Fostex TH1100RP open and TH1000RP closed premium planar headphones

Jul 14, 2024 at 6:59 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 159

Kabeer

Vintage Ortho Ninja 🥷
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Some interesting news. It seems Fostex are releasing new 'Premium' Planar magnetic headphones soon.
It seems the drivers are also different, "much larger than the conventional RP driver used in T50RPmk3/mk4" and all the prior rectangular RP drivers.

1720954715798.png
1720954721736.png


Pre-order prices can already be seen here:
https://hificonnect.com/product/fostex-th1100-rp-open/
https://hificonnect.com/product/fostex-th1000-rp-closed/
seems to be $2700 and $2500 respectively.


TH1000rp/TH1000rp Drivers
1720954496087.png


vs the T50rpMK4 (https://x.com/FOSTEX_INFO/status/1805897087764042163):
1720954527724.png
1720954534973.png


 
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Jul 14, 2024 at 7:01 AM Post #2 of 159
Specs from the preorder website:

  • Premium RP planar magnetic driver
  • Hard maple solid wood housing finished with "Aizome”
  • Newly adopted lightweight magnesium alloy mechanical parts
  • Newly shaped ear pads with new materials
  • Flexible fitting head pad and headband
  • 7N grade cable for internal wiring
  • Includes high-purity OFC unbalanced cable

Premium RP planar magnetic driver​

The RP technology planar diaphragm driver technology, developed in 1974 and continually refined ever since, has a newly developed planar diaphragm, much larger than the conventional RP driver used in T50RPmk3/mk4. In addition to increasing the number of magnets that sandwich the diaphragm, as well as a newly designed pattern and shape for the printed coil, the magnetic circuit components have been redesigned to optimize the magnetic flux distribution. All of these work together to suppress unwanted resonance in the diaphragm. This simultaneously achieves high sensitivity, smooth frequency response, and excellent transient characteristics, enabling accurate and delicate reproduction from heavy bass to high frequencies, and the ability to express a clear sound image in space with a clear sense of localization

Hard maple solid wood housing finished with “Aizome,” a traditional Japanese dyeing method​

The solid hard maple wood housing, known as a material for guitars, is dyed with Awa Aizome from Tokushima, which has long been valued for its high-quality dyeing. The wood is carefully dyed one by one by skilled craftsperson, resulting in a deep indigo color that beautifully reveals the unique grain of the hard maple wood. Dyeing with Aizome, made exclusively from the indigo plant, allows the hard maple’s density and specific gravity to take advantage of its properties that do not add unnecessary color to the sound, allowing the player to user a firm, deep bass range and clear, extended treble range. The open-type TH1100RP reproduces a natural sound field with a high resolution and a low listening fatigue, which is appropriate for the premium open-type RP, using double aluminum etched parts in the housing aperture and careful fine-tuning of the aperture ratio and each internal part.



About dyeing with Awa Aizome​

Genuine indigo, the dye used in Aizome, is a natural dye with a long history in Japan and was even used in ukiyoe prints of the Edo period. Among indigo dyes, Tokushima’s Awa Aizome has long been known throughout Japan as an indispensable dye for high-end dyed goods because of its rich and luxurious appearance. The TH1000RP and TH1100RP housings are dyed with Aizome made exclusively from natural tade indigo, which does not damage wood, and are repeatedly applied by hand and over a period of days, with a period to cure in between. During this process, changes in temperature and humidity affect the drying of the dye, and the conditions under which the fine color particles penetrate the wood structure vary depending on the grain of each housing. The result is a one-of-a-kind housing with a deep blue hue unique to indigo, while the smooth grain of the maple wood beautifully emerges, and the texture of each housing is completely different, even from left to right.

