Hugo TT 2 by Chord Electronics - The Official Thread
Oct 2, 2021 at 8:26 AM Post #14,896 of 18,886
It will be very dependant on whether he wants to drive speakers at 18 W, or headphones at a fraction of a Watt.
As far as I know it is neither. His TT2 is connected to an amplifier.

Don’t forget that, last we heard, using an LPS with TT2 would void the warranty

I have never seen any reports of any third party power supply damaging any Chord DAC or Mscaler. Which of course is not to say it hasn’t happened.

Personally I am pretty relaxed about such things and this is my Dave and Mscaler powered by Sean Jacobs ARC6 power supplies. 😜

54183810-4F56-4247-927E-8483810910E2.jpeg
 
Oct 2, 2021 at 11:08 AM Post #14,897 of 18,886
As far as I know it is neither. His TT2 is connected to an amplifier.



I have never seen any reports of any third party power supply damaging any Chord DAC or Mscaler. Which of course is not to say it hasn’t happened.

Personally I am pretty relaxed about such things and this is my Dave and Mscaler powered by Sean Jacobs ARC6 power supplies. 😜

54183810-4F56-4247-927E-8483810910E2.jpeg
I think we’re going to need a bigger boat table!
 
Oct 2, 2021 at 7:51 PM Post #14,899 of 18,886
Just bought a pair of Dekoni’s Elite sheepskin earpads ( thanks to @ZappaMan ) for my Aeon Closed headphones, what can I say, they completely transform the headphones which were too bright and lacking in bass to begin with. The new pads adds more bass to the headphones and I can now use them in my tt2, instead of being solely confined to my mojo.

2 years I have waited for something to come along to transform them and dekoni sheepskin earpads has done just that. I love all of my @DekoniAudio earpads for all my headphones
 
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Oct 2, 2021 at 8:03 PM Post #14,900 of 18,886
A friend is considering using a LPS with his TT2 but wonders how many amps the TT2 draws. I sold my TT2 a while ago so I cannot measure it but I wondered if anyone on here knows the answer for him?

Thanks.

why use a linear ps instead of a battery, wouldnt the battery be the best sounding one ? Also doesn’t the lps pump out a lot of rfi ?

mscaler and tt2 wise, rob did alot of psu hunting and he chose the best psu for the job, why do people go against the designers instructions ?
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 5:15 AM Post #14,901 of 18,886
Hi,
Just purchased a Hugo TT2 and have a slight concern. The two rear RCA outputs are rock solid in the casing but the external DX R connector has a small amout of vertical play/movement, as does the left BNC in, but to a lesser degree. Am I being picky or should I be concerned there is a loose connection inside. I'm not using the connectors so cant test to see if there is a connection issue but may consider a M Scaler in the future !
Long drive back to my retailer so any advice from owners would be appreciated !
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 5:46 AM Post #14,902 of 18,886
why use a linear ps instead of a battery, wouldnt the battery be the best sounding one ? Also doesn’t the lps pump out a lot of rfi ?

mscaler and tt2 wise, rob did alot of psu hunting and he chose the best psu for the job, why do people go against the designers instructions ?

Many have tested with other LPS and come to the conclusion that a really good PSU can enhance sound of Chords DACs. The problem is that the ones that sounds better also cost a lot.

If battery really was the best solution HIFI manufacturer would use them in DACs and streamers, but like everything else battery have their pros and disadvantages.

A good quality LPS isn't pumping out a lot of RFI.
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 10:31 AM Post #14,903 of 18,886
Many have tested with other LPS and come to the conclusion that a really good PSU can enhance sound of Chords DACs. The problem is that the ones that sounds better also cost a lot.

If battery really was the best solution HIFI manufacturer would use them in DACs and streamers, but like everything else battery have their pros and disadvantages.

A good quality LPS isn't pumping out a lot of RFI.

So I can stop carrying 2 lead acid car batteries with me when I go out with my mojo. :wink:

Get yo ass to ma’s, I got 4 kids to feed, what happened to number 5 ? ah schitt you got me.

