, it was interesting getting to know a little more about their octopus mascot for 8x (octa) DSD, or 512 MHz sampling rates. I'll have to try up-sampling Daft Punk's "Derezzed" song to DSD512 some day!


Anyway, here's a video of Cotnijoe explaining the Pro series stack.

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBpNoSbyzwc[/video]

Do you remember anything about the specs of the iDSD Pro?

 

[miceblue]

Do you remember anything about the specs of the iDSD Pro?

I wasn't told any specs for it since it, and the iCAN ESL, were essentially last-minute, brand-spanking-new products. They had a cheat-sheet with some of the specs, but I didn't look through them unfortunately.

They're still working on the 2 units, so things can change.

 

[technobear]

They aren't tube emulators. There's actual tubes in there.

It isn't HDMI either. No digital circuitry in the Pro iCAN or the Energiser.

 

[miceblue]

They aren't tube emulators. There's actual tubes in there.

It isn't HDMI either. No digital circuitry in the Pro iCAN or the Energiser.

Ah, you're right about that. Thanks for the correction!

And I think it's an HDMI connector, but not necessarily the typical digital interface.

 

[iFi audio]

Ah, you're right about that. Thanks for the correction!

And I think it's an HDMI connector, but not necessarily the typical digital interface.

Pro iCAN is equipped with an actual tube circuit, based on classic Pro-Audio design. The switch selects a J-Fet first stage (solid state), Tube first stage and if the tube is enabled, it is possible to reduce the negative feedback.
 
Reduced negative feedback trades off an increase in low order harmonics for improved transient response (objective) and some hard to define in objective measurement terms, "improved musicality". 
 
This "improved musicality" is not a result of the increased low order harmonics, instead the increase in low order harmonics is a result of the decreased feedback.

 

[LoganRoss]

Hi IFI Audio,
 
I am about to order a pro and I have some questions (and perhaps some of these can be added to your support FAQ):
 
1) I noticed your specs seem to reference "short duration" peak power rather than continuous power. What is the actual normal use power rating? For 200ohm headphones?  Is it adapting (such as by impedance matching), based on the headphone connected?
 
2) Many higher end headphone amps have a lower output impedance, often 3, or even less than 1. The IC pro has a much higher one. what is the reason/benefit of this design? As a result, should only headphones of a specific ohm rating be used? How about for optimal performance?
 
3) The detailed specs do not discuss use of an output transformer.  Is this a unique design? it would great to understand the innovation. Is it something similar to the Chord Mojo's gain stage (conceptually)?
 
4) What is the impact of using a non balanced source? Do you still get the benefit of balanced output, or does half the circuit (including the corresponding power) go unused as is the case with some other amps?  Currently, my favorite DAC is the Chord Mojo.
 
5) Most other amps seem to require lots of power and use a giant desktop PC style power cord, perhaps to have a heavy enough gauge and shielding in order to avoid noise and interference. What is the technology that enables the pro to avoid these issues/requirements and use a small cord and wallwart (a great thing by the way)?
 
6) I noticed you spec JFets rather than the more commonly used Mosfets. What is the difference?
 
7) the description references that 3d sound and xbass are implemented in an analog manner. When these are switched off, are the related sections of the amp circuit physically bypassed, or is there some processing taking place all of the time?
 
8) Do you have frequency response charts? The lower registers are very important to me and I am curious as to performance in that area.
 
9) Your advertising materials highlight that ifi products leverage technology from the higher end AMR line of products. In the case of the ican pro amp, what are some of the technology that has trickled down?
 
10) Many amplifiers, including headphone amps, are really heavy. Presumably because parts, like transformers and heat sinks, are necessary for great sound. However, technology (and corresponding miniaturization) marches on. What technologies are responsible for your ability to keep the size and weight so low?
 
11) Do you consider the ifi ican pro to be in the same tier as the Audeze King?  In other words, what segment of the personal audio market is the pro directed to?  Performance is relative, and it would be interesting to understand against whom you benchmark.
 
