How did you know when you reached your endgame?
Jan 3, 2018 at 7:57 PM Post #46 of 345
based on the fact that the speaker systems in large venues tend to favor volume over quality, I wouldn't be surprised if a decent two-channel home system beat them in terms of overall sound quality

True, but my point was this specific system was different. Much higher quality than average, at least according to my 20 year old memories. Would you mind elaborating about what loudspeakers you're using, as well as some recommendations for someone getting started with that kind of thing?

It's nice to see that you like the Stax L300. I very nearly ordered a new pair last night, but ended up getting a used 407 that was $100 cheaper instead. I'm pretty sure I'll be very happy with either one, and getting the cheaper one seemed a better idea than stressing over whatever minor differences there are between them.

I do see where you're coming from about the Koss KTXPro1. I don't agree with you, like at all, but I'm not about to pretend my opinion is any better than yours :ksc75smile: But I've been looking back at how my tastes in music have changed along with changes in my audio gear, and I believe the two things to be causally related. So it's entirely possible that the kind of music you like sounds great on KTXPro1s and doesn't necessarily benefit from something "better." Maybe that's the artist's intention, maybe it's a coincidence, but it doesn't really matter. I think lots of classic rock came about because the bands wanted to sound good on the record players of the time, and my modern high end system is ridiculous overkill. I love Led Zeppelin--their BBC Sessions is one of the best rock albums ever--but I don't enjoy it substantially more with my Mr. Speakers or Stax gear than I do with my PortaPro. I always knew that Plant moans about sex all the time, but now I know exactly which kinds of sex! Not exactly worth the investment.

Cheaper gear is obviously no impediment to getting immense enjoyment from music. But the EDM I spend most of my time listening to seems especially demanding of gear. I think the "better" gear I have makes worlds of difference there
 
Jan 3, 2018 at 9:19 PM Post #47 of 345
Would you mind elaborating about what loudspeakers you're using, as well as some recommendations for someone getting started with that kind of thing?

http://www.klipsch.com/products/reference-premiere-floorstanding-speakers?model=rp-250f
http://www.klipsch.com/blog/reference-vs-reference-premiere-whats-the-difference

Well, first off, you'll want to get something suited to your listening space. I'm only using a bedroom. While you can use towers even in a room this small, the larger the speakers, the more easily they can overpower the room. Ironically, for whatever reason, I have less problems with room acoustics with these larger speakers than I did with JBL LSR305 studio monitors placed on full-size stands.

Experimenting with placement/positioning can yield better results.

Try to keep plenty of space between the speakers and walls. (As well as the ceiling.)

Many prefer to have the listening position in the horizontal center of the room, with the speakers equidistant from the side walls, an equilateral triangle between the speakers and listening position, and the speakers angled towards them so the sides are not visible.

Isolating the speakers (by placing them on stands, putting isolation footers under them, etc.) is important. You want to avoid too much sound resonating through the furniture, walls, and so on.

With a simple microphone and free software, you can measure the frequency response from the listening position and make it (basically) perfectly neutral at the push of a button. (Something you can't do with headphones.)

According to most in the know, acoustic treatments throughout the listening room are worthwhile. (I haven't bothered with them, but plan to.)

All this is very general advice that you may have already known. I am by no means a speaker expert, as I only got into them last year. You'll have to do lots of research if you want to become knowledgeable on this topic.

It's nice to see that you like the Stax L300. I very nearly ordered a new pair last night, but ended up getting a used 407 that was $100 cheaper instead. I'm pretty sure I'll be very happy with either one, and getting the cheaper one seemed a better idea than stressing over whatever minor differences there are between them.

The differences between the three Lambdas I had were not so minor. The new "advanced Lambda" series sounds more solid and focused, with there being more of a stereotypical ethereal sound the further back in production time you go. (All three are among the most neutral headphones.)

