[Roasty]

That would be great as i have had the s2 and have the silver draug with other headphones

how long was the wait for the s3?

It took approx 2 months from payment to cable getting delivered.

 

[Progisus]

What about detail and clarity of dragon v lazuli

I've been using Silver Dragon's with the Utopia for a while now. Compared to the stock cable they smooth out the upper range and provide a bit more kick to the bass. It is also a lot lighter and the stiffness really is not an issue. An underrated and realistically priced upgrade imho. I also have a Custom Cans ultra low capacitance cable. It is very light and really makes the highs enjoyable by giving them a silky texture. I do feel it closes in the soundstage a bit though. I would use it more but I got it a bit short.

 

[iamoneagain]

So I don’t have a problem with the weight or the length of my cable. Think everything sounds great, what would be advantage of spending money for different cable? What exactly were people trying to solve?

Only time I played with cables was back in the day with the Sennheiser 650 and got a silver dragon. I thought headphones had a little veil so cables improved that. With the Utopia, I’m not sure what needs improvement? Specifically has anyone done cable change using Hugo 2?

 

[LCMusicLover]

What about detail and clarity of dragon v lazuli

I have both. I prefer Laz Ref -- I found the Silver Dragon very detailed with Utopia, but felt like it exacerbated the bit of sharpness/fatigue I got from Utopia. I'm not saying the Laz Ref lacked detail, but perhaps there was a little less.

However, all that is based on listening with my (former) SS amps in the chain -- V280 & BHA-1. I haven't tried the Silver Dragon since I got my Liquid Platinum & DSHA-3F. I'll give that a go tonight an post some impressions.

 

[gurus]

To be honest they're both detailed and clear. Between them, I still prefer the LR with the utopia. I think the LR give a more balanced presentation with Utopia.

I'm now trying out the utopia with a Norne Audio Silvergarde S3.. Will listen over the next few days and see what I think of them.

Any initial impressions with the Norne S3?

 

[LCMusicLover]

...What exactly were people trying to solve?...

I needed a 4-pin XLR balanced cable. After that, it was about finding a cable which 'softened' the sound a bit without changing tonality (very much) or costing (too much) detail.

 

[gurus]

Can't you do that by changing the 6922 tubes?
I have a cache of 6922 tubes somewhere. Wish I remembered what each one sounded like to see if that would have helped.

 

[LCMusicLover]

Can't you do that by changing the 6922 tubes?
I have a cache of 6922 tubes somewhere. Wish I remembered what each one sounded like to see if that would have helped.

Yes, definitely. I've made several changes to my chain to 'shape' Utopia sound. Siemens CCa tubes work great for me.

Actually, I have several different tubes (Amperex PQ, Semens E88CC and even Genelex Gold Lions) which help the LP to pair very well with Utopia, although the CCa are the best pairing. That said, the Laz Ref cable also nudges the sound in the 'right' direction for me.

All 'my ears, my chain...'

<edit>BTW, I got the Laz Ref cable before I got the Liquid Platinum</edit>

 

[Roasty]

Any initial impressions with the Norne S3?

My norne S3 have been well broken in over 200hr (ran it in with zmf VC). Using an ultra short adaptor with the Utopia.

Impressions of the cable with Utopia is it's the most flat sounding of my aftermarket cables (lavricable grand line, lazuli ref, silver dragon).

There isn't a range of freq which really stands out with the Norne S3, and some may find it a good thing. With the lavri there was some harshness and grain up top, with the silver dragons it felt like a mild V curve, with the lazuli it felt like a gentle downslope with small midbass/mid hump.

With the Norne it feels a bit like a flat line with a subtle dip in the higher freq. Smooth up top with the Utopias, which is good. There is no comparative lack of detail, but I think the silver dragon has more in terms of airiness and sparkle.

 

[gurus]

That bodes well and is more affordable. At my age I probably don't hear much of the higher frequencies anyway, so much would not be missed. It actually may turn out to be advantageous with the Utopia as I understand.

 

[muski]

I have the silver dragon and lazuli reference. Dragon is much lighter, but stiffer.

I find the dragon is a bit more airier and clear up top. Lazuli mids seem fuller and vocals are amazing with these cables. Bottom end are about the same, maybe just very slightly more thump with the dragon.

Can't really go wrong with either one but the lazuli is the pricier option. There are however other cable options like the PlusSound X8 or X16 which I find have some nice options eg silver, copper, silver plus gold etc etc

Very accurate assessment. I have a Lazuli Reference with a 1/4” plug, and a shorter, lighter Black Dragon with a 3.5mm plug. I use the Lazuli with M Scaler + DAVE at my desk, and the Black Dragon with a Mojo/Poly for travel (or WiFi Roon around the house). They’re somewhat accidental pairings, but they each seem to bring out the best of each source.

 

[LCMusicLover]

...I'll give that a go tonight an post some impressions. (re: Lazuli Reference vs Silver Dragon)

Interesting exercise. Hard to summarize. On the Empyrean vs Ether 2 continuum, Utopia/Lazuli Reference (ULZ) leans Empyrean, while Utopia/Silver Dragon (USD) leans Ether 2. But both are very close to the center. Lose some detail/highs w/ ULZ, but gain mid and bass weight. USD leans opposite and is airier. Sorry if the Empy/E2 analogy is too obscure.

All that was from:
NUC ==> Singxer SU-1 ==> (Coax) A2 Gumby | (AES/EBU)Pontus ==> Hattor mini ==> DSHA 3F ==> Utopia

Spoiler: LP?

