Hey cool my note to Frederic Beudot made it on to 6moons!

[Akathriel]

I wrote a couple short notes helping Frederic Beudot on his article on balanced headphones and one of them was published

.

http://6moons.com/lettersfeedback/lettersfeedback.html

http://6moons.com/audioreviews/balan...hones/one.html

 

[Sovkiller]

Just a clarification that probably you are not aware of, is that the reviewers do not miss any manufacturer, the manufacturer interested in doing a review of thier respective products usually contact them to arrange a review to be done in their products...nor the other way around...

I strongly doubt that Mikhail or Ray or any other top notch small amp manufacturer, will send any reviewer a top notch amp, let's say a 10K amp to be reviewed, simply it is not practical at all, as the amp later on has to be sold as a B-stock, or a demo, and then that will lead to a considerably lost of money on the sale, that is, of course, following the good procedures and honesty, as I know they do...in other words, reviews at the end, are not free from the manufacturers as many believe they are...just my two cents...

 

[recstar24]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just a clarification that probably you are not aware of, is that the reviewers do not miss any manufacturer, the manufacturer interested in doing a review of thier respective products usually contact them to arrange a review to be done in their products...nor the other way around... I strongly doubt that Mikhail or Ray or any other top notch small amp manufacturer, will send any reviewer a top notch amp, let's say a 10K amp to be reviewed, simply it is not practical at all, as the amp later on has to be sold as a B-stock, or a demo, and then that will lead to a considerably lost of money on the sale, that is, of course, following the good procedures and honesty, as I know they do...in other words, reviews at the end, are not free from the manufacturers as many believe they are...just my two cents...

I disagree, and my personal experience as a reviewer for 6moons is in direct contrast with your opinion. The majority of my reviews have involved myself contacting the manufacturer 1st and presenting interest, in which the manufacturer can accept or decline, so far every one has accepted. Most manufacturers set aside one unit that is deemed a "reviewer's sample" that can be used solely for the purpose of reviews. The Moth S2a3 I own right now is an example and was the original model used for the stereophile and enjoy the music reviews. The Zana Deux I will be reviewing is also a review sample Craig has set aside for that sole purpose. Only one manufacturer has actually pursued me to do a review on one of his products, everyone else has been engaged by me 1st.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally Posted by recstar24 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I disagree, and my personal experience as a reviewer for 6moons is in direct contrast with your opinion. The majority of my reviews have involved myself contacting the manufacturer 1st and presenting interest, in which the manufacturer can accept or decline, so far every one has accepted. Most manufacturers set aside one unit that is deemed a "reviewer's sample" that can be used solely for the purpose of reviews. The Moth S2a3 I own right now is an example and was the original model used for the stereophile and enjoy the music reviews. The Zana Deux I will be reviewing is also a review sample Craig has set aside for that sole purpose. Only one manufacturer has actually pursued me to do a review on one of his products, everyone else has been engaged by me 1st.

That probably is your particular case, but it is has not been what I have seen in all these years, and I know it is not the general procedure...(and there is lot of politics also involved, but I will leave that BS aside)

I know from my personal experience as well, that it is really hard sometimes for unknown or small companies to get the deserved attention, or to get a review done, on sometimes products of the highest quality, and in some cases similar, or even better, than the ones we see reviewed every month, unless contacting the magazines, sometimes the reviewers, the editors, etc...

IMO if we wait for a reviewer to contact us, that will never happen, as there are so many good ones out there, to compete with, that are already well known, established, with extraordinary good reputation for years: How to beat that if you are new in the market??? Only offering a similar product, or better, at a lower price, and get advertisement and a few reviews done from trusty fellows...that is the only way for us...trust me on that...

Also IMO if you work only in what you like, or what you know, and I have nothing against that, that is your way and I respect it, but you are actually limiting yourself to only those, the ones you know off, they are a really small selection, and you will be missing the huge majority out there that will include a few good ones...of course is the safest bet, as it will be already a good known product, so nothing to loose there...

But what about manufacturers from other continents, for example, from China, did you have access or info to all the high end products available in China, right now, that are a lot BTW? or Australia? or Europe? Do you know how many small high end audio companies are emerging in western Europe right now, that we don't even know off, how do you know of them in those cases, are you going to wait ten years to know them, and then, ask them for a sample to do a review? Heed is one of them...who heard of Heed two years ago?

Also about the units for review, it is true that sometimes manufacturers keep units for review purposes, usually the most successful commercially ones maybe, but I strongly doubt that will be the top notch from them, if they are really small companies, as Singlepower, Ray, Rudistor, or any other we know...I do not think that Ray will keep a B-52 for reviews, unless his prototype, or Mikhail and SDS balanced uber top notch of about 12K, or Rudi will send and RP1000 for review....IMO it is non practical at all for them...but that could be possible of course...

