Yes, I think they're junk. I can't really understand the praise for them at all unless you've never listened to anything but low end cans your entire life. Which may be the case; most people posting in this thread have been comparing them to some pretty mediocre headphones.
My top two are still the AKG 845BT and Philips M2BT, though both have their issues that have prevented me from committing to a purchase.
I'm with you on the AKG K845bt, I've just bought the M2BT and although an improvememt on the M1BT I find the bass a bit sloppy in comparison to the 845's which I find detailed and much better refined.
Less than average signal strength, finicky bluetooth connection, clunky earcup controls (imo), high clamping force + on-ear design = uncomfortable for longer listening sessions, and terrible if you wear glasses.
But I loved the sound. Wish I could have justified keeping them. They look cool, minimal design, but just really uncomfortable for me.
I think they are pretty good in terms of basic sound quality but they have accentuated bass which gives them a street rather than audiophile sound signature. They do look pretty cool though (the sound is nowhere near as good as the X2 by the way but as their flagship you'd expect that) and if you have a large head the clamp will be quite fierce. They don't move at all though so might even be suitable for jogging etc.
So I left my BBP's at a friend's house with the ANC on for like 3 days, and when I got it back they wouldn't turn on or charge. I called up Plantronics and at first he was all ready to send me a replacement, until he asked for a proof of purchase and I figured I'd be honest and mention I bought them from ebay. Well he didn't like that one bit, and said the warranty doesn't cover headsets that transferred ownership.
I hung up and got pissed off, decided to try again, and this time I kept quiet about the ebay thing. The new guy gave me an address to send them to, and I finally got the new set in the mail yesterday, no problem. So, a win for Plantronics customer support, sort of. Just for the love of god, don't tell them you bought your stuff used!
Anyway I'm updating them now and noticed the MyUpdater software on their website has options for "personalizing" the headset, mostly for changing the voice that tells you about calls and stuff but particularly one for turning off the sensors. That might actually be useful since I'm not sure I totally love the whole pause-music-when-you-take-them-off thing. Was this here before? Or did they just add that option in the software?
I think they are pretty good in terms of basic sound quality but they have accentuated bass which gives them a street rather than audiophile sound signature. They do look pretty cool though (the sound is nowhere near as good as the X2 by the way but as their flagship you'd expect that) and if you have a large head the clamp will be quite fierce. They don't move at all though so might even be suitable for jogging etc.
Thanks again for the feedback. It's quite unfortunate when you found a nice headphone which you like but it is uncomfortable. Perhaps you can get the Sennheiser Momentum On-Ear M2BT. It sounds great.
Thanks again for the feedback. It's quite unfortunate when you found a nice headphone which you like but it is uncomfortable. Perhaps you can get the Sennheiser Momentum On-Ear M2BT. It sounds great.
I just sold a pair of the Momentum 2.0 wired and have owned the original over ears before so will definitely give the bluetooth versions a whirl at some point.
I just sold a pair of the Momentum 2.0 wired and have owned the original over ears before so will definitely give the bluetooth versions a whirl at some point.
Also anxiously awaiting these, though not sure if I will like the sound signature. The regular Momentums weren't really my cup of tea. I love the HD-25-II though.
But like any Sennheiser, I'll have to pay a pretty penny. I guess the aesthetics and build quality are worth it though.
I've started my quest for the best sounding and portable Bluetooth Headphones some months ago.
I've compared two. I was not satisfied. So I've bought more.
Soon it became a sort of hobby and passion and I've tested almost all the best Bluetooth Headphones available, as you can see in the list below.
My aim is not to convince anybody in buying or not buying any product.
Your money, your needs, your decision.
My aim is to help you deciding how YOU want to spend your money.
People helped me in my choices, and I wanted to give something back and help other people in their choices. Chain of favours.
Anyway a real objectivity in comparing Headphones is impossible, therefore this thread is not meant as a one man show but as a place for everybody to post their BT Headphones comparisons, because a wider panorama of different opinions is the best way to help people in their choices.