Genuine indigo used to dye the housing is also used as part of the blue in Hokusai Katsushika’s ” Thirty-six Views of Mount Fuji “



Newly adopted lightweight magnesium alloy mechanical parts​

A refreshed design using Magnesium alloy for mechanical parts, such as the housing base plate and hanger, help reduce overall weight by 20% compared to aluminum. Rubber packing is used for the rotation mechanism to eliminate excess vibration as much as possible. The design concept of taking every detail of each part into consideration has further improved the wearing comfort.

Newly shaped ear pads with new materials​

The newly shaped ear pads, which are asymmetrical to optimize the wearing comfort, are made of low-resilience cushions and silk protein synthetic leather that is three times more durable than conventional ear pads, ensuring a comfortable fit even over long periods of listening.

Flexible fitting head pad and headband​

The head pad and headband are made of natural sheepskin material, providing a supple and comfortable fit.



7N grade cable for internal wiring and highly reliable detachable connector port​

The removable connector on the headphone body, as well as the detachable connector terminal, are both rhodium-plated terminals. Balanced connection is also supported with the optional XLR terminal cable (ET-H3.0N7BL), and a 4.4 mm balanced cable (ET-TH4.4BL) is also planned for release.

Includes high-purity OFC unbalanced cable​

Includes 7N (99.999999%) grade high-purity OFC (Oxygen Free Copper) unbalanced cable, which eliminates impurities to the utmost limit to enhance transmission performance.

 
Jul 14, 2024 at 7:25 AM Post #3 of 159
The single most requested... thing, from Fostex, has been a "high-end" planar-magnetic design on the level of their previous designs from the 1970s and 1980s.

So they.... mindlessly upscaled the incredibly flawed T50RP driver.

They don't even list the dimensions of the driver in the specifications.

And it's $2500US.
 
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Jul 14, 2024 at 8:01 AM Post #4 of 159
The single most requested... thing, from Fostex, has been a "high-end" planar-magnetic design on the level of their previous designs from the 1970s and 1980s.

So they.... mindlessly upscaled the incredibly flawed T50RP driver.

They don't even list the dimensions of the driver in the specifications.

And it's $2500US.

Mindlessly? I doubt that. However the scale of how they increased the size would be very nice. Its a completely new driver with definitely thought put into it as they understood just upscaling it would cause major weight issues. Using different materials and geometry helps which they did.

I for one, am very interested in listening to this. Lets not all jump to conclusions for now as nobody knows what this will be like.
 
Jul 14, 2024 at 11:12 AM Post #5 of 159
Mindlessly? I doubt that. However the scale of how they increased the size would be very nice. Its a completely new driver with definitely thought put into it as they understood just upscaling it would cause major weight issues. Using different materials and geometry helps which they did.

I for one, am very interested in listening to this. Lets not all jump to conclusions for now as nobody knows what this will be like.
Square membranes with sharp corners -- such as the T50RP design -- suffer modal breakup at listening levels. A simple material change will not eliminate this issue. In fact, with the edges of the membrane further away it's center, this breakup will become worse.

The T50RP membrane is a traditional flex circuit with much higher thickness than the membranes used for the T50 and T30, which were about 6 microns. The T50RP is more around the 12 to 25 micron range, which (coupled with it's small size) gave it enough rigidity and stability to function, somewhat. Unless they made the diaphragm thicker
-- something they really don't want to be doing if they're trying to make a better driver -- the distortion characteristics of this driver will be as bad, or worse, than the T50RP.

The T50RP driver was made specifically to be inexpensive to produce, and to be reasonably sensitive. It was a panic measure towards the end of the 1980s to recoup costs, since general consumer headphones had started moving towards featherlight and super sensitive designs, and their previous lineup had sold poorly. They pivoted to try and appeal to recording studios, who need something cheap and durable with reasonably fast transients -- and nothing else. It was never designed with performance as top priority, and every detail of it's design indicates either someone who has no idea what the rules for designing an isodynamic are, or someone who does not/cannot afford to care.

