[pataburd]

Am using a HeadphoneLounge 4x 24 AWG UPOCC pure silver cable [balanced] with excellent results.

 

[pataburd]

Started listening to the Utopia with the Beezar T4. I have never heard the Utopia sound so smooth and laid back[!]. Everything is more liquid, smooth, and with a rounder, denser tonality when using the T4 [with JJ ECC81 tubes].

The 3F resolves more detail, is more open, transparent, neutral and airy sounding with solid dynamic punch and remarkable speed. For my listening preferences, the ecp DSHA-3F better exploits the Utopia's strengths. With the 3F, I feel as if I am listening to the Utopia laid musically bare. With the T4, I feel as if I am listening to the Utopia as rendered--one might even say "colored"--by the T4.

My [decided] preference for the 3F extends to my hearing of the ATH-ADX5000 and HEDDphones, as well. Comparatively, the ADX5000 [high Z] sound a bit constrained and the HEDD [low Z] a bit hard with the T4.

While I can completely understand why some Utopia owners might prefer the T4 to the 3F, I am not one of them, at least not at this point in time. Subsequently, I plan to re-tube with some GE NOS 5965 and audition the T4 some more. However, to my ears, and in my mind, the T4 cannot do enough, viz-a-viz the 3F, to alter these first impressions.

As always, with different upstream gear [and a different pair of ears] "your mileage may [very] vary".

 

[GreenBow]

Recently upgraded the USB data source of my Sony TA-ZH1ES from an iPhone as a Roon endpoint to a Sonore microRendu with their basic linear power supply, also as a Roon endpoint. The Utopia on the Sony now sound amazing, very detailed, but with less glare than when I was using iPhone as the Roon endpoint.

I think using a phone causes RFI that causes some brightness, and using 'airplane mode' helps with that. I could be totally wrong.

However I use a DAP often as a source for Hugo 2. Even from that, in the end I ended up with a noise reduction Audioquest Jitterbug. At first when I tried the jitterbug, I was pre-convinced it would not do anything. I tired it a few times and could hear no change.

Eventually I deduced something though. It was that the IEMS I was using when I put in the mid-high boost in, sounded better with Jitterbug. Putting in those filters, without Jitterbug between DAP and DAC, sounded just a fraction bass light. I was forever going between reference filters, and mid-high filters. I put the Jitterbug on after being open minded and eventually though it was adding lower frequency solidity. The result was that I can leave the mid-high filters in my IEMs, with the Jitterbug on. Not without.

 

[Hoegaardener70]

I think using a phone causes RFI that causes some brightness, and using 'airplane mode' helps with that. I could be totally wrong.

I use my iphone to feed the Hugo2, and I think you are 100% right. It is not airplane mode per se but the Bluetooth module which needs to be switched off to do the magic.

 

[mitchb]

Just got my Utopia phones. Nice straight out of the box.New sounding but nicer than I expected.

 

[pataburd]

Congratulations!
In my humble experience, the Utopia just keep getting better from this point forward.

 

[Liu Junyuan]

Congratulations!
In my humble experience, the Utopia just keep getting better from this point forward.

How are you enjoying the HiFiMAN's in comparison with Utopia? Do they pair well with the 3F as well?

 

[pataburd]

Remarkable transparency, fine granular detail retrieval and clean flat bass were the HEKse's high points for me.

The HE-1000se sounded their best with the 3F, but I ended up selling them because of what I thought was their unnatural rendering of the upper treble frequencies. I compared cymbal strikes between the HEKse, Utopia, ADX5000 and HEDDphone. To my ears, the HifiMAN sounded the least convincing [the ADX5000 sounded the most convincing].

Upper treble was the deal-breaker for me with the [original] HE-6, too, notwithstanding how much I was enamored of--and heavily invested in--them at the time.

 

[LCMusicLover]

How are you enjoying the HiFiMAN's in comparison with Utopia? Do they pair well with the 3F as well?

Remarkable transparency, fine granular detail retrieval and clean flat bass were the HEKse's high points for me.