I only compare On and Over Ear models, because the In-Ear cannot be returned. But you are welcome to post your In-Ear comparisons.
If you want to compare your BT Headphones with your wired Headphones, this is not the best place. I would suggest you to create a separate thread for that.
And if you have nothing to compare but still want to give your opinion of your only BT Headphones, a more proper place would be the thread “High End Bluetooth Headphones” started by n00b2. But you are still welcome to share your impressions here.
EDIT (07 April 2015): to celebrate my promotion to 500+ Head-Fi'er and to meet the many requests received (directly or indirectly) I have created a new Thread specifically dedicated to ANC Bluetooth Headphones.
This thread will STILL include ANC models because here we concentrate on the sound of ANY BT Headphone. So, comparisons about the SOUND of ANC with non-ANC Bluetooth headphones will still be posted here.
But comparisons of ANC models should be posted in the new thread.
Now, before you post your own comparison:
- explain if you tested with EQ or not, or both.
- explain which music or kind of music you have used
- explain which tastes you have about sound signature (if you are a basshead, if you like balanced neutral headphones, if you like warm sound, bright sound)
- explain which background you have with headphones (if this is your first headphone or first BT Headphone...)
- explain the methodology of your comparison, including the sources (iPhone? Android? PC? Aptx?)
- try to separate the subjective aspects of the sound from the more or less "objective" ones.
Things like "this is the best headphone" or "this sounds better than that" are "objectifications" of subjective opinions, and do not help people in deciding which to try.
You can rate (better, worse, good, bad) the "objective" aspects, but you should rather describe (bright, warm, dull, harsh) the subjective ones, and then eventually express your preference.
If you have no idea of what I am talking about with objective and subjective, read my methodology below.
I have very few free time in this moment, but as soon as I can I will try to put at the bottom of this first post some links to the comparisons posted in the thread, so that the "I am in a hurry" boys can avoid reading dozens of pages or getting lost in the search function.
I will also place at the bottom of this post my personal "Huge Comparison" organized in categories, as soon as I find the time.
There will be terms we use to describe sound and headphones, which you may not understand. Do not panic, I also did not understand them at the begin. Here a basic glossary to start.
But at first I am going to explain how I test headphones and a few more things, and to begin I give you a complete list of what I have tested and am testing. The headphones which I have already reviewed I have linked them to my corresponding review on Amazon, where my nick is Sir Joe. You are welcome to vote my reviews if you find them useful. It makes my Ego feel better, and it is the only way to see that I am being useful.
The list ist a work in progress and the order may vary over time. It also is just a rough guideline, so please do not take it as a Purchasing Guide. The fact that a headphone is on the top of my list does NOT necessarily mean that it is the best for your needs and tastes. So, eventually better ask me first. I am always happy to help
Besides, a battle of giants is a battle of giants. And if in the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king, even the looser of a battle of giant is still a giant and a king among the rest of headphones. And in this moment for example, with all my love for the n°1, I am wowing while listening to the n°2. There really is no much margine of failure in those first 5 places, and still very few also in the next 5. Giants...
Apart for the Parrot Zik which I have never yet had the pleasure to test (neither the 1 or the 2) and the Sony MDR-1RBTMK2 which I cannot get in EU, there are some new ones just released or coming soon which I still could not test (but other people did, and you can read comments on this or other threads, or on the Internet). Here is a list.
And now also Denon announced their first BT Headphone, the Denon AH-GC20, and I am super excited because they are supposed to be another high end bassy bt headphone. So I am curious to see how they compete against the ATH.
About how I test/compare headphones:
First of all, I do not have much experience with wired Headphones apart for the AKG K240 Monitor which I have used to produce some music, and a couple of cheaper ones I've used to listen to music. So, please consider that whenever I say "excellent" or "amazing" I am referring to "within the Bluetooth World".
Now, I never test ONE headphones. I always COMPARE at least TWO headphones, but generally three or more. Side by side.
