[Chris Kaoss]

Do we know if Fiio will be releasing a successor to the BTR5? BTR5K? I've got a Qudelix 5K that I like, but it's sharp edges are kinda bothering me (small gripe, I know). I'm also a bit of a Fiio fanboy and love my FH3.

The only thing for me is

Battery endurance, especially on Ldac

 

[SomeGuyDude]

The EQ and range thing I definitely am on board with, but y'all should hit the gym more often if you think this things heavy lol. If anything, one reason I like it a ton more than my ES100 is that it doesn't feel small and cheap.

 

[megabigeye]

Things I would want changed on a new version:
- LDAC EQ
- lighter weight. It's not heavy like I have a hard time lifting it, it's heavy like I can't clip it to my shirt, which makes the microphone basically useless.
- glass is a "fancy" material, but it's really not appropriate here (or in other mobile applications other than screens). I want durability and light weight before I want a cheap impression of luxury.
- a clip that can actually hold the BTR5
- better Bluetooth range. I basically have to have my phone in the same pocket as the BTR5 in order to not get dropouts. Okay, that's a slight exaggeration, but not as much of one as it should be.
- better battery life
- easily Mac update-able firmware (honestly, this is the dumbest freaking thing in 2021)
- I hate balanced with the same blind rage that I hate Eric Clapton. Why not just make the single-ended output sound good and have decent power? I. Don't. Want. Extra. Cables.
- roll-off filters should actually make a difference. I could hear a clear difference on the ES100, but not on the BTR5. Either there's no difference between them or mine doesn't work properly. Either way, not good.
- the app is full of gimmicks that don't actually do anything (okay, I haven't actually looked at the app for a several months because it was so dopey)
- button layout that makes some sort of logical sense. I've had this thing for almost a year and I still hit the wrong volume button. I had a similar problem with the original X5-- I was hoping FiiO would have figured this out by now. Also, holding the "-" button to skip forward and "+" to skip back? THAT MAKES NO LOGICAL SENSE!

Things I would keep:
- sounds good
- looks good
- decent price

 

[jsmiller58]

Things I would want changed on a new version:
- LDAC EQ
- lighter weight. It's not heavy like I have a hard time lifting it, it's heavy like I can't clip it to my shirt, which makes the microphone basically useless.
- glass is a "fancy" material, but it's really not appropriate here (or in other mobile applications other than screens). I want durability and light weight before I want a cheap impression of luxury.
- a clip that can actually hold the BTR5
- better Bluetooth range. I basically have to have my phone in the same pocket as the BTR5 in order to not get dropouts. Okay, that's a slight exaggeration, but not as much of one as it should be.
- better battery life
- easily Mac update-able firmware (honestly, this is the dumbest freaking thing in 2021)
- I hate balanced with the same blind rage that I hate Eric Clapton. Why not just make the single-ended output sound good and have decent power? I. Don't. Want. Extra. Cables.
- roll-off filters should actually make a difference. I could hear a clear difference on the ES100, but not on the BTR5. Either there's no difference between them or mine doesn't work properly. Either way, not good.
- the app is full of gimmicks that don't actually do anything (okay, I haven't actually looked at the app for a several months because it was so dopey)
- button layout that makes some sort of logical sense. I've had this thing for almost a year and I still hit the wrong volume button. I had a similar problem with the original X5-- I was hoping FiiO would have figured this out by now. Also, holding the "-" button to skip forward and "+" to skip back? THAT MAKES NO LOGICAL SENSE!

Things I would keep:
- sounds good
- looks good
- decent price

Interesting list. Not much comment other than to say a few of your points might be targeted at a narrow audience... I for one have balanced cables on all of my IEMs. I like the premium feel of the glass. On the other hand, smaller size and lower weight, filters that make an audible difference, and real PEQ that works on LDAC would entice me to upgrade. Buttons... all I can say is, if you want hard to understand and remember, check out the Qudelix 5K...

 

[megabigeye]

Interesting list. Not much comment other than to say a few of your points might be targeted at a narrow audience... I for one have balanced cables on all of my IEMs. I like the premium feel of the glass. On the other hand, smaller size and lower weight, filters that make an audible difference, and real PEQ that works on LDAC would entice me to upgrade. Buttons... all I can say is, if you want hard to understand and remember, check out the Qudelix 5K...

Which of my points would be for a narrow audience?

Oh yeah, and I'll add one more:
- USB EQ

I honestly don't think I would even consider a next gen BTR5. These are all features that should and could have been included in this version. I feel miffed by FiiO.

 

[jsmiller58]

Which of my points would be for a narrow audience?

Oh yeah, and I'll add one more:
- USB EQ

I honestly don't think I would even consider a next gen BTR5. These are all features that should and could have been included in this version. I feel miffed by FiiO.

Sorry, maybe my post was not clear... specifically, at least where I am concerned, the no balanced comment... all of my IEMs all have balanced cables. I also appreciate the luxury feel of the glass.

On the other hand I was agreeing with your comments about smaller size and lower weight, the PEQ for LDAC, and filters that actually make a detectable difference.

