[mrwinick]

After a little more time with both the Ken-Rad and Tung-Sol I can say that they both are fantastic and I'm not sure I'd be able to distinguish between them if I were blindfolded. However, it seems that the Ken-Rad might have heavier bass and the Tung-sol better clarity and balance. With the Tung-Sol I noticed some nuance to some music I listen to regularly that I hadn't noticed before and the soundstage seemed to expand. Ken-Rad seems a little more laid-back. Both great tubes that I would highly recommend.
More importantly--A HUGE thank you to Sacd Lover. I have leaned heavily on his advice and opinions over the last few years (mpx3 and hd600 and now 6f8g) and I am amazed at the sound quality that I have achieved. There is no way that I would have found my way to my current setup without Earl's input. Thank you.

 

[mrwinick]

A black glass round plate tung-sol arrived today. I'll need to spend more time with it, but my first impression is that of the tubes I've now tried (rca, sylvania, ken-rad, tung-sol clear glass and tung-sol black glass) this is my favorite. I should mention that I'm combining the 6f8g with two sylvania vt-231's. I listen to jazz, blues and classic rock. In general, I want a broad and deep soundstage, instrument separation and detail and strong but tight bass. The tung-sol black glass seems to do the best job of getting there. I'll try to spend some time over the next week going back and forth between the different 6f8g's to see if I can do a better job describing relative strength and weakness of the different tubes. I'll also put in some raytheon vt-231's and see what that does in combination with the different 6f8g's.
I'll also reiterate that anyone who can should try this tube. The difference between the 6f8g, in my opinion, and the 6sn7 is not subtle. The small investment in the adapter and tubes is some of the best money I've spent in this hobby. I was seriously considering making a change from my hd600's to try to get a little more 'life' in the music. That is no longer necessary.

 

[Skylab]

Excellent! And I agree with you 100% - the 6F8G is great tube fun!!!!!

 

[mrwinick]

Bah! I expected this to be easier. I thought it would be clear that the black glass tung-sol was the best tube and then I'd be able to rank the others behind it. Nothing is ever easy. I usually listen to jazz, but for the last week or so I've been listening to a bunch of Neil Young (after seeing him in concert I needed more). The Tung-sol is brilliant. Fantastic actually. But when I switched to Miles Davis-Kind of Blue the trumpet solo in Blue in Green started to drill a hole in my head. I popped out the Tung-sol and put the Ken-rad in and I was immediately in music heaven. I was enveloped in rich, deep music. So I listened to some Bill Evans and had a similar reaction. Then I put Gerry Mulligan-At the Village Vanguard on and the music seemed a little bloated. So I pulled the Ken-rad and put the Tung-sol back in and Gerry was insanely good. Everything tightened up and the bass was moved back a step. Then I put in the sylvania 6f8g and switched out the sylvania vt-231's and put in raytheon vt-231's. Awesome. The sylvania was great with the sylvania vt-231's, but the raytheon's added a little more 'oomph.'
I have more work to do to organize my thoughts on these tubes. (Can you imagine better work? If only this paid.....) Bottom line so far-I love 6F8G's.

 

[Skylab]

Yeah, such is the way when you are talking about musical subtleties - but this is great fun!

 

[mrwinick]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sacd lover /img/forum/go_quote.gif I like the Sylvania too. I have one in a PPX3 SLAM with TS 5687s right now .... a very transparent combo with a nice openess and fast transients. The RCA works best with a brighter output tube like the Amperex 7119, IMO.

After adding slam adapters and spending time with them I came back to this thread to re-read it and the above quote is Dead On.

I'd decided that of my 6f8g's the best of them was the TS round plate. In front of two raytheon vt231's the music was as close to perfectly balanced as I can imagine. Great impact on the bass and amazing clarity and detail. I would describe the music as effortless and beautiful.

Then I got the slam adapters and TS 5687 D Getters and Amperex 7119's. I first tried the TS because they seem to be the most highly regarded. I immediately liked them. They add heft to the bass as well as impact. Unfortunately, I also felt like they made the music less balanced-leaning too much to bass.

I switched to the Amperex and immediately liked them too. They made the music so 'airy.' Open and clear and detailed. Really a great tube, but I felt like it too was a little unbalanced in the other direction-not enough bass impact.

I was a little flummoxed because I knew I had my favorite input tube. Then I thought that maybe the Sylvania 6f8g (a little less bass than the TS) might complement the 5687's and maybe the Ken-Rad would complement the Amperex.