Then, I do not rate the sound signature or "colour" of the sound (=the QUANTITATIVE proportion between the different frequencies) because it is a matter of tastes, and I believe that a "neutral/uncoloured" signature (which most reviewers tend to consider as "objectively" better) is a subjective matter of preference as much as a coloured one.
Some people like coloured, some like uncoloured, and NOBODY has the right to claim that his preferences are more objective.
Besides, different ears perceive the same sound differently, and what is neutral to somebody will not be neutral to somebody else.
People are not computers. And they have not neutral ears and neutral brains. They have different psychoacustic perceptions.
You can measure the neutrality with computers and instruments, but what for if then people will NOT hear in the same neutral way?
ALL is relative.
So I just rate the "more or less objective" aspects of the sound (which are normally called Sound Quality, or SQ, and which too many people confuse with Sound Signature), like the detail, the soundstage, and the QUALITY of the Frequency Rendering (for example if the bass is dull or the highs are harsh or the mids are muffled).
And I also rate the objective quantitative extension of the Frequency Response, = how high in the highs and how deep in the lows is the headphone able to go, and how much you can push the loudness of each frequency with the EQ if you want to retune the headphone to your personal tastes.
Speaking of what: many reviewers only test without EQ. Some of them because they are just lazy. Other ones because they ideologically think that things must sound well out of the box (where "well" means "well for them", even if they think it means "objectively well").
Such reviewers are able to underrate an headphone full of potential or to overrate one full of lacks, just because out of the box it sounded bad or good to them.
I lose more time: I start testing without EQ to see the “out of the box” performances, and then I test with EQ to see the real potential, faults and lacks.
Why? Simple: some people do not use EQ, some people do. So, if I test headphones without EQ, my reviews are useful only for those people who do not use EQ.
But I want my reviews to be useful to as many people as possible.
Besides I really believe in the importance of EQ as a re-tuning tool: as said before, people have different psychoacustic perceptions of sound, and the SAME headphone will sound different to different people. With EQ you can compensate those differences.
Then, people have different tastes, and with EQ they can re-tune headphones to they personal tastes. Tastes can also change with time, and it is more practical and economical if you re-tune your headphone, instead of buying a new one.
Finally, I am not aware of ANY headphone (and surely of any BT Headphone) which can sound perfect with ALL kind of music without using any EQ. From classical to Dubstep, with no EQ?
So, contrarily to what some people say (that with a flat headphone and no EQ you respect the sound wanted by the composer), only with EQ (or with many different headphones) you can have something which sounds the way each kind of music is supposed to sound. Take the flat and "perfect" AKG K845BT and listen to Dubstep and tell me if you REALLY believe, from the deepest of your soul, that THIS is how dubstep must sound.
So, what do most reviewers consider the perfect headphone? Something which is flat and neutral out of the box.
What do I consider the perfect headphone? Something which can please as many people as possible, = something which is uncoloured or slightly coloured out of the box (the more extremely coloured an headphone is, the less people are likely to prefer it) AND has got such a good hardware, such a good frequency response, and such a good DSP, that you can boost it and re-tune it with EQ as much as you want.
How would most reviewers rate headphones? The typical reviewer would rate higher a headphone which is "flat and neutral" out of the box, even if with a bit EQ boost on the bass it distorts very badly (= it can only please people who do not listen to bass heavy stuff) and would rate lower something which is bass boosted out of the box, even if with some subtractive EQ you can make it sound perfectly flat, and with addictive EQ you can boost it till making the most demanding basshead smile (= it can please many more people).
How do I rate headphones? I obviously rate higher the second one. But, if I find two headphones which with EQ can sound the same, but one sounds uncoloured or slightly coloured out of the box and the other sounds very coloured, I rate higher the first one, because it can please more people.
I have developed this method also because I wanted to avoid that my personal subjective preferences in matter of sound signature would influence my ratings.
So at the end it can happen that I will rate higher an headphone which I do not like (like the AKG K845BT), and lower one which I like (like the House of Marley Liberate XLBT), if in the objective aspects the first one was better.
