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Feliks Audio Elise Tube Rolling Guide 6SN7/6AS7G/6080/5998

Discussion in 'Headphone Amps (full-size)' started by renderman, May 6, 2015.
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  1. Shaffer

    I've been using Amber Rubarth's Sampler EP as a test record. The tracks are deceptively simple and very honest. Some tubes fully capture the intonations in her voice and the subtlety of the phrasing, turning the songs into a real emotional experience. Other tubes don't; and the songs remain as just the songs.
  2. Shaffer
    On a totally different note, like many, I like the systems thread. The one where folks show their setups. Some are very nice. The thing that I cannot comprehend is the placement of the gear and the listener. Since when is sitting behind a desk in an office chair an enjoyable way to listen to music? I mean, that almost defines "stiff." I can fully understand why one would have such an arrangement at work. No other option to be had, but when I see full-size gear occupying a desk - sometimes covering the bulk of the space - the question that comes to mind is why? Always. Why not sit in a comfortable chair or a couch, perhaps stretch out a bit, and relax into the sound? Why not locate the equipment in a nice audio rack or a rigid sideboard, instead of a desk? Frankly, I've never seen such a thing before coming to Head-Fi. Ever. Yet, most everyone in the aforementioned thread uses a desk and an office chair.

    I've asked folks why they prefer this arrangement only to be met with a defensive dismissal or an insult. An oddity in itself. I'm genuinely curious as to the rationale behind the desk acting as the music center. It would be perfectly reasonable if this were an isolated case - all kinds of people out there - but this is not all that dissimilar to everyone having to wear a mandated uniform. The thing is, folks don't have to and they still do it anyway. Why something as "cold" as a desk for something as enjoyable as one's favorite music?

    What piece of the puzzle am I missing?
  3. aqsw
    My headphone equipment is on a small desk which is just big enough for the gear. Right beside that is a leather recliner zero gravity chair, and a small table to rest my cocktails.
    Shaffer likes this.
  4. Renderman
    I can not speak for all those using a desk as their music station as I myself also have a comfortable setup on my entertainment console however, I do think it might have something to do with how they access their music and how they like to listen.
    It might be because they like playing their music through the PC, which happens to be located at their desk. It might also be because they like to listen to music while working on documents or browsing the web. Now a days I see there are a lot of people that feel they need to be busy all the time. Just sitting down enjoying music and nothing else might seem like a waste of time to them.
    Again, I'm just guessing here as I do not know any of the persons involved, this is just what came to mind.
    Me on the other hand, I like to go to a nice, cozy setting in a soft lit room, pour myself a nice beverage, sit down and browse my music, carefully selecting what I would like to listen too. Sit back and just enjoy the music. This helps me unwind and gather my thought, look at it as a form of meditation if you like. :)
    b3wannabe likes this.
  5. Shaffer

    Same here.
  6. Shaffer

    Sounds like a very comfortable setup.
  7. Shaffer
    I know everyone is tired of reading about my rectifiers, so what harm can one more post do? :D

    The $6.75 GE 5R4GB rectifier. For the purposes of this post I'll just stick to one tube - the 6CY7. Apparently, as a point of interest, the tube was originally designed as a TV vertical-deflection oscillator.


    As previously mentioned, I have three brands of the tube: Tung Sol, RCA, and Raytheon/GE. Aside from a few very minor details they all look identical. They don't sound identical. Not hardly. When paired with the GE 5R4GB, the resulting effect differs with each pair of 6CY7s. The Tung Sols get more sparkle and a sound more open and vivid, the RCAs loose their bass extension and quite a bit of their sense of weight, and the Raytheons gain sharper transient response, and gain bass extension and weight. [hands thrown up in the air]

    On an intuitive level, with my limited knowledge in mind, there's no rhyme or reason that can foreshadow the sound of a given combo. Or, is there?
  8. aqsw

    Air massage on the chair also. A buddy of mine had the chair in his showroom for over two years and couldn't sell it. It was $4200 (cdn) list. I bought an expensive massage chair from him as my back is sort of screwed up. I offered him $900.00 for the zero g chair at the same time, and he said no. Two weeks later I got a call and he said " you still got that 900 ".
    I absolutely love it. You can adjust it to absolutely any position you can imagine.
    Sorry, Off Topic!!
  9. Shaffer

    It sounds like a fantastic chair. And a massage? Very cool.

