Gangs of New York
Jan 4, 2003 at 8:29 PM Post #16 of 23
Quote:

Originally posted by Tuberoller
Very bad comparison....... BlackHawk Down is as accurate a depiction of actual events as I have yet seen portrayed on film.

I am not completely familiar with the events depicted in Gangs of New York but I think it is an excellent film.The violence seems gratuitous at times but seems to flow well and forward the story in a constructive manner.


Tuberoller
You cannot imagine the sigh of relief I had to see that your reply was so on topic. Maybe there is hope for us to be friends yet.

I don't know how accurate either film is. My point was that both films claim to be accurate and that in reality, this is only an excuse for the violence that the audience pays to see. Therefore, how accurate to historical events either one actually is seems irrelevent--or in the least, ancilliary.
 
Jan 4, 2003 at 9:01 PM Post #17 of 23
Kelly,

I have been trying to play nice.I know you sometimes make comments to encite a riot but that is not always a bad thing......
wink.gif
.I get the feeling that you are probably a decent guy who has some really passionate beliefs.


I was in Africa during the Blackhawk events and have talked with two of the ARMY Rangers that were involved.I was part of the initial 20,000 troop deployment and was one of the 800 MARINES that stayed behind to aid in the NATO "Peace Keeping" and aid mission.I think the violence portrayed in Blackhawk Down reflects the actual events in an accurate manner.
 
Jan 4, 2003 at 11:06 PM Post #18 of 23
kelly, tell me, did you really feel like the movie went anywhere when Leo's character was the only one on the screen? I didn't -- his character was not nearly as intense, motivating, or real as Daniel Day Lewis's. I really haven't seen too many of Di Caprio's films (and haven't seen Titanic), but I saw Catch Me If You Can the same day, and I'm just not generally impressed by Leo's acting. He doesn't bring as much to his roles as the actors I consistently like.

kerely
 
Jan 11, 2003 at 7:01 PM Post #20 of 23
I just read the critic of this film in the Financial Times two days ago (a transatlantic flight is quite long
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), a real execution :

Cinema: Oversized, overstaged and over here
By Nigel Andrews
Published: January 8 2003 19:49 | Last Updated: January 8 2003 19:49


GANGS OF NEW YORK (18)
Martin Scorsese


Sometimes "long-awaited" can seem less a buzz-word than a curse-word, or at least an epithet of ill omen. Just how long is long? When your film Gangs of New York is incarcerated for a year on Miramax Island, that infamous holding jail for movies awaiting release into Manhattan and the world, is there something wrong with it, or you, or the detainers? "You" are the director Martin Scorsese, American cinema's Visionary Laureate, so surely the fault is not yours. The detainers are the Miramax- running Weinsteins, led by the notorious Hands-On Harvey, a man who demands participation in every decision taken in or near his fiefdom.

My suspicion is that most of the characters in this nearly three-hour fresco of 1840s gang warfare in pre-skyscraper New York, a film that comes on like a fancy-dress West Side Story or Les Mis with attitude, are based on US film-industry personnel. How else explain why this film was made? How else explain why it was so weirdly delayed? If it is a poison-pen pantomime or an antic drame a` clef, it would at least clarify why Leonardo DiCaprio, Daniel Day-Lewis and Cameron Diaz prance around in costumes amid overbearing Cinecittá sets for what seems an eternity, trying to pretend there is enough plot for 65 minutes, let alone 165.

Scorsese's source is Herbert Asbury's 1928 book about the brutal urban battles between Irish newcomers and self-styled Natives in the years leading to the US civil war. For antagonists such as Bill the Butcher (Day-Lewis with stovepipe hat, black handlebars and prototype Noo Yawk accent) and Amsterdam Vallon (a fuller-faced-and- muscled Di Caprio), out to avenge his dad's first-scene murder, the larger north-south conflict is a little non-local difficulty interfering with their insular Armageddon. By the film's close New York is a smoking, scalding meld of gang war, draft protest and general hullabaloo, complete with ships firing grapeshot into the very heart of designer Dante Ferretti's vast, stylish, but also stubbornly stagy backlot set.

For the director of Raging Bull and Goodfellas this must have seemed a dream project. No one is better at showing how and why people beat each other's brains out, from the apparent casus belli to the deepest, most metaphysical ones. Here he could enlarge and historicise that theme, putting modern-dress thrills aside to become a Big Apple Dickens or Hugo.

But what happens? The fustianism suffocates him. Where Scorsese's modern characters are compellingly believable - walking, ticking psychodramas waiting for their alarms to go off (or their bombs) - the dramatis personae here are jerry-built and generic. Day-Lewis plays his stage villain with more panache than the role deserves. But DiCaprio's avenging giant-killer is a hole in the screen: the character never fills his assigned and scripted space. And Cameron Diaz flounces around with carpet-dye hair and do-it-yourself accent as - yes! - a tart with a heart.

The moment of world-beating bathos comes when Day-Lewis has DiCaprio in his power, with dagger and cleaver ready to whoosh down on the hero's skull. Guess what - he spares him. Why? Because there still is an hour to go. "Dying would be too good for you, Mr Bond." It is on that level, like pretty much the whole film.

I usually like to set aside a short paragraph at the end of a bad review to list redeeming merits. But in Gangs of New York there are none. It is just a disaster: oversized, overstaged and now over here. The sole comfort is that only a great artist can make such a consummate, gargantuan, hash of an ambitious project. It takes a kind of grandeur, a recklessness of vision and commitment, to which the mediocre can never aspire.
 
Jan 11, 2003 at 9:35 PM Post #21 of 23
i watched it last night and i didn't think it was that great. both cameron diaz and leo did not really fit well in the picture, to me. daniel day lewis was incredible though, he really brought that character to almost superman status in the movie. the scenes and sets looked really really great though, but that just screams at me "overbudgeted" more than good direction. although, i did find the direction and cinematography to be pretty good overall. i thought it held some really great camera angles and cut sequences.

about the idea of the movie showing other angles of history, i still feel without a doubt that it is impossible for anybody to learn anything from television. read a book if you want to increase knowledge.

although off-topic, i just watched the two towers again and man.. what an amazing film. die orcs die! i didn't see black hawk down because generally, war movies are utter trash. and don't even get me started on bruckheimer..
 
Jan 12, 2003 at 2:40 AM Post #22 of 23
I rented Black Hawk Down to check out after Tuberoller mentioned that it was pretty accurate. Man I couldn't help cringing at some of the scenes I saw.
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