I have taken into consideration also the Build, the accessories, of course the Functions, the wireless range, the connectivity, quality of the calls, and in part the look (when it was particularly original or particularly ugly).
The Price is subject to change but I did consider it in those cases where something was very cheap or very expensive for the quality offered.
Fit and Comfort greatly depend on each person, so I have only taken them into consideration in the extreme cases where something was clearly almost universally comfortable or universally terrible.
mostly MP3 of different quality. Some FLAC, and some CD (as CD generally Dark Side of the Moon).
As genres, I use lot of different things, from Classical (Vivaldi, Bach) to Dubstep, passing through Pop and Rock ad Ethnic and Chill Out and Celtic, and other things.
Some things which I always use lately are:
For the Bass:
- Limit to your Love (James Blake)
- Balloons Club Mix (Nils Hoffmann)
- Beez in the Trap (Nicki Minaj) - also useful to test the quantity of the mids in vocals, and muddiness
- So This Is Goodbye (William Fitzsimmons - Pink Ganter remix)
- Dubstep
Mids:
- Boa Sorte (Vanessa da Mata & Ben Harper) - also useful to check if the quantity of the Bass is too much for non EDM music, and to check the sibilance of Highs, due to her S
- Sideways (Santana feat. Citizen Cope)
- Radiohead, Portishead, Bjork, Antony and the Johnsons
Highs:
- Classical, Jazz, and some Techno
- Je veux (Zaz)
Detail and Soundstage:
- Dark side of the Moon (mostly Time and Money)
- The Zen of Space (Zakir Hussain)
- God of Thunder (Kitaro)
- Low Rider (War)
But I also use many other random things.
I ONLY USE APTX ENABLED DEVICES, so I cannot promise that what sounded good/better with Aptx will sound good/better without Aptx.
I use:
- Xperia Z1Compact with Neutron as Music Player
- Notebook with Aptx usb dongle and MusicBee as Player.
Now you know how I test headphones.
But even if you find it reasonable and you feel you can trust me, you should never EVER take as gold the word of ANY reviewer.
Only trying by yourself you can really be sure of how those Headphones will sound to YOU.
So, I strongly suggest you to read as many reviews as possible, to limit your choices to 2 or 3 Headphones, and buy those TOGETHER for a side by side comparison.
But you must learn to be selective with the reviews too. There are many reviewers out there who have NO IDEA of what they write.
Only trust people who provide a LIST of the other Headphones tested. Or you cannot know if that one is their first BT Headphone.
Prefer people who are moderate and seem objective, but do not underestimate also some more passionate opinions (most professional reviewers are very diplomatic, like those Horoscopes which only want to make you feel well so that you buy them).
Prefer those who give details about how the headphones sound and why they prefer A to B.
In Amazon you generally do not find people with much experience, but with some training you can distinguish the more useful reviews, and even the fake ones.
Ratings in Amazon are also a good way to have an idea of the kind of reviewer. You can almost safely ignore all 5 and 1 stars reviews, and DEFINITELY ignore ALL generic "I love it" and "I hate it".
In blog and forums, do not trust reviewers if they do not offer a comment section and do not ANSWER to comments. They just want to get attention to get free products from Companies.
There are a few very good, very professional reviewers out there.
My favourite ones are:
-Tyll of Innerfidelity (extremely competent, with the right mix of "cold objective science" and "warm human passion". One of the few reviewers running objective instrumental measurements, and probably the only one doing it with heart and intuition. In fact, most of the times his objective tests make him reach similar conclusions than my subjective "just with my ears" tests. With the difference that his analysis are clearly much deeper, detailed and competent. No wonder, I am a newbie, he is a legend).
-Caleb of Digital Trends: he is more of an intuitive reviewer, no objective tests. But his reviews are in-depth, precise, and imo very competent.
-The guys at Digital Versus: a nice French team of young guys who run a mix of intuitive and objective tests. Their reviews are quite in-depth and I like their style and agree with most of their conclusions.