I do see where you're coming from about the Koss KTXPro1. I don't agree with you, like at all, but I'm not about to pretend my opinion is any better than yours :ksc75smile: But I've been looking back at how my tastes in music have changed along with changes in my audio gear, and I believe the two things to be causally related. So it's entirely possible that the kind of music you like sounds great on KTXPro1s and doesn't necessarily benefit from something "better." Maybe that's the artist's intention, maybe it's a coincidence, but it doesn't really matter. I think lots of classic rock came about because the bands wanted to sound good on the record players of the time, and my modern high end system is ridiculous overkill. I love Led Zeppelin--their BBC Sessions is one of the best rock albums ever--but I don't enjoy it substantially more with my Mr. Speakers or Stax gear than I do with my PortaPro.

How much time have you spent listening to the KTXPRO1? Which systems did you pair it with? Which music genres did you test with?

FYI, I am an experienced musician and listen to nearly all types of music.

It sounded great with all music. I even preferred it over STAX for some energetic, impactful music like metal and some electronic. (And STAX are usually my favorite headphones for most types of music. STAX is obviously more accurate, though.)

I never said that some other headphones don't sound better. You seemed to imply that that is what I was claiming. But that is not what diminishing returns is; it is when you do not get an improvement directly proportional to what you put in. A $150 headphone is not going to be ten times better (many are actually worse); a $1,500 headphone is not going to be a hundred times better; and so on.

I think the KTXPRO1 is 90% as good as any headphone at any price. The reason I think this is because it reproduces most of the sound, and any improvements beyond what it is capable of (the types of things we audiophiles appreciate) only account for a small percent of the overall sound. Others may think of it as a different number, and this is subjective.

I don't like the Porta Pro, by the way. Out of the six Koss headphone models I have owned (including the ESP950), it is my least favorite. I found this strange since it has almost the same drivers as the KTXPRO1, but not coated with titanium. The main difference is the enclosure, which I confirmed by swapping the drivers. I did love the comfort, though, and primarily used it for videos in the past, since I'm not so picky with sound quality for those.

Cheaper gear is obviously no impediment to getting immense enjoyment from music. But the EDM I spend most of my time listening to seems especially demanding of gear. I think the "better" gear I have makes worlds of difference there

I listen to lots of EDM and am blown away with how it sounds on my speakers.

Check out this record label. All the releases are available for free lossless download aside from the newest one. (A 2 CD compilation limited to 100 copies. So glad I snatched one up, because it's some of the best electronic music I've heard!)

https://luckylotus.bandcamp.com
 
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Jan 3, 2018 at 9:28 PM Post #48 of 345
I’m close, just a few more shovel fulls down this rabbit hole. I need to participate in my server upgrade program, then I could be done.
 
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Jan 4, 2018 at 12:21 AM Post #49 of 345
I can't leave it alone. Even now I'm contemplating of getting another pair of balanced interconnects.
I just bought these inexpensive anti-vibration pads, I placed 3 underneath the amp, universal transport and DAC.
Listened for a couple of days then removed them. I heard some subtle brightness that was not there.
Placed them back, brightness went away. You get to the point whereby your system is a high resolution sound system.
You can hear even small changes you make, positive or negative.

Wagner.jpg
 
Jan 6, 2018 at 9:02 AM Post #52 of 345
At one time Hi-Fi was a passion of mine, an unhealthy one. The pursuit of having the best sound was above all, including God. Not good; but, very, very, destructive. Now, I have put the hobby in its proper place for a life that is more "'in tune" with my relationship with god and people instead of things. This came about when I began to see I was missing out on life. At any rate, I am totally satisfied with my "stereo". The only update that I perceive would give me any more pleasure would be an OPPO 205 UHD Bluray Player, primarily to enjoy multi-channel SACDs from its multi-channel RCA outputs connected to my 18 year old analog multi-channel preamp. Thing is, this player costs about $1309.00. I don't know if I can afford it, especially since that money could at any day be needed to keep my 465,000 mile 1996 Chevy Tahoe running.
 
Jan 6, 2018 at 3:49 PM Post #53 of 345
Thing is some of us here have more than one rig. I have a Stax and HE-6 plus an IEM for travel. So I'm eyeing this SS amp for my HE-6 (I'm using a tube amp right now).
I'm also contemplating of getting a turntable, I still possess MoFi and other collectible LPs, some are direct-to-disc. I still have a high output moving coil cartridge that just needs a new stylus. And a phono preamp.


