[musickid]

The truth is that until 2M taps is realised we can gossip all we want. We won't know until it does become a reality.

 

[ray-dude]

Had a nice chuckle imagining TSA agents looking at Chord's distinctive gear. Just look like trouble (wonder if they were inclined to disassemble or if x-rays were enough). Throw in ferrited BNC cables, we're talking definite explosives. Thank goodness for the interweb. You must be a smooth talker. Would be fun to hear "greatest hits" from TSA agents.

You hear any of the horn-induced "cupped hand" coloration on vocals Jonathan Valin mentioned in his TAS review? Wondering how you landed on the AC-4D versus the AC-PiND or AC-Xp field coil and not finding much information on the distinctions between these drivers?

That's a kind audition offer.

I'm a bit hesitant to speak too much about speakers on a HMS topic, but I strongly believe that there is a special (magical?) match between mScaled music and these single high efficiency drivers. The tonal balance issues may not work for everyone, but I urge everyone with mScaler to seek out some of these speakers and hear them direct. You'll hear what mScaler is capable of, even if the compromises of the approach don't work for you.

$$ don't have to be insane. The Omega SAMs are in the $1800/pair range (with a crazy generous return policy), and you can get up to $70k/pair range for the insane Vox hybrid drivers. All have the same magic for me, but you get more as you step up drivers (I still content that Omegsa SAMs driven direct from Hugo2/TT2/DAVE is one of the best values in audio...incredible).

To give more background, these ultra high efficiency transducers mean that it takes extremely little power to displace the cone of the speaker. The obvious benefit is that you only need 1W or so of power to drive to a reasonable level, which means you can drive direct from your Chord DAC without any transparency robbing amp in the chain. But that is only part of the story.

The non-obvious benefit of these drivers is how well suited the are to the ultra low noise floor of Chord DACs and the incredible timing precision with mScaler. The combination is the most revealing and detailed and subtle and holographic presentation I've ever heard. All the nuance and detail and precision and huge dynamic range that the Chord DACs produce is translated to the transducer with no amp or cross over or switches to smear anything or take away things from the mScaler. The ultrahigh efficiency for me is less about being able to drive direct from Dave (and Hugo2), although that is sort of the price of entry for me, but rather about next level speed and precision and responsiveness to what is coming from the DAC. Ultra ultra revealing, a holographic X-ray into everything the recording has to share.

As an example of hearing things I've never heard before, when I first got my 9.87s, after some system tuning I was listening to some tracks, and I was actually startled by the strike on a drum/cymbil. I had listened to this track umpteen times before and never had that response. The startle reflex is deep deep deep in the lizard brain. The signal doesn't even get to the main brain (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startle_response if you want to read up about it). Here I was now getting a hint of it with mScaled music and the Vox 4D drivers (at the time the top of the line at 103dB efficiency, but the newer 4phi drivers have 106dB efficiency). However, it is only a hint, and only on some recordings. I'm hopeful with Davina, we'll see if our speakers can reproduce that same presence and startle reflex you experience when standing next to a real drum kit (I suspect the recording microphones and ADCs may be the limiter right now). I took this as a measure that the speed and responsiveness of the driver was beyond anything I've heard before.

Of course, the real impact of all this amazing speed and precision is that all the mScaled magic (vocals, strings, horns, etc) are next level, and the Pi bass drivers do a REMARKABLE job of recreating the sense of space that you get in a cathedral or concert hall, and really dimensionalize the physicality of a piano (if you stood next to a proper grand piano, you'll know what I mean when I say you're enveloped by the whole of the piano, and the space around you...that's what I'm talking about)

With the Vox's and the right recording, it feels like I'm sitting with the performers, experiencing the performance. All the power and RF and mechanical tweaks I'm doing right now are inviting more and more artists and bands into my living room for a performance. Love it.

To Nick's and @birdlandbill 's questions, these are compromised speakers. With clean power and RF, that shout that Valin is talking about is gone (the Omegas are less sensitive). As the sound clean up, that sense of sibilance that these types of drivers can have fades back and disappears. There are still tonal balance issues (you can't have a flat frequency response with a single driver). These don't bother me because I've learned that my brain can very quickly adjust to tonal balance quirks and not notice them any more, but that I'm ultra sensitive to phase coherence and timing and I never adjust to those not being there. The example I have used here before is walking on the street by a coffee shop and knowing there is a live musician playing inside. The tonality and muffled sound is objectively awful, but your brain knows its a real person and not a CD. I get that with my setup, and am a full on addict.

