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Hugo M Scaler by Chord Electronics - The Official Thread

Discussion in 'High-end Audio Forum' started by ChordElectronics, Jul 25, 2018.
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  1. HumanMedia
    Sorry if its been mentioned in the thread already, but how much influence does USB cabling have on the M Scaler input?
    I usually assume that the further away from the DAC the less influence it has, but then Im proven wrong when I try changing it.

    After trying lots of USB cables into the Qutest, I settled on a cheap Oyaide which beat cables many times its price. But I do like the Chord cables and have often thought of trying the higher end Chord USB
     
  2. Mediahound

    The manual itself says don't bother with fancy USB cables as it's already USB optimized, galvanically, etc.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2019
  3. Whazzzup
    I had oyaide 5s continental which had no difference than audio quest diamond, at least not discernible. I liked both, but stepped up to sarum when i got my server, i enjoyed it more. But hey thats me in mine
     
  4. ray-dude
    I have a Lush^2, and it made a modest but nice audible difference (over generic USB).

    When I put an ISORegen between Lush^2 and HMS, very nice lift in SQ. When I added an Uptone LPS 1.2 to power the ISO Regen (and by the Vbus transitive property) and to power the GI in the HMS, big big lift. I highly recommend people audition the ISO Regen and LPS 1.2 as a pair (Alex has 30 day free returns on both)
     
  5. Triode User
    Ray, can you describe the changes in sound quality that you refer to as nice lift in sound quality and big big lift in sound quality?
     
  6. ray-dude
    Nick, all the classic soundstage expansion cues: better height resolution, then adding in significant more depth resolution, more relaxed presentation. Absolutely delightful (and a delightful surprise to know that there is even more SQ to reveal...mScaler is the gift that keeps on giving).

    I have been hearing similar things with my end point experiments: NUC running real time OS (Audio Linux) in memory with Squeezelite with extremely large memory buffers on the network side and the ALSA driver side. The SQ lift from these experiments (significant) is very similar to what I hear with the ISORegen/LPS 1.2 combination. In fact, by chance I had 2 ISO Regens in house, and when I put them in series, it is the closest I've come to not hearing a difference with the end point optimizations I've been doing (which is awesome).

    Clean power on Vbus to HMS has great intuitive appeal to me (LPS 1.2 on the ISO Regen), and I get squint my eyes and say "yeah, that makes sense that it makes a difference". The only hypothesis I have for how the hell real time end point optimizations or multiple USB signal regeneration steps can be so audible is some sort of signal integrity induced noise on the USB receiver side. If ever there was a clutching at straws hypothesis, this is it. Much more thinking and experimenting to do to see what is really going on, but the pragmatic result is awesome.

    In the interim, Alex and team are extremely generous with their home trial set up (pay for shipping, try it for 30 days). If others try ISORegen and LPS 1.2 with their mScaler setups, please share your experiences. I don't know how much of what I'm hearing is unique to my setup and house, and what may be tickling at a more general noise vector. I look forward to hearing what other people are hearing.
     
    wswbd, Paul Bjernklo and simorag like this.
  7. Gibson59
    Quick question... so Mscaler takes a 44.1 file and makes it sound high resolution (I know this isn’t the most accurate or eloquent way to explain what Mscaler does)... if compared to a native high res file of the same resolution will the Mscaled file and the native high res file sound the same?

    Doesn’t high-res mean more data in the file (less data loss?). How can Mscaler bring more data out of a 44.1 file that doesn’t have much to begin with? Clearly I don’t have a deep understanding of how this works but I’m trying to gain one.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  8. Mediahound
    It's still better. Why? Because the M Scaler still scales up high resolution files to either 705kHz or 768Khz files. But lets say you have a 705 or 768 native high res. file (not many do), the M Scaler will just pass those through and not do anything. Anything lower though will benefit.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
    514077 likes this.
  9. Gibson59
    This I know... I guess I’m asking for a more detailed explanation of what the Mscaler is doing to the file... extracting more data from it? Lessening the amount of data that’s lost? And whichever (or both) it’s doing, at the exact same rate of resolution in theory would the files sound the same or different if they were a native high-res file or if it was upscaled by the mscaler?

    Hopefully I’m explaining my question adequately. I’m not questioning Mscaler’s ability, just trying to better understand what exactly is happening from a technological standpoint.
     
  10. Mediahound
    Others will have a more technical answer but basically all digital files are recreated back to the original analog signal with some degree of accuracy. The M Scaler does this to a higher degree of accuracy.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  11. x RELIC x Contributor
    Rob hopefully will chime in and explain it better, but think about the WTA filter and TAPs that are reconstructing the analogue signal beyond what the data is upsampled to. You must fill in between the samples and this is where I believe the real magic happens.
     
  12. Chester Rockwell
    From what I’ve read here, it seems many of us (myself included) initially consider what the M Scaler is doing from the wrong perspective. My first thought when I heard about M Scaler was very similar to yours. How can it add information that wasn’t there to begin with? And that’s where it’s easy to get confused.

    M Scaler doesn’t add any new information, the information has always been there, most DACs just aren’t able to do the calculations needed to extract all of that information, but instead get very close. Enough so that generally most people would be unaware that what they are hearing is not 100% accurate.

    I think that’s what’s happening anyway.
     
  13. Gibson59
    Thanks for trying to explain guys. Still searching for a concrete and thorough explanation of exactly how this cool tech works it’s magic and how it differs (if at all) from a regular high res file of compatible resolution... @Rob Watts would you be so kind?
     
  14. Triode User
    These two videos of one of Rob's talks should explain.

    Part 1

    Part 2
     
    Gibson59 and x RELIC x like this.
  15. x RELIC x Contributor
    Thanks @Triode User.

    Part 2 is along the lines of what I was thinking, especially in his first sign wave illustration of the problem when reconstructing transients. The key is the sinc function filter with infinite sampling in order to properly reconstruct the original waveform from sampled data. This all based on proven sampling theory. If I recall correctly Rob’s WTA filter improves a basic sinc function by an order of 10x so the 1 million TAPs are that much more effective.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
    Gibson59 likes this.
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