I should add that the BTR5 buttons aren’t bad compared to the buttons on the Qudelix 5K...

 

[LoryWiv]

Things I would want changed on a new version:
- LDAC EQ
- lighter weight. It's not heavy like I have a hard time lifting it, it's heavy like I can't clip it to my shirt, which makes the microphone basically useless.
- glass is a "fancy" material, but it's really not appropriate here (or in other mobile applications other than screens). I want durability and light weight before I want a cheap impression of luxury.
- a clip that can actually hold the BTR5
- better Bluetooth range. I basically have to have my phone in the same pocket as the BTR5 in order to not get dropouts. Okay, that's a slight exaggeration, but not as much of one as it should be.
- better battery life
- easily Mac update-able firmware (honestly, this is the dumbest freaking thing in 2021)
- I hate balanced with the same blind rage that I hate Eric Clapton. Why not just make the single-ended output sound good and have decent power? I. Don't. Want. Extra. Cables.
- roll-off filters should actually make a difference. I could hear a clear difference on the ES100, but not on the BTR5. Either there's no difference between them or mine doesn't work properly. Either way, not good.
- the app is full of gimmicks that don't actually do anything (okay, I haven't actually looked at the app for a several months because it was so dopey)
- button layout that makes some sort of logical sense. I've had this thing for almost a year and I still hit the wrong volume button. I had a similar problem with the original X5-- I was hoping FiiO would have figured this out by now. Also, holding the "-" button to skip forward and "+" to skip back? THAT MAKES NO LOGICAL SENSE!

Things I would keep:
- sounds good
- looks good
- decent price

Trying to get over your hating on Mr. Clapton but your point about BT range is well-taken. Otherwise, I love this device overall, like the fit, finish, look and feel and do use it balanced for more power. I find the buttons I use routinely are reasonably intuitive. A key thing I really like is the ability change 2nd order harmonics in the app...I'm not an EQ fan but do think 2nd order harmonics are not 'gimmicky" but bring noticeably more musicality like tubes versus SS can. I recommend experimenting with it if you've not yet done so. Anyway, all respect to @megabigeye for laying this list out so well for others to respond to. A useful and interesting post, much appreciated.

 

[megabigeye]

Sorry, maybe my post was not clear... specifically, at least where I am concerned, the no balanced comment... all of my IEMs all have balanced cables. I also appreciate the luxury feel of the glass.

On the other hand I was agreeing with your comments about smaller size and lower weight, the PEQ for LDAC, and filters that actually make a detectable difference.

I should add that the BTR5 buttons aren’t bad compared to the buttons on the Qudelix 5K...

I had a feeling the glass and balanced were the things you were talking about.

I also like the feel of the glass, but it only gives the impression of being luxury, it doesn't actually make it a luxury device. For it to be real luxury it has to be a good product first, luxury second. I just don't think the BTR5 is a particularly good device, therefore it really can't be a luxury device. And if it can't be one, why is it pretending? There are plenty of materials out there that would be more appropriate, but nobody is creative enough to use them.

There's really no reason that balanced should sound better than single-ended. None. Single-ended can sound completely audibly transparent, which is technically the best a device can sound. That's the "wire with gain" people used to tout. Once transparency is achieved, there's no reason it can't be tuned any which way the designer wants.
I realize I'm probably in the minority on Head-Fi in not wanting to use balanced cables, but in the greater world I'm in the very vast majority. I can assure you that most of the Joe Sixpack non-audiophiles aren't dying to upgrade their earphones from 3.5mm single-ended to some standard that doesn't work with their other devices. FiiO seems content with only appealing (and pandering) to audiophiles, rather than making products that are more widely appealing.

And this reminds me, I'd also want to change:
- that mushy 3.5mm jack that just screams "afterthought"

Also, just because the 5K's buttons are worse than the BTR5's doesn't mean the BTR5's are suddenly good.

Trying to get over your hating on Mr. Clapton but your point about BT range is well-taken. Otherwise, I love this device overall, like the fit, finish, look and feel and do use it balanced for more power. I find the buttons I use routinely are reasonably intuitive. A key thing I really like is the ability change 2nd order harmonics in the app...I'm not an EQ fan but do think 2nd order harmonics are not 'gimmicky" but bring noticeably more musicality like tubes versus SS can. I recommend experimenting with it if you've not yet done so. Anyway, all respect to @megabigeye for laying this list out so well for others to respond to. A useful and interesting post, much appreciated.

I knew I'd irritate somebody with my comment about Clapton. Sorry! But, my God, I stand firm in my opinion!

Oh yeah, those harmonic distortion things. I forgot about those, but I have tried them more than once. They didn't make any appreciable difference no matter how I set them. I must've lumped them somewhere between "dopey app" and "gimmicky roll-off filters" in my mind.
Not to say that nobody hears a difference with them. But if that's the case, why can't I hear a difference? Is my BTR5 not functioning properly? Either way, it's something that should have been fixed. Why would a feature be included if it doesn't do anything, or how can a product be considered market ready if certain features work on only some devices?