    I sit on an overstuffed couch. I guess sit is a relative term, as it's nice to lay back with the cans - the couch has a recliner section. When I play the system, however, the seating position is upright. Well, most of the time.

    No such thing. :) Nice to have you join in.
  10. Shaffer
    A couple of months ago, another Darkvoice owner sent me some drivers to try out, which started the entire small tube exercise. Admittedly, I've been paying more attention to the Woo in the last few weeks. Now that I feel it's pretty much as good as it's going to get, it's time to get back to the other bottles.

    One of the tubes I was sent was a Japanese 6GU7. No brand. The tube sounded dynamic, decently clear, involving, and relatively transparent. I was quite taken by it, which, in turn got the project rolling. I've since picked up two pairs of US-made 6GU7s to audition in the Elise. Where as the Japanese tube favorite detail over tone, although I liked its tonal balance quite a bit, the American 6GU7s were darker sounding, slightly slower paced, not as vivid and not as transparent. The tone was not unappealing. It had a laid back, forgiving quality that allowed one to ease into the music, especially with a flawed recording.

    Personally, for my taste, I prefer the Japanese 6GU7. It's playing right now in the DV with a Raytheon 6AS7G black plate bottom getter. Coupled with DT990pro, the sound is, well, fun! It's as if a ray of sunshine appears in every tune. This is the only Japanese tube I've heard. Reading a bit, some folks truly loathe Japanese tubes not unlike the one I have. OTOH, I'd like to find another and run the pair in the Elise.

    Have you guys heard Japanese tubes and what did you think?
  11. mordy
    About desk systems:

    I have all my equipment on a rack to the right of my desk. The PC is on the left, and I use it for music files. Have an office chair on wheels. I play music a lot of the time when I do work at my desk or browse the net.

    If a nice tune comes up which grabs my attention, I stop, and roll my chair back and just listen.

    Another reason for not having a dedicated listening room is because little fingers cannot stay away from the stuff. In the past it was my children; now it is the grand children. BTW, not a single child or grandchild shares my musical taste LOL (classic jazz from 20-20s). And my wife doesn't like my music either....
  12. mordy
    Japanese tubes can be very good. I think Matsushhita (cannot spell it correctly because Head Fi will censor it(!) bought licensing, tooling and equipment from Philips in the 50's with the deal including lending business experience to the ailing Philips.

    Some great Siemens tubes were labeled as Foreign made, and came from Japan. I think Matsushhhita became National and maybe Panasonic today.

    There is a lot of material on Japanese tube manufacturers on the Little Dot thread, The go to man is Oskari. Other manufacturers were Hitachi, Toshiba and Ten + others....
  13. gibosi
    As Mordy notes, we encountered quite a few Japanese tubes, Matusita, Toshiba, Hitachi, and others, with our LD's. However, the only Japanese 6SN7 I have is a nice pair of Hitachi 12SN7GTA. These have black ladder plates and bottom rectangular getters. It appears that Raytheon was one of the first American manufacturers to enter into technology sharing agreements with the Japanese, primarily Hitachi, and you will occasionally see Hit-Ray (Hitachi-Raytheon) labeled tubes as well as Raytheon, "made in Japan". While not great, my Hitachi's are very good tubes.
  14. Shaffer

    Very interesting. There are two Toshiba singles for the Woo that I've been eyeing. Maybe I'll give them a shot.

    I really like the Hit-Ray moniker. Tempted to look for the tubes just so I could say it.

    Good info, Mordy. Thanks for including it.
  15. gibosi
    Japanese SN7
    I confess that I haven't listened to these in a long time. As best as I can recall, these were good sounding tubes, but they didn't knock my socks off.
    Hitachi 12SN7GTA, rectangular bottom getter. The 6SN7GTA is identical, other than the heater.
    Raytheon 6SN7GTB, made in Japan, top halo getter
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