[shawn_low]

@Jkeny
 
Nice of you to offer cases.
 
@ everyone else

Whoa. Hold up. So far, only ONE HFer (Upstageguy) has reported that Tweakgeek are doing an exchange. M2tech hasn't said anything. The seller who I got mine knows nothing of this and is contacting the distributor.
 
I'd suggest:
 
0) Wait for Upstage guy to get his replacement.
 
1) Contacting your seller. If they don't know, ask the local distributor or get seller to ask distributor.
 
if that fails,
 
2) Contact M2tech about replacement. I doubt they're refund your shipping to them but they shouldn't charge for shipping a new unit?

 

[shamu144]

I heartedly agree with you Shawn_low.
 
People should contact their distributors to work out the details (shipping cost back and forth for example). I just don't think M2Tech will swap the entire unit, but rather swap the bad clocks. So the cost from their side is rather low. Hey, they might even find a way to return the bad clocks to the manufacturer. Unless they also have to provide a new casing after opening the unit themselves (but that doesn't look to be expensive per units). 
 
USG, let us know how it goes for you.

 

[upstateguy]

Tweak Geek just sent me a tracking #. 
The replacement will be here on the 8th. 
What clocks are inside is an unknown at this time.
 
Some musings:
 
The question of what will happen to all the returned, unopened, undamaged units remains?  Some  have one small clock, some will have two small clocks.  Is the time that would needed to open the cases, remove the solder and clocks and replace them with with large clocks and new cases going to be cost effective?  Or will the returned units find their way back into the market after the "HeadFi People" have quieted down?
 
The one glaring truth, however, is that m2tech would not be doing this exchange if the smaller clock sounded the same as the larger clock. 
 
Makes one wonder what percentage of the 'HiFace market' is generated by HeadFi and the other associated  forums?  Do you think we bought half of them, or perhaps, all of them?  How else would someone in the general population find out about something like the HiFace, except by following the forums?
 
Would it then be safe to assume that HiFace sales are a forum phenomena like headphone amps and DACs, or is there some other way masses of people are finding out about, and buying, these products?  Would a company like Audeze have any sales without HeadFi?
 
Before HeadFi, I had Sennheiser 424s but had moved into speakers. Without HeadFi, I probably would have bought some other Sennheiser products and that would have been it.  Before HeadFi, I had a mini to RCA plug from my computer's headphone out, into a vintage Hitachi amp (that, btw, had a headphone jack) and controlled the volume with Winamp or Windows. Speakers were Polk Satellites from 1995, with the subwoofer under the computer bench.
 
USG

 

[volume]

That makes sense, would Some small companies be able to sell anything without us.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by upstateguy
 
Would it then be safe to assume that HiFace sales are a forum phenomena like headphone amps and DACs, or is there some other way masses of people are finding out about, and buying, these products?  Would a company like Audeze have any sales without Head
 

 

[shawn_low]

It's called 'flavour of the month'.
 
Let's face it, many of us have disposable income. We want to spend it. We get caught up in the hype here and end up buying.

Clever companies with good product know enough to get early samples out to key HFers for reviews, pics we can salivate over etc.
 
Me? I tend to wait till the hype dies down and snag one second-hand for savings! 

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

It's hard to reconcile the claims made here with both the technical data, technical knowledge & also with the lack of further evidence or others reporting the same findings. Again, nobody is accusing you of making things up but maybe you could revisit your tests & look deeper into them for other possible reasons. It may be that there are other differences within the Hiface units besides the clocks for instance? I don't know how you will identify them unless they are visually obvious. It may be other external factors are effecting the outcomes, I don't know, only you can answer that. For instance let me cite something - I have had a couple of people report that the modified Hiface did not live up to expectations & when I delved further into their systems, I found either that they were using iTunes to rip the CD to disk or that they were using upsampling in their playback system  ( as a separate box or in their DAC)
 

You're speculating now and making the erroneous assumption; one that would suit you just fine, of course, that anyone who doesn't hear an improvement with their HiFace has a faulty system that somehow stifles the benefits of this wonderful and compelling piece of gear??  For one asking that others not speculate, you do some interesting speculating.  Are you genuinely claiming that everyone should be able to hear a difference?

 

[xdanny]

Quote:

The one glaring truth, however, is that m2tech would not be doing this exchange if the smaller clock sounded the same as the larger clock. 
 
Makes one wonder what percentage of the 'HiFace market' is generated by HeadFi and the other associated  forums?  Do you think we bought half of them, or perhaps, all of them?  How else would someone in the general population find out about something like the HiFace, except by following the forums?
 
Would it then be safe to assume that HiFace sales are a forum phenomena like headphone amps and DACs, or is there some other way masses of people are finding out about, and buying, these products?  Would a company like Audeze have any sales without HeadFi?
......
 
USG

It's true that most small companies benefit from these forums.  How else can they compete with the giant ones, who cleverly get a tight grip on the market and force feed you their products, restricting formats and so on?  But at the same time it benefits us, too.  I've been looking like a mad dog just for a way to get bitperfect, unmolested sound out of my PC without changing hardware and dealing with complicated sound cards.  M2Tech and other small companies have addressed this issue - and others -  for many of us.  Bringing new products to the market is the way to keep moving forward.  Heck, look at what the likes of apple, microsoft etc are doing to us - can't freaking play a flac file on the system!  Or itunes totally taking control of your library and so on...  Personally I welcome these small companies.  Growing pains, yes, but at the same time moving forward!

