[mordy]

HI DL,
 
The pinout is different, so even though the tubes are the same size and have the same amount of pins, it will not work.
 
The easiest way to find out if the pinouts are compatible, is to go to the Radiomuseum site. As an example, just type in Radiomuseum EF86 in the google search box, and it comes up. Under the usual picture of the tube you have a diagram of the pinouts. Just compare each letter and location to see if they are identical or not.
 
This is the pinout for an ECC88 tube:
 

 
This is the pinout for the EF86 tube:
 

 
As you can see, the pinout is very different and not compatible.

 

[frederick-rea]

For music lovers opinion update: MQA/TIDAL
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/viewpoint/0417/MQA_TIDAL.htm

 

[HPLobster]

  For music lovers opinion update: MQA/TIDAL
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/viewpoint/0417/MQA_TIDAL.htm
 

 
 
https://mytekdigital.com/hifi/products/brooklyn/
 
actually thinking about it...

 

 

[DecentLevi]

Got my EF86 adapters today and played around with them as drivers with a few types of powers... unfortunately the results were very discouraging.
 
(As drivers)
paired with either Mullard 6080 or GEC 6AS7G powers I get a massive channel imbalance to the order of 60-70%
paired with Valvo EL12 the volume balance magically returns, yet with very poor sound reproduction:
 
As I have heard clearly with all test songs and all above combos, the sound I'm getting from the Mazda EF86 tubes is:
bright / thin with lacking body, dynamics and recessed mids. Also one section of a well known song with a high treble peak around 12khz was not properly reproduced, adding it's own squealing sound effect for several seconds afterward. 
 
Putting in my next most comparable tube in size anyway, the relic miniature tube RCA 12AV7, I get radically improved refinement:
clean / linear FR with velvety luscious mids and delicious dynamics, great bass definition / weight / body, and very accurate and realistic throughtout the entire spectrum. That is to say, a complete change of face making the EF86 trail far, far behind.
 
Given the completely 'backwards' performance I'm getting from my first pair of EF86 and the fact that changes from tube burn-in are usually subtle, I can say with confidence these will never live up to my other miniature tubes, especially the Tungsram E80CC and 6N23P (1975 Reflektor version). 
 
Also at least with my pair, it seems that somewhow these pentodes only pair with pentode powers. Perhaps someday I'll try another EF86 pair although not likely, but for now my impression is that either this brand was not made for audio, or not made for the Elise.

 

[DecentLevi]

What can I say, UT - thanks for the discovery but not all experiments work out for everybody. Though I do wonder if your EF86 on your system may yield drastically different results that I'm getting to warrant such great acclaim on your side.

 

[UntilThen]

Sorry it didn't work out for you DL and that you are getting such poor results.
Certainly not from what I heard.

However I'm pretty much a 6sn7 and 6as7/6080 guy now. I don't even roll with EL tubes.

It's just a decision that I've made soon after receiving Euforia. I'll stay with recommended tubes from here on.

 

[Wreckgar7]

Has anyone listened to The Sylvania 7236 tube? Got an opportunity to buy a pair for 30$, The tube rolling fingers are itching

 

[mordy]

Hi W7,
 
Haven't heard the Sylvania 7236 tubes, but all accounts I read state that they are very different from the Tung Sol 7236, and that the TS sound better.

 

[UntilThen]

Has anyone listened to The Sylvania 7236 tube? Got an opportunity to buy a pair for 30$, The tube rolling fingers are itching

 
I've not had the opportunity to try Sylvania 7236 but I can't see how any tube can sound terrible on Elise. 

  With the exception of the chinese 6h13P. 

  Violin will sound violent. 

 
I have Tung Sol and Cetron 7236 and they sound the same, not surprising as Tung Sol was sold to Cetron in the later years.
 
7236 remain 'one of my favourite' power tubes.

 

[Wreckgar7]

I've not had the opportunity to try Sylvania 7236 but I can't see how any tube can sound terrible on Elise. :wink_face:   With the exception of the chinese 6h13P. :tongue_smile:   Violin will sound violent. :bigsmile_face:

I have Tung Sol and Cetron 7236 and they sound the same, not surprising as Tung Sol was sold to Cetron in the later years.

7236 remain 'one of my favourite' power tubes.

I agree, ive never had a bad experience with any tube combination with The Elise, well for 30$ it's definitely worth a try

 

[frederick-rea]

When we are rolling tubes we have to be sure that the origin - Recording and Mastering were well done. There are ways to know this. With the high resolution of ELISE, we are discovering what is being done at the level of non-audiophile discs, which show the huge errors in frequency, dynamics, balance and timbre. High definition amplifies errors. We chose before the good recordings and masterizations in addition to the taste for a certain genre of music. Not every CD/files are good to select tubes.
An article regarding this:
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/ca/ca-academy/dynamic-range-no-quiet-no-loud-r643/

 

[HOWIE13]

  What can I say, UT - thanks for the discovery but not all experiments work out for everybody. Though I do wonder if your EF86 on your system may yield drastically different results that I'm getting to warrant such great acclaim on your side.

 
A bit late in the day but just for the record I've also now had the opportunity to try EF86 tubes, with dual EL12spez powers.
 
First in the driving sockets were a pair of  EF86 RFT (branded Zaerix). Silent background, warm, neutral and smoothly boring, lacking dynamics for my taste but will suit some genres, cans and ears.
 
Next a pair of EF86 Amperex and these were completely different. Dynamic and engaging, clear, sweet extended treble, nicely balanced mids and articulate bass.
 
HD650 sounded very good indeed. No veil here. There is a little microphony if I touch the amp during play but it's silent otherwise. Generous sound-stage too, though not as wide as with Tungsram E80CC  drivers, but wider than ECC88 Bugle boys. Bugle Boys have even more inner detail and clarity though. I like all these. Here's a picture of the Amperex EF86 set-up.
 
 

 
 
I should have added that as UT noted the vol pot needs to be set higher than with most other drivers-11 o'clock typically, instead of 8-9, but the sound doesn't suffer at all. There was always adequate headroom for the wide dynamics of a symphony orchestra.

 

[Oskari]

I also received the EF86 adapters. I hope to get to try the tubes soonish.

Can you identify the maker of the Amperexes, Howie?

 

[HOWIE13]

I also received the EF86 adapters. I hope to get to try the tubes soonish.

Can you identify the maker of the Amperexes, Howie?

Sorry, Oskar I don't know  but the best I can do is to give you the link to the seller where there is a good picture and maybe you will be able to identify the maker from there.
 
Hope this helps;
 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/EF86-AMPEREX-HOLLAND-NOS-VALVE-TUBE-LC29/262360600836?hlpht=true&ops=true&viphx=1&_trksid=p5197.c100068.m2280&_trkparms=ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140211130857%26meid%3Db270a1d070994f01a4ead76d2c3519ca%26pid%3D100068%26clkid%3D3698996376691626482&_qi=RTM2063723
 
This link doesn't work for some reason on my computer, it's coming up with Vig Link shopping! (I've now disabled this).
 
Anyway, if you ebay-uk EF86 Amperex you will see them in the yitry/Langrex listing.

 

[Oskari]

I tried and I cannot post it either. Somebody must have broken the stupid system.

If the Holland-part on the label is true, it's Philips. But the etched code tells the truth.