Hugo M Scaler by Chord Electronics - The Official Thread
Oct 27, 2018 at 3:15 AM Post #2,251 of 14,713

Crgreen

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The simplest explanation is not automatically the right one. A number of people have had BNC connection issues with Blu2-DAVE in the past, including the supplied BNC cables. I was one who trialed the Bu2 and experienced intermittent drop outs with the supplied cables. So here we are again with yet more variations of BNC connection issues with HMS. Based on that, the simplest explanation would be that there's something inherently difficult or sensitive with the M-scaler-DAVE pairing.

But rather than speculate simplistictly, I'd like us all to get to the bottom of this, and it doesn't help to start the investigation by assuming that one side or the other must be wrong.

I don't own any of Peter's cables, but the considerable user feedback at CA on his Lush^2 USB cable is enough to keep me interested if the same magic can apply to his BNC Blaxius^2.

I think you've been rather dismissive about "the guy" without seemingly having done much background research to back that up.

My own experience suggests that the drop-out issue between the Blu2 and Dave is the result of the RFI pumped into the Dave by the m-scaler, to which the Dave is especially sensitive, and can be “solved” with ferrites. I have no experience with the Hugo m-scaler and other Chord DACs produced after the Dave, but ferrites might provide the answer.
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 4:11 AM Post #2,252 of 14,713

TheAttorney

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I would say to blame everything on RFI is a simplistic explanation :).

The 4 Wurth ferrites per stock cable made no difference to my intermittent drop out problem. And 4 was all that was required at the time by Rob's estimate.
I know that some have since found 20+ ferrites to be better for SQ, but I bet the HMS does't have 20+ ferrites in it.
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 4:31 AM Post #2,253 of 14,713

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I am looking forward to learn what your BNC cable brings to the party. :wink: :beerchug:

Cables made and packed, FedEx booked for Monday collection. You can have a party next week!
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 4:34 AM Post #2,254 of 14,713

Crgreen

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I would say to blame everything on RFI is a simplistic explanation :).

The 4 Wurth ferrites per stock cable made no difference to my intermittent drop out problem. And 4 was all that was required at the time by Rob's estimate.
I know that some have since found 20+ ferrites to be better for SQ, but I bet the HMS does't have 20+ ferrites in it.

Let me be clear: I am not an electrical engineer and have no technical knowledge of such matters. I can only report from my own, limited experience, although others have also reported that ferrites solved the drop-out problem. I cannot say how many ferrites it takes. Although they have been used primarily to address SQ issues, why does it follow that they couldn’t also solve drop-outs?

I don’t think there’s a presumption that simplistic explanations must be wrong. Probabably better to stick to whether something works than such theorising, unless of course you are an electrical engineer with a detailed knowledge of such matters.
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 4:53 AM Post #2,255 of 14,713

yellowblue

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I think TheAttorney is right. Peter tries everything to find a solution to the problem (As I said before, his Blaxius 1 works fine with the HMS), and I have tried some changes of the configuration of the cable (without success by now).
His Lush^2 USB is a great cable. But the BNC connection between HMS and Dave seems to be a complicated one and maybe JSSG simply doesn´t work in that case. Peter is in any case sure about that it is not a problem which has to do with the speed of the cable.
 
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Oct 27, 2018 at 5:19 AM Post #2,257 of 14,713

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And have you tried the other cable ‘solo’ as well to check it works at that rate?
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 5:29 AM Post #2,258 of 14,713

yellowblue

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Yes, tried the other cable solo. It works!
BTW, I hoped for a miracle and got both cables in place again. Instead for just crackling noise I got "only" dropout every second or so. I am not good att that kind of science - but is this maybe a kind of electrostatic problem - caused by RFI through the HMS?
 
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Oct 27, 2018 at 7:12 AM Post #2,260 of 14,713

AndrewH13

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35BCDE9D-AB95-47B3-BA80-00A521DFB6D4.jpeg Good talk from Rob as always, this morning at Hifi Lounge. Packed for talk, even standing room all gone! M-Scaler and Blu sounding good.

3A790D91-0A85-4A49-A53A-5F0894379CF0.jpeg

1494575A-0F0D-4E67-B3D8-0D0F967B750A.jpeg

1CF4BA35-37E9-4B8A-9AC3-D3F8BC19E411.jpeg
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 7:50 AM Post #2,261 of 14,713

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Yes, tried the other cable solo. It works!
BTW, I hoped for a miracle and got both cables in place again. Instead for just crackling noise I got "only" dropout every second or so. I am not good att that kind of science - but is this maybe a kind of electrostatic problem - caused by RFI through the HMS?

Or could it be something as simple as the weight / stiffness / thickness of the two cables together forcing them slightly apart and making for a reduced electrical contact from the BNC connector in the socket. The centre connection in a bnc socket is quite fragile and can be forced out of shape quite easily. Maybe investigate?
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 8:03 AM Post #2,262 of 14,713

AndrewOld

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Or could it be something as simple as the weight / stiffness / thickness of the two cables together forcing them slightly apart and making for a reduced electrical contact from the BNC connector in the socket. The centre connection in a bnc socket is quite fragile and can be forced out of shape quite easily. Maybe investigate?

Here is a picture of the cables in place in yellowblues system. They seem very stiff, and there seem to be strange earth wires coming out of them, and it’s not clear what they do or why they are there. You can see that the connectors are stressed. There may be other non-standard cables.

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/...eriences/?page=15&tab=comments#comment-889349
 
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Oct 27, 2018 at 10:08 AM Post #2,263 of 14,713

yellowblue

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Or could it be something as simple as the weight / stiffness / thickness of the two cables together forcing them slightly apart and making for a reduced electrical contact from the BNC connector in the socket. The centre connection in a bnc socket is quite fragile and can be forced out of shape quite easily. Maybe investigate?

You are correct - because of their thickness the cables are forcing each other slightly apart. But the BNC connectors have a really tight fit. I doubt that this is a big problem because everything works OK with 705 kHz into the DAVE.
 
Oct 27, 2018 at 10:17 AM Post #2,264 of 14,713

spotforscott

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It will be interesting to know what are the 'quite large' differences. Before now we have had large differences reported whichin the end turned out to be symptoms of worse performance.
Have you got any descriptions of what the SR7 brings to the party?

Someone I corresponded with on the PH SR7 powering the m-scaler topic said this: "M-Scaler results in a very nice improvement. It is smoother, richer, and more liquid. The stock PSU sounds dry and harsh in comparison". As they say, YMMV.

I am no expert of power supplies but from everything I have read, it is not just about low noise, it's also about low latency and low impedance because all three of these factors affects audio performance.
 
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Oct 27, 2018 at 10:17 AM Post #2,265 of 14,713

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You are correct - because of their thickness the cables are forcing each other slightly apart. But the BNC connectors have a really tight fit. I doubt that this is a big problem because everything works OK with 705 kHz into the DAVE.

Just look inside the bnc sockets on the MScaler and Dave and you will see that the centre connection is not substantial and could be compromised perhaps if the cable is not going into the socket completely perpendicularly. Equally it could be some other issue. I’m just trying to throw in random ideas to help.
 

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