The 9.87's with the Pi bass units have huge presence, and DAVE can drive them way louder than I care to listen. That being said, large scale orchestral pieces were more physically there with my B&W 802d3's. They just feel more real with my Vox's. On a well recorded orchestral piece, I can pick out individual players and place them in space, not just sections. With orchestral pieces, I can sometimes tell which row signers are in, and what height. The sense of standing in front of the performers and being enveloped by the space of the recording is euphoric and intoxicating. Love it. However, if you want that giant church organ to knock your hair back, it will be short of what you would expect with summit class full range speakers with summit amps.

I have heard the Vox field coil drivers (basically a big electro magnet for the drivers) but have not heard the $65k hybrid drivers. I loved the field coils, but you give up some of the amazing speed and transparency of the 4D/4phi drivers to get a more organic and luxurious sound (think listening with the ultimate tube amp). I loved what I heard, but I prefer the Nd drivers. If you're a sucker for the tube sound, you'll likely lean toward the field coil drivers.

For those of us that are compelled by transparency and presence (and most Chord lovers I've met tend to fall in that group), my goto recommendation for bang for the buck is Omega SAMs, Hugo2 (or TT2 or DAVE if you can swing it), Hugo mScaler (if you can swing it), and a Vox z Bass unit (baby brother of the bass units on my 9.87's). If you love that, consider stepping up the Voxativ line, but audition first!!! (San Diego is a great place to visit For me the economics worked out great., since I was able to swap out my B&Ws and amps for my 9.87's and basically break even. Made the decision easy for me.

That being said, this type of speaker is definitely not for everyone. If you're a power/physicality person, traditional full range speakers and big ass amps will probably be better for you. The experience of these types of speakers driven direct is well worth seeking out though.

 

[musickid]

What would be quite interesting is using a phone to wirelessly send a signal to a 2go/hugo2 connected to a Omega SAM from the comfort of your armchair. Magic.

 

[birdlandbill]

I'm a bit hesitant to speak too much about speakers on a HMS topic, but I strongly believe that there is a special (magical?) match between mScaled music and these single high efficiency drivers. The tonal balance issues may not work for everyone, but I urge everyone with mScaler to seek out some of these speakers and hear them direct. You'll hear what mScaler is capable of, even if the compromises of the approach don't work for you.

$$ don't have to be insane. The Omega SAMs are in the $1800/pair range (with a crazy generous return policy), and you can get up to $70k/pair range for the insane Vox hybrid drivers. All have the same magic for me, but you get more as you step up drivers (I still content that Omegsa SAMs driven direct from Hugo2/TT2/DAVE is one of the best values in audio...incredible).

To give more background, these ultra high efficiency transducers mean that it takes extremely little power to displace the cone of the speaker. The obvious benefit is that you only need 1W or so of power to drive to a reasonable level, which means you can drive direct from your Chord DAC without any transparency robbing amp in the chain. But that is only part of the story.

The non-obvious benefit of these drivers is how well suited the are to the ultra low noise floor of Chord DACs and the incredible timing precision with mScaler. The combination is the most revealing and detailed and subtle and holographic presentation I've ever heard. All the nuance and detail and precision and huge dynamic range that the Chord DACs produce is translated to the transducer with no amp or cross over or switches to smear anything or take away things from the mScaler. The ultrahigh efficiency for me is less about being able to drive direct from Dave (and Hugo2), although that is sort of the price of entry for me, but rather about next level speed and precision and responsiveness to what is coming from the DAC. Ultra ultra revealing, a holographic X-ray into everything the recording has to share.

As an example of hearing things I've never heard before, when I first got my 9.87s, after some system tuning I was listening to some tracks, and I was actually startled by the strike on a drum/cymbil. I had listened to this track umpteen times before and never had that response. The startle reflex is deep deep deep in the lizard brain. The signal doesn't even get to the main brain (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startle_response if you want to read up about it). Here I was now getting a hint of it with mScaled music and the Vox 4D drivers (at the time the top of the line at 103dB efficiency, but the newer 4phi drivers have 106dB efficiency). However, it is only a hint, and only on some recordings. I'm hopeful with Davina, we'll see if our speakers can reproduce that same presence and startle reflex you experience when standing next to a real drum kit (I suspect the recording microphones and ADCs may be the limiter right now). I took this as a measure that the speed and responsiveness of the driver was beyond anything I've heard before.