The HE-1000se sounded their best with the 3F, but I ended up selling them because of what I thought was their unnatural rendering of the upper treble frequencies. I compared cymbal strikes between the HEKse, Utopia, ADX5000 and HEDDphone. To my ears, the HifiMAN sounded the least convincing [the ADX5000 sounded the most convincing].

Upper treble was the deal-breaker for me with the [original] HE-6, too, notwithstanding how much I was enamored of--and heavily invested in--them at the time.

Mostly agree. Especially HEKse/3F pairing. To me, HEKse vs Utopia is a tough call. Things I like about both. Personally, to my ear, on my equipment...ok, enough throat-clearing...I would disagree regarding cymbal strikes on Utopia vs HEKse. I find the Utopia being a bit too emphasized in that frequency region. Very fast, which can make a cymbal strike 'crisper', but (again, to my ears) the 'tizz' can overwhelm the tone.

I note that @pataburd uses the Amorphous core transformers in his 3F -- I have both. There's not a huge difference, but I prefer the Nickel core transformers with both HEKse & Utopia, although the preference is stronger for the 3F/Utopia pairing. I doubt the difference is enough to change @pataburd 's opinion. For sure, if you like the open/airy HEKse stage, the Amorphous core transformers help that aspect the most. Also help the Utopia stage, but the Nickel transformers help other aspects of Utopia at least as much.

Setting cymbals aside for a moment, I really appreciate the fuller sound of the HEKse (compared to HEKv2) which, to me, makes them very competitive with Utopia. I would call them 'side grades' but also pretty close cousins as both are pretty neutral in tonality and both are quite detailed.

Note that I've never heard ADX5000, so express no opinion there.

 

[Liu Junyuan]

Remarkable transparency, fine granular detail retrieval and clean flat bass were the HEKse's high points for me.

The HE-1000se sounded their best with the 3F, but I ended up selling them because of what I thought was their unnatural rendering of the upper treble frequencies. I compared cymbal strikes between the HEKse, Utopia, ADX5000 and HEDDphone. To my ears, the HifiMAN sounded the least convincing [the ADX5000 sounded the most convincing].

Upper treble was the deal-breaker for me with the [original] HE-6, too, notwithstanding how much I was enamored of--and heavily invested in--them at the time.

Thank you. And with your music preferences, if I understand them correctly, tonal verisimilitude in the treble frequencies is particularly important. It sounds like your point here is that the rendering of treble in HiFiMAN transducers does not accord with your taste and that you perceive continuity across their lineup and over time, from the former flagship of the HE-6 to the most recent iteration of the HEK--despite their other competitive strengths over other flagships. I wonder if the Susvara's presentation of treble would constitute an exception. I would also like the opportunity to hear an ADX5000: big plus that it seems to work well out of the 3F.

Mostly agree. Especially HEKse/3F pairing. To me, HEKse vs Utopia is a tough call. Things I like about both. Personally, to my ear, on my equipment...ok, enough throat-clearing...I would disagree regarding cymbal strikes on Utopia vs HEKse. I find the Utopia being a bit too emphasized in that frequency region. Very fast, which can make a cymbal strike 'crisper', but (again, to my ears) the 'tizz' can overwhelm the tone.

I note that @pataburd uses the Amorphous core transformers in his 3F -- I have both. There's not a huge difference, but I prefer the Nickel core transformers with both HEKse & Utopia, although the preference is stronger for the 3F/Utopia pairing. I doubt the difference is enough to change @pataburd 's opinion. For sure, if you like the open/airy HEKse stage, the Amorphous core transformers help that aspect the most. Also help the Utopia stage, but the Nickel transformers help other aspects of Utopia at least as much.

Setting cymbals aside for a moment, I really appreciate the fuller sound of the HEKse (compared to HEKv2) which, to me, makes them very competitive with Utopia. I would call them 'side grades' but also pretty close cousins as both are pretty neutral in tonality and both are quite detailed.