 
Quote:

That makes sense, would Some small companies be able to sell anything without us.
 

This is also true for the big companies.  Except for they have the money to pay the lawyers in case they screw up.  Do you think apple would replace anything because a handful of people complain?  LOL, I'd like to see that!!  It's small companies that bring us good products, like the folks from Odyssey, Pass, Modwright, Lavry and the list goes on and on!


 
Quote:

You're speculating now and making the erroneous assumption; one that would suit you just fine, of course, that anyone who doesn't hear an improvement with their HiFace has a faulty system that somehow stifles the benefits of this wonderful and compelling piece of gear??  For one asking that others not speculate, you do some interesting speculating.  Are you genuinely claiming that everyone should be able to hear a difference?

  LOL, sorry man, I've always wanted to  use this smiley!!  jkeny has taken a lot of this lately.  Enough already.  Have you actually had a chance to listen to one of his modded units? 
 
The small vs big clock debate has been beaten to death and can go on for a long time.  Regardless, M2Tech has given in.  Try this with Apple.  They will laugh at you from here to their headquarters. 
 

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

 

  LOL, sorry man, I've always wanted to  use this smiley!!  jkeny has taken a lot of this lately.  Enough already.  Have you actually had a chance to listen to one of his modded units? 
 
The small vs big clock debate has been beaten to death and can go on for a long time.  Regardless, M2Tech has given in.  Try this with Apple.  They will laugh at you from here to their headquarters. 
 

Yes, I do own one of the units.  What? It didn't seem that way?
 
I think you've read too much into what I wrote if you feel inclined to mention M2Tech's giving in, and now Apple. 

 

[upstateguy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xdanny /img/forum/go_quote.gif

It's true that most small companies benefit from these forums.  ...........
 
Bringing new products to the market is the way to keep moving forward......
 
Personally I welcome these small companies.  Growing pains, yes, but at the same time moving forward!

 

I agree with you.

 
I shouldn't have picked on Audeze, though,  because they are making a genuinely good product that doesn't rely on any slight of hand tactics for its sound.
 
What is really interesting, however, is the power the owners of this forum wield.  They can make, break, or sell anything they choose to endorse, as the continuous  FOTM threads demonstrate.
 
How would you like a piece of that action?
 
USG
 

 

[digger945]

Quote:

 
 
How would you like a piece of that action?
 
USG
 

 

 

[sleepy dan]

I own the PCI version, same as you, hence my surprise at your report.  My DAC is a modded-to-hell-and-back Buffalo.
 
Quote:

 

You must own the 0404 USB which has some of the highest jitter ever measured,  I have the 0404 PCI.  What DAC are you using?
 

 

[upstateguy]

OK, the exchange unit arrived right on schedule.  Opened the box, plugged it in, selected "HiFace Kernel Streaming", set the "Out put Format" to the recommended "32bit" and now to listen to it for a while and compare it to the BC Thingee. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

[sleepy dan]

I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion.  A big stink has been kicked up, and regardless of it's veracity, M2Tech (or their distributors) want to keep their customers happy.  They'll do whatever makes business sense.
Quote:

The one glaring truth, however, is that m2tech would not be doing this exchange if the smaller clock sounded the same as the larger clock. 
 

 

[upstateguy]

Quote:

I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion.  A big stink has been kicked up, and regardless of it's veracity, M2Tech (or their distributors) want to keep their customers happy.  They'll do whatever makes business sense.

 

 
They could have just as easily stated that there was absolutely no sonic difference between the two chips, and showed some graphs and some plots, but the truth is that the small clock doesn't have the same sound signature as the large clock and they knew it.  No one does a recall for no reason.
 
I'm going to let in settle in for a little while longer, but my initial impression is that the sibilant, bright, bass light sonic signature the small clocked unit displayed, is not present in the large clocked version.  It still plays louder and remains slightly treble tilted but for the most part it sounds like the early adopter's descriptions said it would sound, especially in the bass registers. 
 
As a control I continue to compare it to my BCT and although the tone of the Thingee is extremely realistic, the gap between the two is not nearly as glaringly wide as it was before.
 
USG

 

[shamu144]

Thanks a lot USG for your efforts and for taking all this issue seriously. Your initial impressions tend to confirm indeed that both version of the Hiface do sound as different as suggested. Let us know your final word.
 
Quote:

 
 
I'm going to let in settle in for a little while longer, but my initial impression is that the sibilant, bright, bass light sonic signature the small clocked unit displayed, is not present in the large clocked version.  It still plays louder and remains slightly treble tilted but for the most part it sounds like the early adopter's descriptions said it would sound, especially in the bass registers. 
 
As a control I continue to compare it to my BCT and although the tone of the Thingee is extremely realistic, the gap between the two is not nearly as glaringly wide as it was before.
 
USG

Has anybody else contacted their Hiface distributors or M2Tech directly to ask for an exchange yet ?