Grado, volume and "harshness"

[Solan]

I made an unpleasant discovery today, while walking on the treadmill (see profile pic). Instead of watching a movie, I was listening to some music with a bit of treble. Well, the set-up is like this

MacBook Pro >> Grado 325i

I usually have the volume on 5 dots when listening to music, but because of the treadmill noise I was up to 10. And I noticed that the music would become uncomfortable whenever higher frequencies were encountered. Too emphasized! So I started wondering if either the Grado detractors were right, or whether reading their complaints has coloured my impressions of my cans. Anyway, I started paying attention to it, and the highs "made my ears bleed".

Damn! And I had even planned on getting the GS-1000 ...

Sworn to look more deeply into Beyer DT880, AKG K701 and even old clampie HD650, I sat down in the livingroom afterwards ... music out of the MacBook. But ... well, a colleague of mine and former sound engineer once stopped by my office to listen to the music coming out of the MacBook speakers, and said he was impressed with the sound quality considering that it was a mere laptop ... well, none the less, for the peace of the house and all that, I put my headphones on, and listened to music that way again. Of course, my raw, sore nerve endings reached out to condemn even the smallest hints of glare in the sound. So ...

Nothing happened! Once again the sound was sweet and without problems. Clear, beautiful. What the ... ????

So I decided to turn up the volume a bit, and right enough, I started noticing how the music would reach temporary harshnesses. Or more permanent if I turned it really way up.

So I got some perspective which could explain why so many hate headphones others love: your experience is very dependent on volume! Well, I checked out the thread on low-volume listening, where GS-1000 was deemed to be the best can for low-volume listening, but with frequent caveats that it would sound wrong / harsh / bassy at higher volumes (but oh so right at lower volumes).

I'm still a bit shaken in my faith that my next pair of cans will also be a pair of Grados, but ... well, the high-volume experience was new to me after 18 months of owning 325i and has at least given me interesting insights ... anyone else with similar experiences?

 

[intoflatlines]

Do you have bowls on the SR325i?

 

[Solan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by intoflatlines /img/forum/go_quote.gif Do you have bowls on the SR325i?

Yes. Just the way they came out of the box.

 

[Jaska]

I don't listen to my Grados or any headphones at loud volumes, and I haven't heard the SR325i (just all the models below that). However, I don't experience any "unbearable" treble at all with any music that I've listened to so far when using my 5G iPod as a source. However, the treble fairly easily becomes a problem for me when using my Apogee Duet. In this case, it all depends on the mastering of the music.

Isn't it commonly held that of all the Grados, the SR325i has the most accentuated treble? I would start by trying flat pads to see if that helps. On a very good recommendation from someone I trust here, I have decided to give them a try with my SR225.

 

[intoflatlines]

I find the treble on the SR325i is way too harsh with bowls, but with flats they sound amazing.

 

[Solan]

flatlines: The 325i sound great for everyday, low-volume listening, but I will be wary of high volumes again, especially with treble-rich music. But it may be that I would like them with flats for low-volume, even so.

Jaska: The Duet is treble happy? Do you know if the mini-DAC suffers the same problem? Or might the problem (on higher volumes) reside in the amp or DAC just as much as in the headphones?

 

[intoflatlines]

I'd say try out some flats or comfies and see how you like them both at low and high volumes, then.

 

[Jaska]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solan /img/forum/go_quote.gif Jaska: The Duet is treble happy? Do you know if the mini-DAC suffers the same problem? Or might the problem (on higher volumes) reside in the amp or DAC just as much as in the headphones?

I think the Grados are treble-happy, and that this characteristic is easily brought out by a very detailed source and amp. My ER-4S, by contrast, continue to be my go-to headphones, handling absolutely everything with grace and style.

I will be trying the flat pads soon, and I'm also expecting a new amp (Gilmore Lite), so hopefully I'll get the treble tamed down a bit. If not, the Grados will go up for sale at that point. I'm really hoping it won't come to that, though.

 

[pataburd]

With a suitable source and amp, the 325i's treble can sound transparent--even "silky," textured and wonderfully detailed.

 

[Uncle Erik]

Grados are better with a tube amp. Tubes will take some of the harshness off the top end.

Also, if you generally like the forward Grado sound, you would probably enjoy the DT880.

 

[Punnisher]

Well you said it yourself: you normally listen at 5 and were listening at 10 when it became harsh. Any headphone will sound harsh if you listen too loud.

A person with bad hearing would have to turn it up to 10 but may not be affected by the harshness, who knows.

Also anice headamp would likely cure this imbalance-due-to-volume.

 

[M0T0XGUY]

I don't think this harshness is necessarily the byproduct of loud volume itself, but rather the limited abilities of your Macbook Pro's audio. Given a decent amp or improved source (tubes wouldn't hurt) I think you'll be able to listen louder while maintaining a more mellow sound.

 

[fld777]

i have not experence with 325i but have used 125s for quite sometime.
THese are quite revealing & i wouldnt be suprised sound out of the macbook to be harsh or bright.
However with a really good source and a good tube amp, that excess treble will transform to something silky and smooth which is very nice and intoxicating.

 

[dakkar]

I would look at the sound source. From my experience (not much really) when the source is pushed too hard, the sound suffers (either car sound system or headphones...)

 

[Happy Camper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fld777 /img/forum/go_quote.gif i have not experence with 325i but have used 125s for quite sometime. THese are quite revealing & i wouldnt be suprised sound out of the macbook to be harsh or bright. However with a really good source and a good tube amp, that excess treble will transform to something silky and smooth which is very nice and intoxicating.

The quality tube amp also brings the details so far out of the background, you don't need the dbs to hear them. Listening to the Ipod w/o amping can get a hi freq bullet in the ear. Its usually the recording though, not the hp. So I would agree with dakkar.

Ferds, your daughter is soooooo cute. And RS-1s just look that much better.