Headphones for metal music - ultimate solution
May 11, 2015 at 11:50 PM Post #1,201 of 12,280
I have listened to those a bit at a show, and thought they were quite good, I would tentatively put them on the HD800 level. They aren't a miracle or anything, just an excellent headphone at a quite reasonable price for their sound quality.


that confirms my impressions. I'm friends with a dealer and I might be able to get them at a discount. Looking for my close to endgame-comparing to the 560 and maybe LCD-2. I'd like to hear the Ether-they all seem to be in the ballpark.
 
May 12, 2015 at 12:44 AM Post #1,206 of 12,280
What do you have left to listen to? Weren't you selling all your music...

I liked the focals but didn't love them. I really wanted to but it worked out better for me in the end anyways

 
Hiya! I don't remember you leaving the main metal thread to come here until now.
biggrin.gif

 
I listen to digital files exclusively. My CDs are in storage right now, actually.
 
If you've heard some of the best high-end stuff, I don't doubt that the FSP might sound mediocre in comparison. But I haven't heard anything over $1,000 yet.
 
May 12, 2015 at 1:48 AM Post #1,207 of 12,280
The nicest (and most $) I heard were the lcd2. It's diminishing returns to me but it's cool to have the high end stuff out there.

good luck on the collection quest, I read that flagship battle thread all the time and daydream.

This thread got really expensive though ha ha. If metal doesnt sound completely amazing on the he1000's then I think you got swindled
 
May 12, 2015 at 3:21 AM Post #1,209 of 12,280
 
My thought is that if you have such an extensive list of headphones you lust for, you really should go to a meet/show where you will have a chance to try many of them. Clearly, you've got a lot of decisions to make (closed/open/IEM, dark/neutral/bright/etc., ethereal/palpable, revealing/masking....)
 
That said, as an old-time Head-Fi metalhead, I respect your dilemma, and appreciate your enthusiam, so I will give you a brief primer on my thoughts on this topic, developed over the course of well over a decade worth of high-end headphone experience.
 
What I look for in headphones for metal listening:
 
1) Transparency to the source/recording: This is paramount, as most metal is a rather dense, layered sound, and a more transparent headphone will offer a great ability to hear into that sonic jungle. This primarily pertains to how quickly a headphone responds to the incoming signal to create a deep, nuanced, representation thereof, but to a more minor extent the frequency response as well, where major fluctuations from neutral distract from transparency. Typically, in my experience, a more transparent headphone will tend to produce a sound that feels less "inside the head" than a less transparent headphone, and the more transparent headphone will build sonic "images" that are more precise/pinpoint.
 
2) Physical/palpable bass presentation: This implies bass that can be felt, in addition to being heard, which by and large rules out electrostatic headphones (as, by nature of their design, they do not move the large quantities of air required to feel bass via bone conduction). The quicker, more responsive the driver, the better controlled this bass presentation can be, and the more realistic the sound as a result. Planar headphones as a group excel here, combining tactile bass response with superior control as compared to most dynamic headphones. This is also an area where IEM's simply due to the nature of their application, also struggle; however, given their unique properties regarding portability and isolation, I would typically consider them somewhat apart from traditional headphones anyway.
 
3) Seasoning to taste. This is where personal preference really comes in, as well as fit to particular genres or recordings. One could find a single headphone that suits their collection "well enough" or try to cover different material with the sounds of different headphones, deciding which to use when.
 
As such, based on the more objective criteria 1 and 2, my preference for metal listening in this day and age is for planar magnetic headphones, when affordable, as I have simply found they offer a better combination of transparency and bass performance than do dynamic or electrostatic headphones, the Sennheiser HD800 being an exception to that rule (though it has its' own, non-standard dynamic driver anyway).
 