It makes absolutely zero sense to base the driver for a $2500 headphone off of the T50RP. This is <Foster>. They have the single highest market share in this industry, there is <no> excuse for this. Every single design decision they have made here screams "bare minimum", with extreme emphasis on cost-cutting -- AKA, exactly the opposite of what the ortho community wanted to see.

They may in fact be able to make this headphone sound passable, but the idea that it may actually match the designs it's trying to pay tribute to is absolutely laughable, and the price will have to come down significantly before I will even bother listening to this.

First Yamaha, now Fostex.

What a shame.
 
Jul 14, 2024 at 11:22 AM Post #6 of 159
First Yamaha, now Fostex.
I was just typing something to that notion but you posted first. Anyways, there is demand apparently (see Yamaha) so Fostex is supplying. Much of the parts are already used by some of their other products. Yamaha at least can claim a unique style and design. I bet the Fostex sounds preferable to the Yam though.

edit to be clear: agreed, it is a disappointment
 
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Jul 14, 2024 at 11:32 AM Post #7 of 159
Square membranes with sharp corners -- such as the T50RP design -- suffer modal breakup at listening levels. A simple material change will not eliminate this issue. In fact, with the edges of the membrane further away it's center, this breakup will become worse.

The T50RP membrane is a traditional flex circuit with much higher thickness than the membranes used for the T50 and T30, which were about 6 microns. The T50RP is more around the 12 to 25 micron range, which (coupled with it's small size) gave it enough rigidity and stability to function, somewhat. Unless they made the diaphragm thicker
-- something they really don't want to be doing if they're trying to make a better driver -- the distortion characteristics of this driver will be as bad, or worse, than the T50RP.

The T50RP driver was made specifically to be inexpensive to produce, and to be reasonably sensitive. It was a panic measure towards the end of the 1980s to recoup costs, since general consumer headphones had started moving towards featherlight and super sensitive designs, and their previous lineup had sold poorly. They pivoted to try and appeal to recording studios, who need something cheap and durable with reasonably fast transients -- and nothing else. It was never designed with performance as top priority, and every detail of it's design indicates either someone who has no idea what the rules for designing an isodynamic are, or someone who does not/cannot afford to care.

It makes absolutely zero sense to base the driver for a $2500 headphone off of the T50RP. This is <Foster>. They have the single highest market share in this industry, there is <no> excuse for this. Every single design decision they have made here screams "bare minimum", with extreme emphasis on cost-cutting -- AKA, exactly the opposite of what the ortho community wanted to see.

They may in fact be able to make this headphone sound passable, but the idea that it may actually match the designs it's trying to pay tribute to is absolutely laughable, and the price will have to come down significantly before I will even bother listening to this.

First Yamaha, now Fostex.

What a shame.
No one has heard it, lets wait for ears to give it a go :L3000:

Maybe you are right, but maybe wrong!
 
Jul 14, 2024 at 11:43 AM Post #8 of 159
Assume the screws + magnets used are the same size for this hypothetical scale reference, then you can estimate increased dimension of TH1000RP driver.

Using magnets as markers, then Ill say TH1000RP driver is (11/7) the size of T50RPmk4 driver.
 

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Jul 14, 2024 at 11:58 AM Post #9 of 159
Really love the looks of the TH1000RP, now let's wait and see if they'll sound good enough for me to consider them!

My only gripe is the use of synthetic leather, at this price point it's not something I like to see... :/
 
Jul 14, 2024 at 12:15 PM Post #10 of 159
Assume the screws + magnets used are the same size for this hypothetical scale reference, then you can estimate increased dimension of TH1000RP driver.




Using magnets as markers, then Ill say TH1000RP driver is (11/7) the size of T50RPmk4 driver.
I tried to scale them with the assumption the magnets are spaced similarly...as if not then the drivers actually look like a very similar size...
1720973553065.png


Btw, RE the Yamaha comments, I quite liked the Yamaha even with its acoustic flaws, i think they were just a few physical dimension decisions away from something amazing. And they re-engineered everything again from scratch, including a really great housing.