Sorry, I can’t stop quoting arnie in total recall, next sunday it will be quotes from groupies galore.:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 2:01 PM Post #14,904 of 18,886
why use a linear ps instead of a battery, wouldnt the battery be the best sounding one ? Also doesn’t the lps pump out a lot of rfi ?

mscaler and tt2 wise, rob did alot of psu hunting and he chose the best psu for the job, why do people go against the designers instructions ?
Amber,
1. Having tried them I and others have found that batteries are not the best for sound quality. Of course I accept that there are many types of battery but for instance with my Qutest the battery was beaten fair and square by a good LPS.
2. No, LPS do not ‘pump out a lot of RFI’. I think it has been suggested that the transformers used in LPS do little to isolate mains rfi from the device but that is a different matter and in any case does not seem to be an issue in real terms, at least not with the LPS that I use.
3. Rob did a lot of choosing to select the best smps with each device but I and many other people are not easily parted with our money and yet we are prepared to spend significant amounts of it having heard the very real sound quality improvements by using a top quality LPS. MInd you I can only speak for the Mscaler, Qutest and Dave because those are what I have owned and used (and still use) with an after market LPS. When I owned the TT2 I always used it with the supplied smps but only because I never got around to trying it with an LPS due to its short period of ownership.
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 2:27 PM Post #14,905 of 18,886
I fail to see how a LPS can supply cleaner power than a battery. As long as the battery (not battery pak) is sized properly to supply transient loads without folding. Besides the power supply for the TT2 is internal. If one wants to see if the supplied smps has an effect on sound, simply pull the plug from the back of the TT2 and listen for 20-30 sec from internal power only. Other equipment ymmv.
 
Oct 3, 2021 at 3:28 PM Post #14,906 of 18,886
I fail to see how a LPS can supply cleaner power than a battery. As long as the battery (not battery pak) is sized properly to supply transient loads without folding. Besides the power supply for the TT2 is internal. If one wants to see if the supplied smps has an effect on sound, simply pull the plug from the back of the TT2 and listen for 20-30 sec from internal power only. Other equipment ymmv.
You can repeat this over and over, and @Rob Watts can as well, but people will go on and on about power supplies. Like you said, the TT2 has internal power supply and all you are doing is charging that power supply with whatever you use at the back.
 
Oct 4, 2021 at 1:24 AM Post #14,907 of 18,886
Amber,
1. Having tried them I and others have found that batteries are not the best for sound quality. Of course I accept that there are many types of battery but for instance with my Qutest the battery was beaten fair and square by a good LPS.
2. No, LPS do not ‘pump out a lot of RFI’. I think it has been suggested that the transformers used in LPS do little to isolate mains rfi from the device but that is a different matter and in any case does not seem to be an issue in real terms, at least not with the LPS that I use.
3. Rob did a lot of choosing to select the best smps with each device but I and many other people are not easily parted with our money and yet we are prepared to spend significant amounts of it having heard the very real sound quality improvements by using a top quality LPS. MInd you I can only speak for the Mscaler, Qutest and Dave because those are what I have owned and used (and still use) with an after market LPS. When I owned the TT2 I always used it with the supplied smps but only because I never got around to trying it with an LPS due to its short period of ownership.

I am sorry but I am going to completely disagree with you over this one.

A little background to this; just as Covid started I wanted to design the best possible RF filter using SPICE simulation. I modelled PCB traces, internal parasitic capacitance, resistance and inductance to all the filter components, and set myself the target of eliminating RF noise from 100kHz to 10GHz - the areas that we have subjective problems with. I then set the task of making the RF noise OP to be sub 10 pico volts, using typical measured levels of RF noise as the input. Firstly I used a switcher voltage - indicative of the noise from a quality switched mode PSU. This was extremely easy to eliminate the switching noise - just a simple 3 stage RF filter, something I fit in all of my designs. But the real issue became when I replaced the input with a typical switcher voltage to one of random RF noise. And to eliminate that was a complete nightmare - it ended up being a very complex design, as it's almost impossible to remove random RF noise down to pico volt levels.

Why the issue of random noise? The problem is noise floor modulation, and this is caused by any non-linearity in the signal path with random RF noise, as this creates intermodulation distortion, the products of which is random with a white noise spectrum from DC to 10GHz - but it's the audio component to this that gives you the noise floor modulation. But if you use a switching component only, this creates discrete frequencies which are outside the audio bandwidth, so are not directly audible - so switching RF noise is easy to filter, and has a smaller subjective consequence too as it does not add to noise floor modulation at all.

And noise floor modulation is very, very audible - my recent research and listening tests indicates that even noise floor modulation as low as -350dB is perceivable under single blind conditions. Which basically means any noise floor modulation, no matter how small, will change your perception of timbre. Adding noise floor modulation makes it sound brighter with an entirely artificial sense of transparency, which may sound impressive on an AB listening test but will damage musicality (as timbre variation is suppressed) and increase listening fatigue.