Here's a group of headphones that I feel all do very well in #1 and #2 for their prices (have personal experience with all), are sub $1k (if barely in some cases), in current production (or in stock at very least in the case of two) and do not require $1K+ amplification to sound close to their potential:
 
Group 1
 
Audeze EL-8
Fostex TH-600
Hifiman HE-560, HE-500, HE-400i, HE-400
LFF/Engimatic Paradox and Paradox Slant
MrSpeakers Mad Dog, Alpha Dog, and Alpha Prime
Oppo PM-2
 
I would take any of the above headphones without question over the standard dyanmic driver headphones that proliferate in the $200-600 range, such as the HD580/600/650, DT770/880/990, RS-1/2, ATH-A/AD/Wxxxx. Choice of which headphone would get into criteria 3, as well as fit/comfort, which is where there is no substitute for trying in person.
 
 
You can certainly get a higher level of overall performance going higher up the chain, but that often comes at the expense of more severe amplification needs as well. I've listed the HE-560 here as well, because I feel that it does scale up with better amplification, and is overall a match for the HE-6 when well-powered, though the two have differing presentations and strengths/weaknesses. *I have listed the Stax for their level of transparency, despite their non-tactile electrostatic bass presentation (which would not necessarily be a problem for all listeners).
 
Group 2
 
Audeze LCD-3f, LCD-X
Hifiman HE-560, HE-6
MrSpeakers Ether
Sennheiser HD800
(Stax SR-007mkII, SR507)*
 
Again, the same caveats apply regarding fit and sonic taste.
 
Based on several listening sessions I have had with them over the course of the year, I do feel that the objective performance of the Hifiman HE-1000 is on another level from that tier of headphones, as they produce a level of transparency comparable to the best electrostatic headphones, while also managing to provide excellent palpable bass response, for the best overall performance in criteria 1 and 2 that I have personally heard. *I have listed the Stax for their level of transparency, despite their non-tactile electrostatic bass presentation (which would not necessarily be a problem for all listeners).
 
Group 3
 
Hifiman HE-1000
(Stax SR-009)*
 
These recommendations are regarding headphones in current production, so no discontinued unicorns on this list. I did not mention the JPS Labs Abyss, as I have not gotten to listen to it extensively with known supporting equipment, though my one experience with it was somewhat sonically and physically trying, I would like to hear it again under more controlled circumstances.
 
 
Take that as a rough guideline, and get out there and listen to some headphones. No amount of talk here is ever substitute for trying them yourselves!
 
One more point regarding unobtanium discontinued unicorn headphones: do not be swayed by their market value into believing that they perform better than they really do. Most of them were loved in their time due to the lack of the amazing selection of top headphones now available. While many have redeeming characteristics, they also have their warts as well. Do yourself a favor, and unless you are a collector, don't be distracted by them! There are headphones out there now every bit equal to, if not better than the Sony R10, Sennheiser HE90, Audio-Technica L3000, and all those other headphones you've read about or seen pictures of, but can't get. Focus on what you can get, and don't overpay for what you can't.
 

Interesting read. I'm not so sure if I agree on the palpable bass, which might be nice sometimes and definitely good for movies, but which I tend to find distracting for music. But I do agree that transparency can definitely help with metal, though it would probably also make it easier to hear the flaws in the recording / mastering.
 
May 12, 2015 at 3:55 AM Post #1,210 of 12,280
  >cabling making audible difference for hd650
>hd800 rated relatively poorly for *every* genre
 
Oh boy here we go...


Yes, because the HD800 is not a good headphones for listening to heavy metal whatsoever. It sounds placid and limp, too spacious and lacks a feeling of grunt or aggression with these genres. My opinion on their sound for heavy metal, coming from someone who owned them for 6 months and has heard them on quite a number of different systems.
 
The HD800 works and is outstanding for many genres, just not metal.
 
May 12, 2015 at 4:22 AM Post #1,211 of 12,280
 
I didn't mean to flame or go off-topic.
 
