Hardly anybody is hearing HD600/650 at their best

[greggf]

I'm using Sennheiser HD600 headphones now, with the Eddie Current Zana Deux amp, and what I'm hearing indicates that I've never really heard these headphones before.

I've had lots of sub-$1k headphone amps - the Headroom Millett Hybrid, the Naim Headline2, the Lehmann Black Cube Linear, the PS Audio GCHA, the WooAudio3, and even the Melos SHA-1, but geez, the HD600 are far richer, more harmonically-complex, and dynamic than I ever knew possible.

Veil? What nonsense. Completely inconceivable to think of "veils" now. The infamous veil is a byproduct of the headphone amp being used, I'm afraid.

Now I'm itching to try the HD650 - again.

I'm afraid it isn't as bloated and slow as other amps have presented it.

I can't speak about balancing the Senns, or other high end amps, balanced or otherwise. I'm skeptical about balancing. I assume the theoretical benefits that balancing add are subtracted by balancing's complexity. But now I don't know.

It looks like any extreme measure that you can take when it comes to the HD6XX is worth a shot, whether it's an obscene application of cash, balancing, coal-fired amplification, whatever.

If I was just starting out, I'd stick to something like the HD595, something that's easy to drive. I wouldn't fool with the 600 or 650. The 595 is a good headphone. Paired with a Heed or a Musical Fidelity XCan, you got it made.

Which brings up the question, both philosophical and practical: is it better to drive a good headphone well, or better to drive an excellent headphone less well?

I'd pick the former, but I'm sure lots of people would pick the latter.

 

[Chu]

The answer is sort of trite, but it really is true, the correct answer is whatever sounds better.

In most cases I think that's going to be the latter. The diminishing returns in this hobby are staggering. If you have a headphone that absolutely needs an amp for any fidelity whatsoever like the HD600, just by driving them at all you're probably about 80-90% of the way to perfection.

For headphones that don't strictly need an amp, really I have to assume the reason you don't want an amp is you can't afford one, and in this pricerange (we're talking, oh, $100-$200 or so) I have to say that you're better off dumping the money into higher quality but easier to drive cans then messing around with portable amps.

It also helps you can get high quality setups (or, well, entry-level if you've found us, sorry about your wallet and all of that) for a staggeringly cheap amount these days. A refurb or used HD580 will run you $130 or so. You can get a HEADSIX for $100 or so. Moving up a tier would probably require doubling your budget.

Really it all hinges on your definition of "well."

 

[tom hankins]

I still consider the Singlepower SDS-XLR/HD650 with Zu XLR cable to be better than everything I have heard but the Orpheus and SDS/R10.(balanced and SE)

 

[thrice]

To the OP: you should check out this thread: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showth...turbing+trends

 

[greggf]

That thread - oh, man, it's not my intention to start that up again.

I guess this is a variation, but what I'm shocked about now is the leap the HD600 have taken with a new, better, and definitely expensive amp. This is about shock & awe.

The HD6XX are in no way the limiting factor in anybody's system. The limiting factors are the headphone amps and the sources.

There are a lot of EXPENSIVE amps out there that are just not letting headphones shine as much as they can, and not, I fear, just Sennheisers.

I'd like to know why so many $1k amps can sound so ehhh..............

 

[Chrysoberyl]

is it better to drive a good headphone well, or better to drive an excellent headphone less well?


I don't know,but my experience here with my new HD600 and my old HD595,both driven from a humble EMU 0404 usb is that the former sound much,much better than the latter.I don't keep the HD595 any more,I understood the meaning of "Senn's Veil" with those.

 

[Agnostic]

I have both the HD580 and the HD595 and out of my cheap chinese Tube amp it only took me a few seconds to come to the conclusion that the HD580 was the better sounding can of the two:

More detailed and smoother mids, deeper bass extension, better decay on the treble and wider soundstage, the improved mids being the most immediately evident. I had very high expectations of the HD580 before hearing it after reading all the praise it gets here and I was still very impressed (and happy

) when I first heard it.

So for me definitely: excellent headphone less well driven.

 

[Audio-Omega]

I would like to hear my HD650 at its best if budget allowed ! Actually I wouldn't mind buying a good amp if it could last at least 10 years.

 

[purk]

Quote:

I still consider the Singlepower SDS-XLR/HD650 with Zu XLR cable to be better than everything I have heard but the Orpheus and SDS/R10.(balanced and SE) __________________

Agreed.


Quote:

I'm using Sennheiser HD600 headphones now, with the Eddie Current Zana Deux amp, and what I'm hearing indicates that I've never really heard these headphones before. I've had lots of sub-$1k headphone amps - the Headroom Millett Hybrid, the Naim Headline2, the Lehmann Black Cube Linear, the PS Audio GCHA, the WooAudio3, and even the Melos SHA-1, but geez, the HD600 are far richer, more harmonically-complex, and dynamic than I ever knew possible. Veil? What nonsense. Completely inconceivable to think of "veils" now. The infamous veil is a byproduct of the headphone amp being used, I'm afraid. Now I'm itching to try the HD650 - again. I'm afraid it isn't as bloated and slow as other amps have presented it.

Yes, and that what I've been feeling about them for years. They are indeed the best headphone under 1k. You should check the HD-650 out with your zana deux and you will understand why I never feel that they are slow nor bloated. Don't forget to bring out the best of both headphones with some cable upgrades. I'm glad that you are enjoying the HD-650 as I consider them a true bargain headphone.

 

[shaizada]

Frankly, the HD-650/600 series are some of the only headphones I have seen that have changed dramatically with true upgrades in my sonic chain. Frankly, I thought my Rudistor RP7 was a pretty good amp. Now it has become an AMAZING amp and that is only single ended.

I have a balanced amp on the way and can't wait to hear the balanced difference in my own personal home setup....not some meet situation.

The HD-600/650 are ANYTHING but true bargains in my book (sorry Purk!

). They might be "affordable" to buy, but they truly need some serious components behind them to shine and show what they are capable of.

That transition is truly eye opening and I can proclaim that these Senns are frikkin expensive headphones.

~G

 

[QQQ]

That applies to any other headphones, even cheap ones. Great amp can do great things.

 

[mcmyers]

There are undoubtedly other headphones that sound better from lesser amps than the Senn 6X0 series, but I've yet to hear any. Out of my Hornet, the 650s sound better to my ears than 595s, Denon D2000s, and Beyer DT990s. Maybe I just like the veil (my ears are very sensitive to high frequencies), but to me the 650s offer the best combination of good sound and no fatigue that I've ever heard.

But do I want to hear them with a killer amp? Absolutely. That's what Christmas is for.

 

[vcoheda]

ime, the 650 requires to a greater extent than other headphones really good amplification to sound even close to their best. the 650 properly driven, with a cable upgrade, and balanced, is about as close to perfection as one can get with headphones.

 

[vcoheda]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agnostic /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have both the HD580 and the HD595 and out of my cheap chinese Tube amp it only took me a few seconds to come to the conclusion that the HD580 was the better sounding can of the two.

the 595 is a very mediocre headphone. no where close to being high-fi. would take the 580 any day - even unamped - over them.

 

[Elephas]

If the HD600 + Zana Deux is so much better than the HD600 + Lehmann Black Cube Linear, I'm missing out big time.

I think the HD600 + Lehmann BCL pairing is very good, competitive vs. the Prehead MkII SE, Corda Opera, Graham Slee Solo or RSA Raptor. The HD600 + Zana Deux pairing should also be a lot better than these amps.