[Febs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeeder /img/forum/go_quote.gif I recently went from my MP3 version of Porcupine Tree's Album In Absentia to Reripped in FLAC...the difference was very noticeable, and this was from a 224KBPS VBR LAME rip...I'd say if you have the hard drive space...go for it.

I see you're using Foobar. Have you tried ABXing the two files to see if you can tell the difference?

 

[Gatticus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cid /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is FALSE. As a few members have already proven. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=225975

Claiming they can hear a difference is a lot different from proving they can. Two days ago I ripped a song to variable bit rate mp3 and wave file. I can't hear a difference between the two, that doesn't prove there isn't one though but for me it is a waste of HDD space if I can't hear the difference.

 

[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by trains are bad /img/forum/go_quote.gif There is no audible difference between a well-encoded mp3 and flac. But flac takes no chances with sound quality and is desirable for archiving because it is lossless.

That is a FALSE statement!

It depends on the the complexity of the audio stream and the equipment you use to compare them. Many people have proven in ABX tests that they can pick out the lossless one from the lossy one.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aman /img/forum/go_quote.gif I haven't used M4A lossless much, but doesn't it possess a, by default, smaller compression ratio than FLAC?

In my experience Apple Lossless provide better compression rate than the default FLAC setting (-5).

 

[JES]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is a FALSE statement! It depends on the the complexity of the audio stream and the equipment you use to compare them. Many people have proven in ABX tests that they can pick out the lossless one from the lossy one. In my experience Apple Lossless provide better compression rate than the default FLAC setting (-5).

I use -7. I've never had an Apple device, so I can't compare to Apple Lossless.

 

[Febs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif Many people have proven in ABX tests that they can pick out the lossless one from the lossy one.

Well, it's true that some people have shown that they can do so. It's a small percentage of the population though. Most can't.

 

[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Febs /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, it's true that some people have shown that they can do so. It's a small percentage of the population though. Most can't.

Exactly!
So he can't state that there no audible difference between a well-encoded mp3 and flac. Cause there are, for some people.

 

[JES]

You people love this particular argument, don't you?

 

[Febs]

No. But I hate the myth that there are huge differences between lossless and lossy codecs that everyone should be able to hear.

 

[JES]

I'll admit that I find the difference minuscule in most cases. Perhaps it's the psychological aspect of FLAC files that enhances my listening pleasure.

 

[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JES /img/forum/go_quote.gif You people love this particular argument, don't you?

Yes, I do!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Febs /img/forum/go_quote.gif No. But I hate the myth that there are huge differences between lossless and lossy codecs that everyone should be able to hear.

There are huge differences between lossy and lossless codes.
Wether you can hear any audible differences depends on your ears, the audio stream you play and the audio equipment you play the stream on.
Most people can't hear a difference between a well encoded 192kbps lossy file and a lossless one.

But claiming that there are no audible difference between lossy and lossless files is totally wrong!

 

[Ikrit42]

I can't hear the difference between 192 kbps Mp3 and FLAC, but on other hand,
I CAN hear subtle differences between FLAC and 192kbps, DRM-ed WMA. (From Napster's subscription service)

I guess that's the "well-encoded lossy format" clause.

 

[Febs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, I do! There are huge differences between lossy and lossless codes. Wether you can hear any audible differences depends on your ears, the audio stream you play and the audio equipment you play the stream on. Most people can't hear a difference between a well encoded 192kbps lossy file and a lossless one. But claiming that there are no audible difference between lossy and lossless files is totally wrong!

I think that we agree completely on this point. I've never claimed that there is no audible difference between lossy and lossless files.

 

[Gatticus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is a FALSE statement! Many people have proven in ABX tests that they can pick out the lossless one from the lossy one.

And it's been proven using ABX testing that many people can not tell the difference between 192kb/s mp3 and lossless. If someone here claims they can tell the difference between 320kb/s and lossless then I am inclined to say they should cut back on the placebo drugs.

 

[Gatticus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Febs /img/forum/go_quote.gif No. But I hate the myth that there are huge differences between lossless and lossy codecs that everyone should be able to hear.

Exactly. I had to educate someone on the facts just two days ago at another forum because he refused to buy an mp3 player because he claimed mp3's are garbage compared to lossless. I don't care for mp3's at 128kb/s and lower because on those I can sometimes hear a difference but anything 192kb/s and above is good and near cd quality, near enough that most can not tell the difference between the mp3 and original cd.

 

[Cid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gatticus /img/forum/go_quote.gif And it's been proven using ABX testing that many people can not tell the difference between 192kb/s mp3 and lossless. If someone here claims they can tell the difference between 320kb/s and lossless then I am inclined to say they should cut back on the placebo drugs.

No, really. Dude, foobars ABX test isn't something you can guess and it's not something placebo could cause either. I posted in another thread about my ABX test with 320kb/s MP3 and lossless. Of course I passed and it was a 0.0% chance that I guessed. You really think placebo could cause that?

Just maybe it's you who should cut down on the drugs. Or.. maybe you're upset that you can't tell the difference?