I don't consider myself to be an audiophile, but I am someone that notices the detail in the music and enjoys hearing it. I suppose that I have more of an engineer's ear for things than an audiophile's. Unfortunately, that means that I tend to have to look to higher end gear to get the detail and sound signature that I prefer. For instance, I listen to the HD600 and find it the right sound signature, but otherwise not that special. The various DT770/880/990 generally do not have my preferred sound signature. The Focal Spirit Pro didn't do much for me either, though it was pretty close to the right sound signature. The HD800 put a smile on my face, though. The detail was amazing. Bass was a bit much, though I suspect my FiiO X3 added quite a bit of its own there.
 
If I get something like that, I'll be satisfied for a long time to come. If I get the HD600, I would probably be looking for something else within the year.

Well, the point was, that if you enjoy the ride, why to stop it? To try new gear is a real fun. To try less expensive gear is less expensive fun. And if the volume of fun is almost the same - why to pay more? ))
 
May 12, 2015 at 4:27 AM Post #1,212 of 12,280
In my home town, metalheads in most cases are unemployed 30 year old dudes, who lives with parents. They even can't afford themselves to buy a can of beer.
And metalheads on your planet gather collection of most expensive headphones in the world.
What's the secret? Tell me, please
popcorn.gif

Well, why social status should limit them to discuss expensive headphones? ))
And probably you see, that my home town is in the same country.
 
Толстоватый троллинг, на форуме Докторхеда в аналогичной ветке можно убедиться в широте географии металхедов с дорогими наушниками ))
 
May 12, 2015 at 4:29 AM Post #1,213 of 12,280
   
My thought is that if you have such an extensive list of headphones you lust for, you really should go to a meet/show where you will have a chance to try many of them. Clearly, you've got a lot of decisions to make (closed/open/IEM, dark/neutral/bright/etc., ethereal/palpable, revealing/masking....)
 
That said, as an old-time Head-Fi metalhead, I respect your dilemma, and appreciate your enthusiam, so I will give you a brief primer on my thoughts on this topic, developed over the course of well over a decade worth of high-end headphone experience.
 
What I look for in headphones for metal listening:
 
1) Transparency to the source/recording: This is paramount, as most metal is a rather dense, layered sound, and a more transparent headphone will offer a great ability to hear into that sonic jungle.  This primarily pertains to how quickly a headphone responds to the incoming signal to create a deep, nuanced, representation thereof, but to a more minor extent the frequency response as well, where major fluctuations from neutral distract from transparency.  Typically, in my experience, a more transparent headphone will tend to produce a sound that feels less "inside the head" than a less transparent headphone, and the more transparent headphone will build sonic "images" that are more precise/pinpoint.
 
2) Physical/palpable bass presentation: This implies bass that can be felt, in addition to being heard, which by and large rules out electrostatic headphones (as, by nature of their design, they do not move the large quantities of air required to feel bass via bone conduction). The quicker, more responsive the driver, the better controlled this bass presentation can be, and the more realistic the sound as a result.  Planar headphones as a group excel here, combining tactile bass response with superior control as compared to most dynamic headphones. This is also an area where IEM's simply due to the nature of their application, also struggle; however, given their unique properties regarding portability and isolation, I would typically consider them somewhat apart from traditional headphones anyway.
 
3) Seasoning to taste.  This is where personal preference really comes in, as well as fit to particular genres or recordings. One could find a single headphone that suits their collection "well enough" or try to cover different material with the sounds of different headphones, deciding which to use when.
 
As such, based on the more objective criteria 1 and 2, my preference for metal listening in this day and age is for planar magnetic headphones, when affordable, as I have simply found they offer a better combination of transparency and bass performance than do dynamic or electrostatic headphones, the Sennheiser HD800 being an exception to that rule (though it has its' own, non-standard dynamic driver anyway).
 