Note that I've never heard ADX5000, so express no opinion there.

Yeah, it sounds like the mu transformers would be more synergestic, but I believe @pataburd listens to music that requires the greater speed and air communicated through the amorphous transformers. It's hard to say without me hearing the former yet (still patiently awaiting my set from Doug).

I can see where the Utopia's crisp and speedy rendering of cymbals and other like sounds in that frequency lend preference to the mu transformers.
There is also the question of whether the 3F, regardless of transformer, is an ideal amp to pair with the HEKse in the first place. If it is the case you find 3F pairs better with the Utopia (as it should), what amp pairs better with the HEKse than the Utopia? How does the Liquid Platinum fare, and are you using warmer tubes with that?

Thank you both for your very helpful comparisons.

 

[pataburd]

All of the headphones at my disposal: Utopia, HE-1000se [when I had them], HEDDphone, Mikros 90 and even the [420 ohm] ADX5000 sound their best for me with the DSHA-3F. For my listening tastes, the T4--as good as it is--is not in the same league as the 3F. The 3F seems to capitalize on the inherent strengths of each one of those cans listed, even though it was optimized for the Focal.

A pair of Susvara look mighty tantalizing, although I think I am a "dyed-in-the-wool" dynamic driver type of listener. Planars have an overall dryness to their presentation that just doesn't "grab" me.

 

[LCMusicLover]

...If it is the case you find 3F pairs better with the Utopia (as it should), what amp pairs better with the HEKse than the Utopia? How does the Liquid Platinum fare, and are you using warmer tubes with that?...

All of the headphones at my disposal: Utopia, HE-1000se [when I had them], HEDDphone, Mikros 90 and even the [420 ohm] ADX5000 sound their best for me with the DSHA-3F...

What @pataburd said

(with the possible exception of Auteur which sound interestingly different without sound 'worse' from other chains)

It's really only about whether the difference is minimal, or maximal??? (is that the right word?)

The whole 'which cans with which tubes in the LP' would be a lengthy OT for this thread. But that's really about whether the 3F beats the LP pairing by a nose or by 3 lengths (to use a horse-racing analogy).

 

[PaulMiami]

I use my iphone to feed the Hugo2, and I think you are 100% right. It is not airplane mode per se but the Bluetooth module which needs to be switched off to do the magic.

If you want the iPhone to be a Roon access point, WiFi must be on. The iPhone via an Apple USB camera adapter is a pretty decent Roon access point with the Sony and can pass through even the highest sampling rates to the Sony bit perfect. That said, the microRendu Roon access points takes the Sony/Utopia combo to a different level. Both signals are bit perfect so this is all about noise leaking into the DAC.

 

[Hoegaardener70]

If you want the iPhone to be a Roon access point, WiFi must be on. The iPhone via an Apple USB camera adapter is a pretty decent Roon access point with the Sony and can pass through even the highest sampling rates to the Sony bit perfect. That said, the microRendu Roon access points takes the Sony/Utopia combo to a different level. Both signals are bit perfect so this is all about noise leaking into the DAC.

I was specifically talking about Bluetooth. It is possible to turn the reception and Bluetooth off while the wifi is on. I find this way in signal purity equial to much more expensive setups. M2C

 

[Articnoise]

Remarkable transparency, fine granular detail retrieval and clean flat bass were the HEKse's high points for me.

The HE-1000se sounded their best with the 3F, but I ended up selling them because of what I thought was their unnatural rendering of the upper treble frequencies. I compared cymbal strikes between the HEKse, Utopia, ADX5000 and HEDDphone. To my ears, the HifiMAN sounded the least convincing [the ADX5000 sounded the most convincing].

Upper treble was the deal-breaker for me with the [original] HE-6, too, notwithstanding how much I was enamored of--and heavily invested in--them at the time.

In my experience it’s not only the amp that is of importance. A good source and DAC is equally needed to get a smooth and natural sound. This is particularly apparent in the upper mids and treble. The better the digital gear is, the more natural can some revealing headphones and speakers sound.