So, this was my morning-switching between these three combinations.

I'll cut to the chase and just say that I'm listening to the Ken-Rad 6f8g and Amperex 7119's right now. Amazingly powerful and tight bass. I can feel the impact. At the same time the clarity, detail, soundstage and 'air' is just awesome. This will be my combo for rock.

I'd have to spend more time switching between the TS/ vt231 combo and the Sylvania/5687 combo to come to a definitive decision between them. They both were fantastic. I'd probably lean to the TS/vt231 because of the amazing balance.

More to follow.

 

[Black Stuart]

I've got some Tung Sol/RPs and some Syls' coming - looking forward to how the will compare to my Russian 1578s.

 

[Frihed89]

This is a really interesting, fun and friendly thread.

The Tung-Sol also is very good input tube for the deHavilland Ultraverve2 preamp, along with the 7N7 and 7AF7. As much as I like the 6F8Gs, the 7N7 has an aura of "effortlessness" that I find very beguiling. I hear exactly the same thing as you others hear with the T-S. It also has a bit of character that I can't put my finger, because when I compare it with the metal base Sylvania 6SN7W - supposedly the king of balance an detail - I end up preferring the T-S 6F8G, as an input in my MPX3 or UV2. I have 2 adapters, so I have tried the 6F8G as an output tube, but I prefer it as input, where I find its influence more distinctive.

I only have the Sylvanias and T-S versions of the 6F8G. I find the Sylvanias thin by comparison.

Remember, I have had 3 ear operations!

 

[sacd lover]

I just dug out a Sylvania 6F8G to pair with TS 5687s in my MPX3. I still love the KR in my Supra-Extreme with TS 6080s. I was going to try another TS but the tube fell out of the badly deteriorated box and plunged to its death.

 

[mrwinick]

nooooooooooooo.
I feel like a moment of silence is appropriate.
Those are so hard to come by.

 

[mrwinick]

I have spent a bunch of time today listening to my various 6f8g's in front of two amperex 7119's. I listened to an RCA, Sylvania, KR, Tung sol clear glass, and TS black glass (flat plates). I also switched in a KR vt231 to compare. I much prefer the 6f8g's. The KR vt231 is nice, but too laid back. All of the 6f8g's have more impact to the music. The RCA is the most laid back of the 6f8g's. Nice, but too mellow for the music I've been listening to today. I still like the Sylvania, but my initial impression stands- with the 7119 the Sylvania is not an ideal companion. A little too thin on the bass. Between the KR and two TS's I prefer the clear glass TS. The KR still has the most bass, but the TS clear glass has only a little less, but a little tighter. The black glass (flat plate) TS was good, but didn't offer the same power or excitement as the KR or clear glass.
I usually listen to jazz, so I'm assuming everything will change when I get back to listening to my regular line-up.
I'll also need to run all of the 6f8g's in front of the TS 5687's.
I'll update after I've had some time with my friends Miles, Mingus, Gerry, Bill (Evans), and the rest of the crew.

 

[Skylab]

Interesting stuff, thanks! Loving it that you are are still getting into this wonderful tube.

 

[Frihed89]

Get rid of those 7119s and get some T-S or Raytheon or even GE 5687s. The Amperex tube is generally pretty closed in and lacking in detail. I know: I have a bunch.

 

[sacd lover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frihed89 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Get rid of those 7119s and get some T-S or Raytheon or even GE 5687s. The Amperex tube is generally pretty closed in and lacking in detail. I know: I have a bunch.

I get almost the opposite impression when I listen to the Amperex 7119 tube in the output position. I find them clean, fast and very detailed; possibly a little bright sounding. I dont remember what gain tube I used them with though. Maybe a 6350/6463 for gain? However, I have heard a few 7119 sound a little dull when I used them for gain. But, I dont find any of the 5687 series to do well when used as a gain tube in my SP amps.

 

[Frihed89]

These are Phillips, not Amperex, I think. In fact I do have some Amperex pinched waist 7119, but I overlooked them. Now I see, I have also mixed up some Phillips 5687 with some Amperex. But on inspection, except for the pinched waist, the phillips, valvo and amperex tubes (7119 and 5687) all have these long thick (not really box) plates and look alike. These are the ones we talked about a while back. So, either i stuck them in the wrong boxes or they are all Phillips relabeled...except for the pinch waist.