Looking forward to more ranges from both these companies.
 
Jul 14, 2024 at 12:33 PM Post #11 of 159
I tried to scale them with the assumption the magnets are spaced similarly...as if not then the drivers actually look like a very similar size...
Agreed(11/7). TH1000RP appears to use Foster’s standard size TH-line baffles, cups, headband, etc., so considering those space constraints... See TH500RP:
IMG_3917.jpeg

link

Btw, RE the Yamaha comments, I quite liked the Yamaha even with its acoustic flaws, i think they were just a few physical dimension decisions away from something amazing. And they re-engineered everything again from scratch, including a really great housing.
I see. Thanks for the insight. I wonder how the YH5000SE compares to FA D8000 line of Yam-inspired orthos.
 
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Jul 14, 2024 at 5:05 PM Post #12 of 159
Man I really like both the look of TH1000RP and TH1100RP. And the indigo blue is a nice touch too.

But I already thought TH909 is overpriced, this is just even more so.

It really start to feel like companies price things this high because they know people will still buy it, not because it really need to cost that much.

As a Fostex fan I feel like I want to try it, but I really don't want to pay this much for it.
 
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Jul 14, 2024 at 8:51 PM Post #13 of 159
The single most requested... thing, from Fostex, has been a "high-end" planar-magnetic design on the level of their previous designs from the 1970s and 1980s.

So they.... mindlessly upscaled the incredibly flawed T50RP driver.

They don't even list the dimensions of the driver in the specifications.

And it's $2500US.
And on top, still using that awful connector for the cables it seems. 🙃
 
Jul 15, 2024 at 4:17 AM Post #14 of 159
Nice to see Fostex doing something new

I cannot help but wonder if Lawton will also be licking their lips and trying to tune these bad boys

Surely those morbidly obese wooden bobs will fit this new creation

The price seems high for what it is but the excitement of something new from Fostex is always nice
 
Jul 15, 2024 at 12:25 PM Post #15 of 159
A bit sad that Fostex are abandoning Biodyna's for their TOTL to be honest. The TH treatment hasn't been flattering to the RP drivers in the past (see TH500) but Fostex certainly have the chops to do something amazing on the planar side. Initial reports on the T50 Mk4 are quite positive which bodes well here.

Love the look of the new suspension headband, hopefully the hinge weak point is eliminated in the new design! Also Indigo Indigo Indigo <3

That said:

-TH1000 better bring some serious, extended bass to the table to succeed the TH900 :)
-The driver better match the amazing low distortion performance exhibited by their existing 1.5T Biodynas!
-Price wise, it's important to note that after the past few years of inflation a 909 goes for ~$2K MSRP already... in the end maybe not sobad in the land of $5k flagships (*cough* Yamaha)

I tried to scale them with the assumption the magnets are spaced similarly...as if not then the drivers actually look like a very similar size...
1720973553065.png

Btw, RE the Yamaha comments, I quite liked the Yamaha even with its acoustic flaws, i think they were just a few physical dimension decisions away from something amazing. And they re-engineered everything again from scratch, including a really great housing.

Looking forward to more ranges from both these companies.

I think this looks right, at about 1/3 increase in effective area on the diaphragm. There's a good shot of the T50 MK4 head on from the packaging:

1721060116449.png

(image credit: @Philimon https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fostex-t50rpmk4-rp.972600/post-18189088)

If you assume the same trace width you get the same increase (+1/3, 12 turns vs 8) from the rendering you posted:

1721060250131.png


It looks like they've gotten themselves some extra room to spread out by shifting the feeding point off the diaphragm onto a daughter card:

1721060356855.png

Compared to the T50 where it shares the baffle...

I guess they worried the Dynamic prototype might be a bit bulky? :p

1721060540851.png
 

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