Didn’t try with LP, coulda fallen into a tube-rolling hole. Send a search party. Nope! Not doin’ it!

I started with the Pontus, and the difference was actually pretty stark. ULZ was much warmer and fuller. But there was significant reduction of the highs.

But it turns out the difference between the cables is of nearly the same magnitude as the differences between my two DACs. So I ended up with a much more complex answer. But in summary:

ULZ - Pontus: Least favorite. Best for Jethro Tull ‘Benefit’. Noticeable reduction of highs, high hats lost in guitar
USD - Pontus: Second best. Nearly as airy as USD/Gumby. Less detail.
ULZ - Gumby: Tied for best. Treble reduction less significant but still present. Full sound, feels like pushes more air.
USD - Gumby: Tied for best. Brighter, airier, more detailed. Also less weighty. Only combo to sound even a little ‘sharp’

Really the two cables are both great. That said, the whole chain clearly has something to say. And Utopia sure is a microscope. And a chameleon.

PM me if you want details about the ‘test tracks’ I compared.

BTW, I really should add a caveat to all this:

Doing this comparison is a serious PITA. Need duplicate chains.

Anybody want to lend me a spare Utopia and DSHA-3F?

Anyway, I don’t know if frustration drove me toward confirmation bias just so it wasn’t all a waste of time, or if rather, it fueled my natural petulant skepticism to reject what my ears were telling me. Or whether the loss of auditory recall over the 45 second switch-over masked other, possibly more significant differences. So take it with a pinch of salt.

BTW: On re-reading, I see that I did summarize, sorta

Should mention, all analog is balanced.

 

[thecrow]

My norne S3 have been well broken in over 200hr (ran it in with zmf VC). Using an ultra short adaptor with the Utopia.

Impressions of the cable with Utopia is it's the most flat sounding of my aftermarket cables (lavricable grand line, lazuli ref, silver dragon).

There isn't a range of freq which really stands out with the Norne S3, and some may find it a good thing. With the lavri there was some harshness and grain up top, with the silver dragons it felt like a mild V curve, with the lazuli it felt like a gentle downslope with small midbass/mid hump.

With the Norne it feels a bit like a flat line with a subtle dip in the higher freq. Smooth up top with the Utopias, which is good. There is no comparative lack of detail, but I think the silver dragon has more in terms of airiness and sparkle.

Interesting exercise. Hard to summarize. On the Empyrean vs Ether 2 continuum, Utopia/Lazuli Reference (ULZ) leans Empyrean, while Utopia/Silver Dragon (USD) leans Ether 2. But both are very close to the center. Lose some detail/highs w/ ULZ, but gain mid and bass weight. USD leans opposite and is airier. Sorry if the Empy/E2 analogy is too obscure.

All that was from:
NUC ==> Singxer SU-1 ==> (Coax) A2 Gumby | (AES/EBU)Pontus ==> Hattor mini ==> DSHA 3F ==> Utopia

Spoiler: LP?

Didn’t try with LP, coulda fallen into a tube-rolling hole. Send a search party. Nope! Not doin’ it!

I started with the Pontus, and the difference was actually pretty stark. ULZ was much warmer and fuller. But there was significant reduction of the highs.

But it turns out the difference between the cables is of nearly the same magnitude as the differences between my two DACs. So I ended up with a much more complex answer. But in summary:

ULZ - Pontus: Least favorite. Best for Jethro Tull ‘Benefit’. Noticeable reduction of highs, high hats lost in guitar
USD - Pontus: Second best. Nearly as airy as USD/Gumby. Less detail.
ULZ - Gumby: Tied for best. Treble reduction less significant but still present. Full sound, feels like pushes more air.
USD - Gumby: Tied for best. Brighter, airier, more detailed. Also less weighty. Only combo to sound even a little ‘sharp’

Really the two cables are both great. That said, the whole chain clearly has something to say. And Utopia sure is a microscope. And a chameleon.

PM me if you want details about the ‘test tracks’ I compared.

BTW, I really should add a caveat to all this:

Doing this comparison is a serious PITA. Need duplicate chains.

Anybody want to lend me a spare Utopia and DSHA-4?

Anyway, I don’t know if frustration drove me toward confirmation bias just so it wasn’t all a waste of time, or if rather, it fueled my natural petulant skepticism to reject what my ears were telling me. Or whether the loss of auditory recall over the 45 second switch-over masked other, possibly more significant differences. So take it with a pinch of salt.

BTW: On re-reading, I see that I did summarize, sorta

Should mention, all analog is balanced.

Thanks for all that info.

sounds like i should keep with the norne audio options (given the prices) but i’ll keep the lazuli in mind for weight and the silver dragon as another option if i’m looking for some tweaks or something to be delivered quicker.

 

[ubs28]

So I don’t have a problem with the weight or the length of my cable. Think everything sounds great, what would be advantage of spending money for different cable? What exactly were people trying to solve?

Only time I played with cables was back in the day with the Sennheiser 650 and got a silver dragon. I thought headphones had a little veil so cables improved that. With the Utopia, I’m not sure what needs improvement? Specifically has anyone done cable change using Hugo 2?

What I tried to solve was the long and heavy cable. I believe Focal has now changed the cable that comes with the Utopia.

As an added bonus:
- The treble is more smooth
- Opened up the sound stage
- More punch and clearer sound.
- Clearer and punchy bass.

So not a bad upgrade.

 

[Scrum92]

Which software do you all use to EQ, and how can you do that whilst preserving bit-perfect playback via ASIO or WASAPI?