I'm happy to have started an interesting conversation on here. On the one hand, I'm sorry if I've upset people's enjoyment of the BTR5, but on the other hand, I think people should be more demanding of the devices they buy and live with.
Also, I'm blaming all of this on FiiO, but the truth is that a lot (Most? All?) of audio companies are guilty of the same or different complaints. For one hot minute I was thinking about getting a Mojo... About the only thing I saw in the thread was people complaining; I don't remember seeing one positive comment on the few pages I looked at. My immediate thought was, "For that price?! No f%^&ing way."
But, like the volume buttons, just because other companies are as bad or worse doesn't automatically make FiiO good.

 

[jsmiller58]

I had a feeling the glass and balanced were the things you were talking about.

I also like the feel of the glass, but it only gives the impression of being luxury, it doesn't actually make it a luxury device. For it to be real luxury it has to be a good product first, luxury second. I just don't think the BTR5 is a particularly good device, therefore it really can't be a luxury device. And if it can't be one, why is it pretending? There are plenty of materials out there that would be more appropriate, but nobody is creative enough to use them.

There's really no reason that balanced should sound better than single-ended. None. Single-ended can sound completely audibly transparent, which is technically the best a device can sound. That's the "wire with gain" people used to tout. Once transparency is achieved, there's no reason it can't be tuned any which way the designer wants.
I realize I'm probably in the minority on Head-Fi in not wanting to use balanced cables, but in the greater world I'm in the very vast majority. I can assure you that most of the Joe Sixpack non-audiophiles aren't dying to upgrade their earphones from 3.5mm single-ended to some standard that doesn't work with their other devices. FiiO seems content with only appealing (and pandering) to audiophiles, rather than making products that are more widely appealing.

And this reminds me, I'd also want to change:
- that mushy 3.5mm jack that just screams "afterthought"

Also, just because the 5K's buttons are worse than the BTR5's doesn't mean the BTR5's are suddenly good.


I knew I'd irritate somebody with my comment about Clapton. Sorry! But, my God, I stand firm in my opinion!

Oh yeah, those harmonic distortion things. I forgot about those, but I have tried them more than once. They didn't make any appreciable difference no matter how I set them. I must've lumped them somewhere between "dopey app" and "gimmicky roll-off filters" in my mind.
Not to say that nobody hears a difference with them. But if that's the case, why can't I hear a difference? Is my BTR5 not functioning properly? Either way, it's something that should have been fixed. Why would a feature be included if it doesn't do anything, or how can a product be considered market ready if certain features work on only some devices?


I'm happy to have started an interesting conversation on here. On the one hand, I'm sorry if I've upset people's enjoyment of the BTR5, but on the other hand, I think people should be more demanding of the devices they buy and live with.
Also, I'm blaming all of this on FiiO, but the truth is that a lot (Most? All?) of audio companies are guilty of the same or different complaints. For one hot minute I was thinking about getting a Mojo... About the only thing I saw in the thread was people complaining; I don't remember seeing one positive comment on the few pages I looked at. My immediate thought was, "For that price?! No f%^&ing way."
But, like the volume buttons, just because other companies are as bad or worse doesn't automatically make FiiO good.

No problem! I personally am enjoying the BTR5 (as well as Qudelix 5K), but I hope you find something that you prefer!

 

[Aevum]

I wanted more power, so i just changed from unbalanced to balanced and now its even better.

the only way they could improve it is basically make a jacket you can slip on it with a 2nd battery and a SD card slot so you can us it as a dap.

After having owned the original BTR, the M3K, M3Pro and X3 II, as well as the LC-BT2 and the UTWS3 i like the BTR5 the best, followed by the M3Pro.

both very well designed and very nice and premium feeling to hold, the BTR and the LC-BT2 were major disappointments, the M3K and the X3 II are ok. im still out on the UTWS3, it didn't synergize well with my Blessing 2.

I also find it very weird that they release products that either feel and look like you bought them in the dollar store or should be in a special velvet box and only handled with microfibre cloth.

 

[Ichos]

Such Audio filters always affect the sound in a very subtle way that depending on material , headphone and hearing may not make an audible difference.
And the filters are embedded to the dac chip by ESS and not FiiO.

 

[r31ya]

The EQ and range thing I definitely am on board with, but y'all should hit the gym more often if you think this things heavy lol. If anything, one reason I like it a ton more than my ES100 is that it doesn't feel small and cheap.

Doubling on that range.

The connection sometimes stutter when i use it jogging as in it only separated by my body in between the phone and the btr.

 

[sarkar1990]

^ There are few things to improve BTR5, most important are:

- EQ support for LDAC !!!
- lighter construction
- better BT range like Qudelix 5K
- aptX Adaptive support.

Use wavelet and you have EQ over LDAC!

 

[PeterMac]

^this is not perfect solution, I prefer built in EQ in device memory, because I pair it with few devices also with PC. FiiO is a joke with this EQ for LDAC.

 

[ilianto]

I tried the EQ in aptx mode and when you activate it, it's like a thick blanket falling over the sound and all presets suck... The sound is much cleaner without it. I don't know if it's a bad implementation of EQ but on every machine that I have tried with a built-in EQ it was crap.