Audiophile linear PSUs have no RF filters built into them, and so let in random RF noise from the mains. SMPS on the other hand, employ multiple RF filters and so suppress random RF noise. Batteries have almost zero RF noise (a 12v car battery is particularly good). The mains power has large levels of random RF noise from any device that has a processor, to florescent light bulbs (any plasma creates wideband random RF noise), so using a battery will completely isolate you from mains random RF noise.

So using a LPS categorically will increase noise floor modulation, giving you a brighter sound quality and degrading musicality; if you prefer that sound then so be it, but you are "preferring" distortion.

I fail to see how a LPS can supply cleaner power than a battery. As long as the battery (not battery pak) is sized properly to supply transient loads without folding. Besides the power supply for the TT2 is internal. If one wants to see if the supplied smps has an effect on sound, simply pull the plug from the back of the TT2 and listen for 20-30 sec from internal power only. Other equipment ymmv.

Absolutely - even more so if you use a 300A car battery - zero RF noise, huge levels of dynamic currents. But the tweakers will still prefer their LPS - just random RF noise sources to artificially spice up the sound.
 
Oct 4, 2021 at 5:47 AM Post #14,908 of 18,886
I am sorry but I am going to completely disagree with you over this one.

A little background to this; just as Covid started I wanted to design the best possible RF filter using SPICE simulation. I modelled PCB traces, internal parasitic capacitance, resistance and inductance to all the filter components, and set myself the target of eliminating RF noise from 100kHz to 10GHz - the areas that we have subjective problems with. I then set the task of making the RF noise OP to be sub 10 pico volts, using typical measured levels of RF noise as the input. Firstly I used a switcher voltage - indicative of the noise from a quality switched mode PSU. This was extremely easy to eliminate the switching noise - just a simple 3 stage RF filter, something I fit in all of my designs. But the real issue became when I replaced the input with a typical switcher voltage to one of random RF noise. And to eliminate that was a complete nightmare - it ended up being a very complex design, as it's almost impossible to remove random RF noise down to pico volt levels.

Why the issue of random noise? The problem is noise floor modulation, and this is caused by any non-linearity in the signal path with random RF noise, as this creates intermodulation distortion, the products of which is random with a white noise spectrum from DC to 10GHz - but it's the audio component to this that gives you the noise floor modulation. But if you use a switching component only, this creates discrete frequencies which are outside the audio bandwidth, so are not directly audible - so switching RF noise is easy to filter, and has a smaller subjective consequence too as it does not add to noise floor modulation at all.

And noise floor modulation is very, very audible - my recent research and listening tests indicates that even noise floor modulation as low as -350dB is perceivable under single blind conditions. Which basically means any noise floor modulation, no matter how small, will change your perception of timbre. Adding noise floor modulation makes it sound brighter with an entirely artificial sense of transparency, which may sound impressive on an AB listening test but will damage musicality (as timbre variation is suppressed) and increase listening fatigue.

Audiophile linear PSUs have no RF filters built into them, and so let in random RF noise from the mains. SMPS on the other hand, employ multiple RF filters and so suppress random RF noise. Batteries have almost zero RF noise (a 12v car battery is particularly good). The mains power has large levels of random RF noise from any device that has a processor, to florescent light bulbs (any plasma creates wideband random RF noise), so using a battery will completely isolate you from mains random RF noise.

So using a LPS categorically will increase noise floor modulation, giving you a brighter sound quality and degrading musicality; if you prefer that sound then so be it, but you are "preferring" distortion.



Absolutely - even more so if you use a 300A car battery - zero RF noise, huge levels of dynamic currents. But the tweakers will still prefer their LPS - just random RF noise sources to artificially spice up the sound.
Is the tt2 a 3 amp device? I think the supplier psu is 3 amp..
 
Oct 4, 2021 at 9:58 AM Post #14,909 of 18,886
Don’t forget that, last we heard, using an LPS with TT2 would void the warranty

It seems to be a favourite topic here, folk posting in the open telling folk that they use either batteries or third party psu’s.

If it schitts the bed, they will send it back to chord and claim that they only ever used the stock psu.

If i was chord, I would watch this thread very carefully and take names of folk who post that they use whatever non stock psu.
 
Oct 6, 2021 at 1:14 PM Post #14,910 of 18,886
Anyone using Crossfeed with the Susvara's? Initially I had it set to 0 as crossfeed narrows the soundstage a bit. With the Arya's crossfeed destroyed its special sauce in soundstage. But I was messing with Crossfeed 2 & 3 yesterday with the susvara's and while it did decrease soundstage width the music has more bass emphasis, increased PRAT, just felt a bit more engaging ... anyone has similar experiences?
 

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