-I also have respect for the work of the guys at Thewirecutter, especially Lauren. I often disagree with their conclusions and methods. But I like their integrity and the way they work in team.
-Geoffrey of Forbes (who also collaborates with thewirecutter) is also a reviewer of great integrity and professionalism, although I sometimes strongly disagree with his conclusions and I feel he is not really 100% objective. But, maybe nobody is. And he is surely a trusty one. And he wrote a nice article on how to compare headphones, which I post below and save me some time writing my own guide. Besides, he and Lauren are doing some strange things from time to time.
-I also like Tim Gideon of PC Magazine, his reviews are precise, detailed, methodic, he uses always the same tracks to test a certain range of frequencies. He seems to be less basshead than me. So what he calls tremendous bass is just acceptable to me. But he is good.
And once you get these headphones
Well, here is a start.
I personally do several listenings and also EQ them to see how they respond, if they have hidden potential or hidden faults, if I can adapt the Headphone B to my tastes with some EQ so much that I like it more than I liked the Headphone A without EQ...
How to EQ? Here a guide. And a follow up by another user here
Now, the
An internet friend of mine, Kelleytoons (who considering his passion for headphones should be called Kelleytones), also joined this Thread from post 32 at page 3.
He also tested a lot of BT Headphones. He does not have any Aptx source, so his comparisons are better suited for people who also don't (like iOS users).
He has big sensitive ears, and I have small easygoing ears, so you also have two different opinions about the comfort.
About how he tests the Headphones, you should ask him.
Now, my Huge Comparison.
In each category I will list only the headphones which for a reason or another excel in that category. The lists will be in order of excellence. PLEASE CONSIDER: I can only list what I have tested. So, to know if the Headphone X is missing from the category Y because not excelling or because I did not test it, check the general list of what I have tested!
Let's begin with the most important thing after pizza: bass.
Audio Technica ATH-WS99BT: not artificially boosted, so that out of the box its bass can be less powerful than the next 4 headphones in this list, but very powerful on bass-heavy tracks, specially on loud volume. It anyway needs EQ to really shine, and if you EQ them, the bass will reach levels which no other bt headphone in my list can reach, with an almost perfect balance of rumble and punch, a very nice detail, and without negatively affecting other frequencies.
Just a step below the Fidelio M2BT for the body of the deep rumble, but better in the rest.
Fidelio M2BT and M1BT: just a minimal boost out of the box, very natural, very deep solid rumble. . Without EQ is better than the ATH for action movies.
Logitech UE9000: actually on par with the Fidelio. A bit warmer and brighter, a bit more punch, a bit less body in the rumble, less boost out of the box, still good for movies.
Plantronics Backbeat Pro: more boosted out of the box than the Fidelio, but still with a clean bass. There is enough SubBass for a deep rumble, even if with a bit less body than the Fidelio and UE. And there is a good punch for Techno and similar. Overall a very nice bass.
You can EQ it to make it more impactful, but you cannot EQ it too much or the bass will eat everything else.
B&O BeoPlay H8: a bit less impact than the Fidelio, and less rumble. More boosted out of the box than all the prevously listed ones, and with a slight dark tone which affects also some low-mids. WARNING: when boosted with EQ and if ANC active, the bass under 60hz distorts at max vol (and you are probably going to want the max vol because they do not get much loud). When wired it distorts more (even without EQ). When the ANC is off, the bass is ok, zero distortion.
Good on almost any bassy music, but not brilliant on Dubstep. And, specially when wired, it may be too much out of the box on some music.
Sennheiser Urbanite XL Wireless: good detail, great precision, lot of punch, decent rumble, but with a prominent dark tone which also affects the low mids (it improves with EQ). Excellent for Techno.
JBL Synchros S400BT: quite boosted out of the box, fast bass with good power but not much personality or WOW effect. Very good for Rock and Metal and Hip-Hop.
Harman Kardon BT: just a little boost out of the box, warm, slightly dark bass, with ok rumble and nice punch, somehow similar to the UE9000 but with less body, less impact, and less detail.