12) Were the published specs based on tube, tube plus, or solid state mode? Assuming only one of these, how do the specs change for the other modes?
 
Really impressed so far with the potential of this product.  Thank you for your time and I look forward to your answers as well as actual listening tests.

 

[EVOLVIST]

Had a little time check out the new gear. It all sounded very good. I think I prefer the tube modes of the pro; the SS mode was a bit dry.

Did you get to check out any of the specs for the iDSD Pro?

 

[Allanmarcus]

Nope. Sorry.

 

[iFi audio]

  Hi IFI Audio,
 
I am about to order a pro and I have some questions (and perhaps some of these can be added to your support FAQ):
 
1) I noticed your specs seem to reference "short duration" peak power rather than continuous power. What is the actual normal use power rating? For 200ohm headphones?  Is it adapting (such as by impedance matching), based on the headphone connected?
 
2) Many higher end headphone amps have a lower output impedance, often 3, or even less than 1. The IC pro has a much higher one. what is the reason/benefit of this design? As a result, should only headphones of a specific ohm rating be used? How about for optimal performance?
 
3) The detailed specs do not discuss use of an output transformer.  Is this a unique design? it would great to understand the innovation. Is it something similar to the Chord Mojo's gain stage (conceptually)?
 
4) What is the impact of using a non balanced source? Do you still get the benefit of balanced output, or does half the circuit (including the corresponding power) go unused as is the case with some other amps?  Currently, my favorite DAC is the Chord Mojo.
 
5) Most other amps seem to require lots of power and use a giant desktop PC style power cord, perhaps to have a heavy enough gauge and shielding in order to avoid noise and interference. What is the technology that enables the pro to avoid these issues/requirements and use a small cord and wallwart (a great thing by the way)?
 
6) I noticed you spec JFets rather than the more commonly used Mosfets. What is the difference?
 
7) the description references that 3d sound and xbass are implemented in an analog manner. When these are switched off, are the related sections of the amp circuit physically bypassed, or is there some processing taking place all of the time?
 
8) Do you have frequency response charts? The lower registers are very important to me and I am curious as to performance in that area.
 
9) Your advertising materials highlight that ifi products leverage technology from the higher end AMR line of products. In the case of the ican pro amp, what are some of the technology that has trickled down?
 
10) Many amplifiers, including headphone amps, are really heavy. Presumably because parts, like transformers and heat sinks, are necessary for great sound. However, technology (and corresponding miniaturization) marches on. What technologies are responsible for your ability to keep the size and weight so low?
 
11) Do you consider the ifi ican pro to be in the same tier as the Audeze King?  In other words, what segment of the personal audio market is the pro directed to?  Performance is relative, and it would be interesting to understand against whom you benchmark.
 
Really impressed so far with the potential of this product.  Thank you for your time and I look forward to your answers as well as actual listening tests.

Lots of cool questions. We'll address them shortly, one by one. Stay tuned!

 

[EVOLVIST]

5) Most other amps seem to require lots of power and use a giant desktop PC style power cord, perhaps to have a heavy enough gauge and shielding in order to avoid noise and interference. What is the technology that enables the pro to avoid these issues/requirements and use a small cord and wallwart (a great thing by the way)?

You know, iFi makes some great switching power supplies that sounds great with iFi gear, but I've been wondering for a while now why DAC and amp manufacturers don't just go with switching DC power supplies, instead of straight AC cables, and let the owner decide what's best for the gear.

I'm other words, even if you don't care for the switching power supply that iFi gives you, you can always go with linear power supply, "audiophile," or otherwise, which might be a little pricy, but much less so than these "ultimate" power cords that are foisted on us from all sides.

A case in point, my microRendu benefited from a linear power supply, at around $400 USD, but other gear, like some of my iFi stuff sounded just fine with the iPower that comes with it. There's the tempation to try linear power supplies with the iFi stuff, and I might just yet, but as a business model, I think the switching power supplies are the way to go. I'm sure it would cut down on some of those snake oil cable companies (though everyine has a right to make a living).