Of course, the real impact of all this amazing speed and precision is that all the mScaled magic (vocals, strings, horns, etc) are next level, and the Pi bass drivers do a REMARKABLE job of recreating the sense of space that you get in a cathedral or concert hall, and really dimensionalize the physicality of a piano (if you stood next to a proper grand piano, you'll know what I mean when I say you're enveloped by the whole of the piano, and the space around you...that's what I'm talking about)

With the Vox's and the right recording, it feels like I'm sitting with the performers, experiencing the performance. All the power and RF and mechanical tweaks I'm doing right now are inviting more and more artists and bands into my living room for a performance. Love it.

To Nick's and @birdlandbill 's questions, these are compromised speakers. With clean power and RF, that shout that Valin is talking about is gone (the Omegas are less sensitive). As the sound clean up, that sense of sibilance that these types of drivers can have fades back and disappears. There are still tonal balance issues (you can't have a flat frequency response with a single driver). These don't bother me because I've learned that my brain can very quickly adjust to tonal balance quirks and not notice them any more, but that I'm ultra sensitive to phase coherence and timing and I never adjust to those not being there. The example I have used here before is walking on the street by a coffee shop and knowing there is a live musician playing inside. The tonality and muffled sound is objectively awful, but your brain knows its a real person and not a CD. I get that with my setup, and am a full on addict.

The 9.87's with the Pi bass units have huge presence, and DAVE can drive them way louder than I care to listen. That being said, large scale orchestral pieces were more physically there with my B&W 802d3's. They just feel more real with my Vox's. On a well recorded orchestral piece, I can pick out individual players and place them in space, not just sections. With orchestral pieces, I can sometimes tell which row signers are in, and what height. The sense of standing in front of the performers and being enveloped by the space of the recording is euphoric and intoxicating. Love it. However, if you want that giant church organ to knock your hair back, it will be short of what you would expect with summit class full range speakers with summit amps.

I have heard the Vox field coil drivers (basically a big electro magnet for the drivers) but have not heard the $65k hybrid drivers. I loved the field coils, but you give up some of the amazing speed and transparency of the 4D/4phi drivers to get a more organic and luxurious sound (think listening with the ultimate tube amp). I loved what I heard, but I prefer the Nd drivers. If you're a sucker for the tube sound, you'll likely lean toward the field coil drivers.

For those of us that are compelled by transparency and presence (and most Chord lovers I've met tend to fall in that group), my goto recommendation for bang for the buck is Omega SAMs, Hugo2 (or TT2 or DAVE if you can swing it), Hugo mScaler (if you can swing it), and a Vox z Bass unit (baby brother of the bass units on my 9.87's). If you love that, consider stepping up the Voxativ line, but audition first!!! (San Diego is a great place to visit For me the economics worked out great., since I was able to swap out my B&Ws and amps for my 9.87's and basically break even. Made the decision easy for me.

That being said, this type of speaker is definitely not for everyone. If you're a power/physicality person, traditional full range speakers and big ass amps will probably be better for you. The experience of these types of speakers driven direct is well worth seeking out though.

Much obliged for this excellent context-sensitive review. Finding speakers that fully complement HMS + Dave without requiring an amplifier seems completely relevant to this thread. I was curious about whether HMS + Dave ameliorated the speaker limitations. Sounds like it's a bit more complicated. Thank you for sharing the fruits of your extensive experience.

 

[austinpop]

Good news is for those that can make it out to Southern California, you don’t have to haul your Chord stack through airport security if you want to hear the combination...I have all that setup already

Absolutely correct, and it was a pleasure to hear Ray's system - not to mention that he is a very gracious host!

 

[ray-dude]

Absolutely correct, and it was a pleasure to hear Ray's system - not to mention that he is a very gracious host!

It was a pleasure to have you over Rajiv! If you’re at RMAF this year, please drop a note. It would be great to catch up (my experience with my Paul Hynes SR4-19 has been incredible...makes me crazy excited for my SR7, but I’ll have to content myself with hearing about yours

 

[ray-dude]

Much obliged for this excellent context-sensitive review. Finding speakers that fully complement HMS + Dave without requiring an amplifier seems completely relevant to this thread. I was curious about whether HMS + Dave ameliorated the speaker limitations. Sounds like it's a bit more complicated. Thank you for sharing the fruits of your extensive experience.

For me, absolutely! Vox's are incredible, and the combination is well beyond anything I could have even imagined I'd be able to hear and enjoy. After hearing Mojo the first time, it started a process where literally everything in my system got swapped out, first with Dave+Blu2, but then Omega SAMs then Vox's, then digital and power that are worthy of this incredible combination.

