HiFiMan Susvara
Aug 9, 2021 at 1:48 AM Post #10,366 of 24,925
It is very unfortunate that we keep seeing argument made about Viva amp, from one side only. I asked around (the owner of the amp which the issue happened to) as well as Viva themselves and I would like to point out (without going into detail) that what Abyss said in their video is their side of the story, keep that in mind.
i can’t say that i always enjoy the abyss videos, even to the point where i posted replies on their youtube channel about my thoughts.

but what you say is true - it is their view re viva

having said that if i was an egoista owner i’d be wondering or already asking about this either to confirm or dismiss it.

in my eyes this video just added some thoughts in the discussion. Not gospel, just thoughts to consider if not done before
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 1:52 AM Post #10,367 of 24,925
I just received an adapter to run my headphones (Susvara and TC) into my speaker amp (Chord TToby). I thought there would be a huge sound difference between the TToby and my dedicated headphone amp (Luxman P-750U). Frankly, the outcome is way, way closer than I expected. The TToby seems to have a bit more air and detail. The Luxman seems a bit more liquid and natural, and maybe a shade darker. So far I don't prefer one or the other - it really depends on what you're looking for.

I can totally see the benefit of not having a HP amp and instead spending that money on a higher tier power amp that can be used for both speakers and headphones.

Imagine using something like a D'Agostino Momentum as a headphone amp. That could be incredible.

Maybe a bigger, better more powerful speaker amp would make for a more substantial disparity? Try a Lux m900u or 509X vs the 750u.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 1:57 AM Post #10,368 of 24,925
i can’t say that i always enjoy the abyss videos, even to the point where i posted replies on their youtube channel about my thoughts.

but what you say is true - it is their view re viva

having said that if i was an egoista owner i’d be wondering or already asking about this either to confirm or dismiss it.

in my eyes this video just added some thoughts in the discussion. Not gospel, just thoughts to consider if not done before
I absolutely agree. Since I was considering owning Egoista (ended up with AIC-10 instead), I wanted to know how "hazardous" is it to use with headphones. I got my answers from owners and Viva pretty quickly, and I went into detail asking them specifics as well. What I can say is that after all of that, I had no longer worry about using the amplifier.

Abyss has a wonderful YouTube channel that I enjoy greatly, but with power comes responsibility (Spiderman quote, if anyone is wondering). But as long as (we viewers) realise that these are just engineers' opinions (they may know about electronics more than we do of course), we should be fine, due diligence trumps a gatekeeper's opinion every time.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:13 AM Post #10,369 of 24,925
This is meant for the speaker-amp-for-the-Susvara enthusiasts who read this forum, I saw this discussion of Joe Skubinski of JPS Labs and crew, and I thought I should post it here for what its worth, since many Susvara owners prefer speaker amps.

Not trying to be alarmist, start some feud, or even dissuade anyone from loving or using their speaker amps for headphones (it's not as if I could, even if I wanted to). It's just that there are some subtle and nuanced caveats mentioned in the discussion of which I wish I had been fully aware when I dabbled in speaker amps a few years ago in the hopes of optimizing the sonic performance of my OG He-6. To be candid, my experimentation with Speaker amps for that He-6 never went very far,. I also never had any accidents, but I am back to using exclusively HP amps with my HPs, so no personal concerns here, either way.

I am just posting this discussion here, in case someone else might find it useful. They also discuss the limitations of the "mo powa" = better performance" myth :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :slight_smile:


Quite an old video (11 months old) from Abyss ! A lot of what they say is just plain common sense !

Regarding the "mo powa" = better performance" myth, the Hifiman EF1000 is most probably THE most powerful Headphone Amp for Dynamic and Planar Magnetic headphones currently on our little planet. How my Susvara's sound with my EF1000 is certainly no myth. To my ears the Susvara's sound the best I have ever heard them !
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:16 AM Post #10,370 of 24,925
Thanks for that.
i’m not always fans of these guys but that was worth a listen - both for new info and to confirm things that i had heard before

100%
and they made that point

Maybe worth listening to a bit more.


for those that might be interested:
interesting points they made about the VIVA EGOISTA 845 in the last 7 mins or so of video for those owners

and for watt ratings of amps being based on particular distortion levels.
As a friend if mine (who knows more about electronics than me) says: a tube amp can say it has a maximum output of (say) 5w…..but at what distortion levels.

either way if you’re kicking back having a coffee or sitting on the toilet “dropping a couple of mates off at the pool” or instead of playing candy crush why not sit through it

just sayin’
This is what stopped me pursuing further with looking at purchasing a Viva Egoista 845 after watching this Abyss video ! . Also looks damm ugly !
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:19 AM Post #10,371 of 24,925
Um, I've heard the Susvara through several highly-regarded headphone amps and none of them approaches the sound quality I get with my speaker amp. So pardon me if I'm not really interested in spending 20 minutes listening to people giving reasons why a headphone amp is sufficient. I tuned out when he started talking about things that can go wrong when using a speaker amp. Things can go wrong using any amp!