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Jan 7, 2018 at 7:11 AM Post #54 of 345
Thing is some of us here have more than one rig. I have a Stax and HE-6 plus an IEM for travel. So I'm eyeing this SS amp for my HE-6 (I'm using a tube amp right now).
I'm also contemplating of getting a turntable, I still possess MoFi and other collectible LPs, some are direct-to-disc. I still have a high output moving coil cartridge that just needs a new stylus. And a phono preamp.


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What turntable have you been thinking about. I still use my 30 plus year old Sony PS-4750 with Shure V15V-MR and 97xE cartridges. The sound is almost as good as CD. In fact, if it were not for the occasional snap, crackle, and pops I would be hard pressed to distinguish LP from CD. Since that's the state of things today I do not have any motivation to buy another turntable and/or cartridge, perceiving I now am getting everything from the LP that's there to get.
 
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Jan 7, 2018 at 9:36 AM Post #56 of 345
When materialism is no longer a thing. That is, never.
 
Jan 7, 2018 at 12:33 PM Post #57 of 345
What turntable have you been thinking about. I still use my 30 plus year old Sony PS-4750 with Shure V15V-MR and 97xE cartridges. The sound is almost as good as CD. In fact, if it were not for the occasional snap, crackle, and pops I would be hard pressed to distinguish LP from CD. Since that's the state of things today I do not have any motivation to buy another turntable and/or cartridge, perceiving I now am getting everything from the LP that's there to get.

Something with a solid base. I used to have a VPI 19 table. I'm very familiar on how to set one up. If I can find one used with a good arm for a good price that could get me started.
 
Jan 7, 2018 at 12:52 PM Post #58 of 345
When you find interest that you can steer away from this hobby? There's many out there, but we happen to land on this one somehow? Can we agree that those of us heavily into the hobby shows our geek traits? A bit obsessive than the typical range as a lot of what we seek is niche out of the mainstream.

Looking back at myself with ipod and apple earbuds, wouldn't have seen myself to be at this point in the hobby. If I didn't somehow run into this, I wouldn't be in such a mess.

It's a risk of noticing better sound when you audition gear, and you realize it's not end game just yet. If you are really a sound snob(or obsessed), this scenario becomes of a complex I think. Is this healthy? Hmmm.
 
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Jan 7, 2018 at 1:13 PM Post #59 of 345
When you find interest that you can steer away from this hobby? There's many out there, but we happen to land on this one somehow? Can we agree that those of us heavily into the hobby shows our geek traits? A bit obsessive than the typical range as a lot of what we seek is niche out of the mainstream.

Looking back at myself with ipod and apple earbuds, wouldn't have seen myself to be at this point in the hobby. If I didn't somehow run into this, I wouldn't be in such a mess.

That's pretty funny. I started out with a couple bills to spend one weekend, and decided it was time to get a nice pair of headphones. A nice pair, as in one. So I drove down to the walmart listening aisle...needless to say, my first two or three purchases turned out to be terrible. Finally I got an M50x and figured that would be the end of it, but then I discovered there was something called "open back" headphones.

In a way that was my endgame right there. In that all the other games had ended, except for this last one, which has since spilled over into car audio and DIY amps and loudspeakers...

Wishing I had a decent pair of headphones seemed so virtuous and innocent at the time...and how was it possible to live for 35 years with music being a central part of who I am, without even knowing that open headphones are a thing? I worked at a radio station for two years--recording and editing promos, deejaying a show on the air every week--and it never came up! If I were there now there's no way I wouldn't be talking to everyone about their favorite gear and my favorite gear...
 
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Jan 7, 2018 at 1:28 PM Post #60 of 345
A costly endeavor but a rewarding one. I went into reef tanks for a few years and it humbled me. Would be good to taste salt again but alas, age is causing me to invest in a different hobby. Health.

I have been into aquariums way longer than audio. I'm allergic to animal dander sadly. Nothing fancy for me though. Just had a 18+year old red terror pass. Been on Tropheus and more as much as this place lately. Thinking about starting a colony.

Health is a great thing to focus on. Our health and our freedom are the 2 biggest things people take for granite imo....A freshwater tank is pretty easy peasy though and some of the fish out there are really cool.
 

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