Enough folks have come through the house that I can pretty quickly tell if someone's brain is wired for a different type of emotional connection to music than mine is, but I've also definitely seen a trend that those that are most passionate about the Chord magic seem to have the most affinity to what these high efficiency single driver speakers can do in combination with Chord DACs. If you have a chance to give the Omega SAMs a listen and love them (and Louis is incredibly helpful and generous in making sure you get speakers you're passionate about), the entry level Voxativ's pick up right where the Omega SAMs leave off, and it is only (way) up from there.

As always, the proof is in the listening. What matters for any of us is what reproduction chain is most effective at connecting to your brain and your passions. At this level, the quality of reproduction is so crazy objectively high that the "psycho" is way more important to optimize around than the "acoustics".

 

[austinpop]

It was a pleasure to have you over Rajiv! If you’re at RMAF this year, please drop a note. It would be great to catch up (my experience with my Paul Hynes SR4-19 has been incredible...makes me crazy excited for my SR7, but I’ll have to content myself with hearing about yours

Thanks Ray! Sadly, I will not be able to make it to RMAF this year, in its new venue.

Meanwhile, if you look at my sig, you'll see I've also been optimizing my HMS/TT2 bit by bit.

 

[zenlisten]

Received the WAVE cables today. Have been listening to music for half an hour. The occasional subtle electric pops still occur but they seem to be reduced in power a little bit.
I have to keep experimenting what is causing the issue by moving the system to other rooms and houses. Maybe this M Scaler unit or PSUs are defective?

 

[zenlisten]

Received the WAVE cables today. Have been listening to music for half an hour. The occasional subtle electric pops still occur but they seem to be reduced in power a little bit.
I have to keep experimenting what is causing the issue by moving the system to other rooms and houses. Maybe this M Scaler unit or PSUs are defective?

I did a simple change an hour ago and now it looks like the mystery has been solved, and the occasional subtle pops have disappeared for good. \o/

The simple change was removing the PSUs from the little shelf under the back of the desk and placing them on the desk. This has move them apart from each other and from the bult-in lifting electronics of the desk and some cables running there. Not clear what exactly was causing the issue so I still need to experiment to find out the actual source of these subtle pops.

How stupid of me! I should have thought about this.

 

[Amberlamps]

What would be quite interesting is using a phone to wirelessly send a signal to a 2go/hugo2 connected to a Omega SAM from the comfort of your armchair. Magic.

Roon or Jriver on Nuc > mscaler > TT2 > Jremote or Roon App = Audio Bliss.

Used to also do nuc to chromecrapaudio to hugo 2, but Hugo 2 has gone away, so now I just use mojo n poly.

The nuc was one of my best buys, as I hated having my pc on just to listen to some tunes, and I hated a hardwired solution from phone to dac.

But now with my nuc on 24/7 just pumping out tunes and plex, I couldn't be happier, as all of my previous server builds were always noisy and could not be on all the time, but my nuc is

 

[Amberlamps]

Received the WAVE cables today. Have been listening to music for half an hour. The occasional subtle electric pops still occur but they seem to be reduced in power a little bit.
I have to keep experimenting what is causing the issue by moving the system to other rooms and houses. Maybe this M Scaler unit or PSUs are defective?

Glad you figured it out

Something thats just started on my TT2, it's making a clicking noise from inside the box, whether I'm playing music or even if TT2 is turned off and in standby mode and not in use.

It sounds like the clicks you hear from a modem when you first turn a modem on. It sounds like "click on click off. A short pause before the second click.

Anyone know what that could be ? It's a mechanical like noise, meaning it's not transmitted up into the headphones. It's something inside TT2's box thats clicking.

Also, this is starting to bug me now, but two remotes, both my Hugo 2 and TT2 remotes which are identical, at times the remotes are changing settings on my mscaler instead of TT2. ???

I never use the mscaler remote, so when TT2's remote changes a setting on the mscaler, I have to get up and go get the mscaler remote to set it back to usb mode.

Anyone got info, @Rob Watts ?

 

[STR-1]

(my experience with my Paul Hynes SR4-19 has been incredible..

Do tell us more.

Meanwhile, if you look at my sig, you'll see I've also been optimizing my HMS/TT2 bit by bit.

What do you think of the Farad Super3 compared to the other supplies you’ve had use of?

 

[ray-dude]

Out of respect for our host (who has asked to not have alternative power supply discussions in this sponsored forum), I suggest these types of discussions be over PM. There are also quite active discussions on on this and similar topics other computer audiophile sites (and that's enough delicate forum dancing for one day

 

[austinpop]

What do you think of the Farad Super3 compared to the other supplies you’ve had use of?

Described here.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...udio-streaming/?do=findComment&comment=975720

Per Ray's excellent point above, let's move further discussion of PSUs elsewhere.