 

[Dimitris]

What about profit from potential sales? Doesn't that make up for the cost of selling something as B-stock or used?

 

[asebastian0]

Quote:

Originally Posted by recstar24 /img/forum/go_quote.gif The Zana Deux I will be reviewing is also a review sample Craig has set aside for that sole purpose.

OT but hey, does this mean a full review of the ZD (beyond the paragrapgh in the GS-1000 review) is in the works?! I am dying for more impressions and reviews as I wait for mine.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimitris /img/forum/go_quote.gif What about profit from potential sales? Doesn't that make up for the cost of selling something as B-stock or used?

How may potential sales you will get on a 15K amp, even if it is reviewed by God???

Also if you send a 15K amp to be reviewed, and later on you have to sell it for 10K as a demo, how many of the other amps do you have to sell to recover 5K???

A manufacturer is in business to make profits, we all know that, the way the market should work is to make profits in each single item, that is the ideal situation, of course most of the times is not like that, but for sure they are not in business to make profits in one amp, and with this profit cover the loss of the other B-stock sold...but it is workable, and sometimes that is the reason why those B-stock exisit, becasue other paid for it...

 

[Dimitris]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif How may potential sales you will get on a 15K amp, even if it is reviewed by God??? Also if you send a 15K amp to be reviewed, and later on you have to sell it for 10K as a demo, how many of the other amps do you have to sell to recover 5K??? A manufacturer is in business to make profits, we all know that, the way the market should work is to make profits in each single item, that is the ideal situation, of course most of the times is not like that, but for sure they are not in business to make profits in one amp, and with this profit cover the loss of the other B-stock sold...but it is workable, and sometimes that is the reason why those B-stock exisit, becasue other paid for it...

Please don't forget brand equity as well. Making a top of the line product helps boost sales on lower price models too. Companies pay lots of money for advertising.
By the way, the loss is much smaller than you mention because a $15k amp doesn't cost $15k to the manufacturer to produce it.

 

[recstar24]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif I know from my personal experience as well, that it is really hard sometimes for unknown or small companies to get the deserved attention, or to get a review done, on sometimes products of the highest quality, and in some cases similar, or even better, than the ones we see reviewed every month, unless contacting the magazines, sometimes the reviewers, the editors, etc... IMO if we wait for a reviewer to contact us, that will never happen, as there are so many good ones out there, to compete with, that are already well known, established, with extraordinary good reputation for years: How to beat that if you are new in the market??? Only offering a similar product, or better, at a lower price, and get advertisement and a few reviews done from trusty fellows...that is the only way for us...trust me on that... Also IMO if you work only in what you like, or what you know, and I have nothing against that, that is your way and I respect it, but you are actually limiting yourself to only those, the ones you know off, they are a really small selection, and you will be missing the huge majority out there that will include a few good ones...of course is the safest bet, as it will be already a good known product, so nothing to loose there... But what about manufacturers from other continents, for example, from China, did you have access or info to all the high end products available in China, right now, that are a lot BTW? or Australia? or Europe? Do you know how many small high end audio companies are emerging in western Europe right now, that we don't even know off, how do you know of them in those cases, are you going to wait ten years to know them, and then, ask them for a sample to do a review? Heed is one of them...who heard of Heed two years ago?

You make a valid point; however, I was responding to your original statement that implied all review opportunities are 1st brought up by the manufacturer, which is false in my experience and false for the majority of reviewers out there, or at least the numerous ones I talk to and converse with.

If a company wants one of their products to be reviewed at 6moons, all it takes is a little email. Srajan takes that email, sends it to the whole team, and if someone is so inclined to take it, then so be it. Sometimes an email gets around and there are no-takers. It cannot be expected for us to review every single thing that is out there, or to know of the emerging company in Lithunia that has a new amp or what not. Audio reviews probably touch 10% of what is out there, but hey that's the real world and its huge and no way is the 1% of audio reviewers going to come close to covering everything up there, we just have to deal with it.

That is why these boards and similar ones are so great, those random products that wouldnt get noticed by the online and pro audio mags find their way on the boards. We're talking either the rare stuff or the awesome budget stuff that wouldnt get noticed by a big timer. And that's cool too. What's even better is if a product gets so much buzz on the boards, it is inevitable for a pro reviewer to get curious and snag it up for review, which benefits everyone in the long run.

Moral of the story - most reviews are pursued and engaged by the reviewer themselves and their personal interest is what drives what is get reviewed or not. Because of that fact, manufacturers have to really work their butts off to get their products exposure, but hey, you didn't think it was going to be easy to run a successful company, did you?