Here's a group of headphones that I feel all do very well in #1 and #2 for their prices (have personal experience with all), are sub $1k (if barely in some cases), in current production (or in stock at very least in the case of two) and do not require $1K+ amplification to sound close to their potential:
 
Group 1
 
Audeze EL-8
Fostex TH-600
Hifiman HE-560, HE-500, HE-400i, HE-400
LFF/Engimatic Paradox and Paradox Slant
MrSpeakers Mad Dog, Alpha Dog, and Alpha Prime
Oppo PM-2
 
I would take any of the above headphones without question over the standard dyanmic driver headphones that proliferate in the $200-600 range, such as the HD580/600/650, DT770/880/990, RS-1/2, ATH-A/AD/Wxxxx. Choice of which headphone would get into criteria 3, as well as fit/comfort, which is where there is no substitute for trying in person.
 
 
You can certainly get a higher level of overall performance going higher up the chain, but that often comes at the expense of more severe amplification needs as well. I've listed the HE-560 here as well, because I feel that it does scale up with better amplification, and is overall a match for the HE-6 when well-powered, though the two have differing presentations and strengths/weaknesses.  *I have listed the Stax for their level of transparency, despite their non-tactile electrostatic bass presentation (which would not necessarily be a problem for all listeners).
 
Group 2
 
Audeze LCD-3f, LCD-X
Hifiman HE-560, HE-6
MrSpeakers Ether
Sennheiser HD800
(Stax SR-007mkII, SR507)*
 
Again, the same caveats apply regarding fit and sonic taste.
 
Based on several listening sessions I have had with them over the course of the year, I do feel that the objective performance of the Hifiman HE-1000 is on another level from that tier of headphones, as they produce a level of transparency comparable to the best electrostatic headphones, while also managing to provide excellent palpable bass response, for the best overall performance in criteria 1 and 2 that I have personally heard. *I have listed the Stax for their level of transparency, despite their non-tactile electrostatic bass presentation (which would not necessarily be a problem for all listeners).
 
Group 3
 
Hifiman HE-1000
(Stax SR-009)*
 
These recommendations are regarding headphones in current production, so no discontinued unicorns on this list. I did not mention the JPS Labs Abyss, as I have not gotten to listen to it extensively with known supporting equipment, though my one experience with it was somewhat sonically and physically trying, I would like to hear it again under more controlled circumstances.
 
 
Take that as a rough guideline, and get out there and listen to some headphones. No amount of talk here is ever substitute for trying them yourselves!
 
One more point regarding unobtanium discontinued unicorn headphones: do not be swayed by their market value into believing that they perform better than they really do.  Most of them were loved in their time due to the lack of the amazing selection of top headphones now available.  While many have redeeming characteristics, they also have their warts as well.  Do yourself a favor, and unless you are a collector, don't be distracted by them!  There are headphones out there now every bit equal to, if not better than the Sony R10, Sennheiser HE90, Audio-Technica L3000, and all those other headphones you've read about or seen pictures of, but can't get. Focus on what you can get, and don't overpay for what you can't.

Great post! I hope you won't mind if I make link to it from the header post?
 
May 12, 2015 at 5:26 AM Post #1,214 of 12,280
  Well, the point was, that if you enjoy the ride, why to stop it? To try new gear is a real fun. To try less expensive gear is less expensive fun. And if the volume of fun is almost the same - why to pay more? ))

I suppose that is were we differ in opinion =) I enjoy looking for the right headphone (or anything else, really), but buying and selling lots of gear is not fun to me. Trying gear is ok, if only to get an idea of what sound to expect from different headphones and to get a reference for reading reviews. But buying lots of stuff that I know I will not like that much seems kind of pointless.
 
May 12, 2015 at 6:44 AM Post #1,215 of 12,280
I feel that V shaped are best for metal, and then the situation is split between those who want forward mids and those who want more soundstage. 
 
There is always sennheiser hd380 pro with great soundstage AND forward mids!
 
I would still put the best headphones for metalsomething with harsh treble, like ultrasone headphones, headphones that have smooth treble are great for listening experience in general, but for metal metal, you need some more violent sound, cymbals really help with this. Also, having smooth treble also affects vocals, making scream and growl sound too easy, or too lean sometimes. 
 

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