If someone finds the content of the video useful, more (or less, in this case?) power to 'em.
Try the Hifiman EF1000 ! I promise you, once you have heard the Susvara's through it you will want one ! (although you also need a quality source feeding into the EF1000)
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:24 AM Post #10,372 of 24,925
Not sure if all of you caught this from @number1sixerfan, but it is edifying, if you have tried TOTL headamps but not TOTL speaker amps, whether SS or Tube.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/speaker-amps-for-headphones.649107/post-16480839

I have been fortunate enough to experience both "varieties" of amplifiers, and all I'll say is that for me, it's been an easy choice in favor of speaker amps, CFA and other DIY performers, notwithstanding.
Hi Sajid, Have you tried the Hifiman EF1000 ? If not, you should as it is an amazing combo, the best headphone system I have heard to date.
If you do, just make sure you feed a quality source into the EF1000.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:35 AM Post #10,373 of 24,925
speaker amps certainly require a bit more precaution compared to usual headphone amps, but that's all so far, at least in my experience.
All I ever did was:

turn down the volume, no music playing, connect the headphone, start the music, go up from there

and afterwards

turn down the volume, stop the music, disconnect


the middle part is overkill but it made the whole procedure more attentative for me. You might also call it OCD. =D
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:40 AM Post #10,374 of 24,925
Try the Hifiman EF1000 ! I promise you, once you have heard the Susvara's through it you will want one ! (although you also need a quality source feeding into the EF1000)
I'd love to audition the EF1000, but I'd never consider purchasing it for ergonomic and practical reasons, no matter how great it sounds. FWIW, classifying it as a headphone amp seems a bit of a stretch as it's rated for 110 watts into an 8 ohm load.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 2:40 AM Post #10,375 of 24,925
This is what stopped me pursuing further with looking at purchasing a Viva Egoista 845 after watching this Abyss video ! . Also looks damm ugly !
Crazy how beauty is in the eye of the beholder, isn’t it? To my personal taste, I have never seen a prettier amplifier than Viva, I even considered keeping it (even if unused) for display.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 3:00 AM Post #10,376 of 24,925
I'd love to audition the EF1000, but I'd never consider purchasing it for ergonomic and practical reasons, no matter how great it sounds. FWIW, classifying it as a headphone amp seems a bit of a stretch as it's rated for 110 watts into an 8 ohm load.
Not on the Headphone side ! This is 20W into 35 Ohms pure Class A. For speakers; 50W into 8 Ohms Class A and 100W into 8 Ohms Class A/B.
The EF-1000 was re-designed and re-built purely to make the Susvara's sound their best ! The Speaker side was an additional design and build bonus and what a great bonus it is !
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 3:09 AM Post #10,377 of 24,925
Not on the Headphone side ! This is 20W into 35 Ohms pure Class A. For speakers; 50W into 8 Ohms Class A and 100W into 8 Ohms Class A/B.
The EF-1000 was re-designed and re-built purely to make the Susvara's sound their best ! The Speaker side was an additional design and build bonus and what a great bonus it is !
Sorry misinformation on the EF1000; 110W into 8 Ohms Class A/B not 100W.
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 6:51 AM Post #10,378 of 24,925
Last week my pre-ordered Flux Volot arrived. Without any reviews available, I took the gamble anyhow: Soundnews was hinting the Volot is a killer amp for the Susvara based on his experience with a prototype. After 100 hours of burn-in (quite a dramatic change from cold/harsh/hollow/metallic sounding to super detailed/fast/musical/engaging) I can safely say the Volot is a keeper.

The Volot really seems to be specifically designed for Susvara. I do not know any other headphone that scales this well with an overkill in power. It has so much power that I clearly prefer the lower gain settings over the higher ones.

Check-out the Soundnews review:

 
Aug 9, 2021 at 7:16 AM Post #10,379 of 24,925
Last week my pre-ordered Flux Volot arrived. Without any reviews available, I took the gamble anyhow: Soundnews was hinting the Volot is a killer amp for the Susvara based on his experience with a prototype. After 100 hours of burn-in (quite a dramatic change from cold/harsh/hollow/metallic sounding to super detailed/fast/musical/engaging) I can safely say the Volot is a keeper.

The Volot really seems to be specifically designed for Susvara. I do not know any other headphone that scales this well with an overkill in power. It has so much power that I clearly prefer the lower gain settings over the higher ones.

Check-out the Soundnews review:


The Volot is on my radar; something that has kept me from purchasing is the size and the reports from the Volot head-fi thread about some early batches getting melted and unpleasant customer experience. I'll give it some more time to get sorted out first and wait for more user reviews!
 
Aug 9, 2021 at 9:54 AM Post #10,380 of 24,925
It was just one user who got the melting problem, it's not like the whole batch (which seems to be sold out) was affected. Mine has been manufactured during the same days and it's working just fine.
 

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