House of Marley Liberate XLBT: very nice punch, not much rumble, decent detail. Not a precise headphone, but good for Reggae, Hip-Hop, Rock. You will need to EQ the highs.
Sony MDR-XB950BT: with a practical Bass Boost button. They can produce some serious vibration on Dubstep. But the bass is boomy, imprecise, without body, and the mids and highs are quite lacking. It improves with some EQ, but you need the Mod of @Bill-P to clean up the bass.
Supertooth Freedom: nobody knows them. But they sound very good, and the bass is very nice, not boosted out of the box, but able to give some serious performances, specially with EQ.
Bluedio T2: I would have never expected this bass from this cheap thing. A bit boosted out of the box, but ok. Able to give some really serious bass when EQed.
Jlab Omni: Similar to the Harman Kardon BT, but a bit less detailed and a bit more boomy.
Beats Studio Wireless: muddy, flat, intrusive, imprecise. Poor rumble, poor detail. Good punch. A bit boomy. It can be powerful enough with some EQ, and it is very clearly artificially boosted out of the box. Definitely not for all music. And no matter how you tweak it, the quality is still muddy.
AKG Y45BT: I was almost shocked when I have tried them. This bass with these small drivers is amazing. It is a bit artificially boosted out of the box but it has got body and nice impact, and it goes deep, with a slightly warmly dark tone which also affect a bit the low mids.
Bose Soundlink On Ear: another very small one with nice bass. Not as deep as the AKG, less rumble, but good punch and possibly better detail. Somehow more natural, less boosted.
(more categories coming as soon as possible)
I hope you will enjoy this thread and it will helps you finding the right BT Headphone for you.
Please feel free to comment and ask whatever you need. We are here to help.
And about that, do not forget to vote the helpful posts with the little "facebook style" hand button at the bottom of each post (including this )
What eq app do you use? I'm looking for one for iOS iPhone? I just sold my beats solo and ordered backbeats pro to replace them, what do I have to look forward too!
I've read your review a month after bought my Backbeat pro. At that time, your first rank was Logitech UE900, followed by Philips M2BT and Plantronics backbeat pro.
In my place, good quality bluetooth headphone is rare. I found only backbeat pro and Sony XB950BT for over-ear model.
It seems that Bluetooth headphone is not considered as good quality pairs. Fortunately I decide to take backbeat pro and not regret it after read your reviews.
Actually I read many reviews about Sony XB950BT and want to buy one. But after comparing them about one minute of song, suddenly I change my mind.
The difference of quality is very far. Sony has bass boost feature, but that's not what I really want. With or without bass boost, the bass quality is bad.
It is boomy and not perform well on sub bass/rumble things. It seems the digital filter was too steep and sub bass is missing. It also cover up mid/high frequency.
The backbeat pro, on the other hand has good controlled bass spreaded down to 20 Hz. Then it turns out that your rank is 13th place for Sony XB950 at that time.
So I'm hundred percent agree with your review, since you're expert in this area. That's really helpful for other people to decide their buying.
I also downloaded the tracks you use to evaluate the bass quality. And this is where I'm totally disagree with you.
Limit to your Love, Balloons Club Mix, So This Is Goodbye are incapable as test track. To me it is like singer with 5 octave vocal range singing raps, that's not good benchmarks.
I thought my file was corrupted when I hear chopper sound, and hiccup in Limit to your love. I'm wonder this song we're released.
Therefore I challange you to listen to these tracks with your collections :
- You're beautiful (Kenny G)
- Bass I love you (Bassotronics)
- The way you move (Kenny G feat Earth Wind and Fire)
- Hotel California acoustic Version (Eagles)
- Long after You're gone (Chris Jones)
In my opinion, backbeat pro is the minimum quality for listening The way you move. Another headphone sounds rattling or simply stop producing sound at the lowest note.
Final words, thanks for your review, and I'm really apologize if my words is not appropriate for you. Music is very subjective for each person.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
)
