[ken36]

As a dog lover, I hate this guy. Why do so many with world class ability, bring shame on us all?

 

[plainsong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutwey /img/forum/go_quote.gif community service............but not jail time. jails are for those who committed heinous crimes. pit bulls are born to fight. i mean, that is what they are suppose to do. they are certainly not the best option for having a pet. what they are suppose to do is regulate the ownership of pitbulls.

And we learned something about you today.

"Pit bulls" are as fine a pet as any breed. And as with any breed, if you start mucking around with the bloodline, you'll get some predispositions... however, don't abuse your pit bull and it will be as fine as any dog... of course, you have actual experience with the breed, right? Yeah, I didn't think so.

I guess it doesn't take much smarts to get on the internet.

The last dangerous encounter I had with a pit bull: I was in the beauty salon getting my hair done, and a customer came in with her pit bull. The dog, whose name I forget, made the rounds saying hello, and then zeroed in on me as someone she hadn't met.

Yes, I was in for certain doom...right? Ummm, well, if you define certain doom as her hopping into my lap and trying her best to give me a tongue-washing, then yes, I was viciously attacked by this pit bull.

After the attack she stayed on my lap since I found an "itchy spot". Yes, they're suckers for a good scratching-to. Really really dangerous.

My first encounter with a pit bull had similar results, so yeah, they certainly need regulating.

Is this surprising for anyone with a reasonable amount of experience and common sense with pets? Of course not.

And FWIW, the worse dog encounter ever was with a golden retriever who just made up her mind that I was an intruder and that was that. I spent days trying to make friends with her and only succeeded in making sure she stopped trying to really have a go at me. Would this make all goldies vicious, or at best, unstable? No.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plainsong /img/forum/go_quote.gif And we learned something about you today. "Pit bulls" are as fine a pet as any breed. And as with any breed, if you start mucking around with the bloodline, you'll get some predispositions... however, don't abuse your pit bull and it will be as fine as any dog... of course, you have actual experience with the breed, right? Yeah, I didn't think so. I guess it doesn't take much smarts to get on the internet.

Actually "Pit Bull" is not a breed, it is a description of a type or terrier. And according to my research this kind of terrier was bred specifically for dog fighting. Please see my link above for more information, and about the risks of rescuing these abused animals.

 

[plainsong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Actually "Pit Bull" is not a breed, it is a description of a type or terrier. And according to my research this kind of terrier was bred specifically for dog fighting. Please see my link above for more information, and about the risks of rescuing these abused animals.

Yes, that's why I put the name in quotations. Hey, if anyone wants to be afraid of an entire breed because it might attack you, ignoring the fact that a dog from any other breed might also attack you, then that's your thing.

But a breed's origins do not tell much of anything about current breeding trends, nor does it tell about the individual dog.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plainsong /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, that's why I put the name in quotations. Hey, if anyone wants to be afraid of an entire breed because it might attack you, ignoring the fact that a dog from any other breed might also attack you, then that's your thing. But a breed's origins do not tell much of anything about current breeding trends, nor does it tell about the individual dog.

Quote:

Even in dogs that are not recently bred from fighting lines, the urge to fight can arise at any time. Not to strongly emphasize this fact would be negligent.

Emphasis mine. And this is from a Pit Bull rescue site.

 

[EyeAmEye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Actually "Pit Bull" is not a breed, it is a description of a type or terrier. And according to my research this kind of terrier was bred specifically for dog fighting. Please see my link above for more information, and about the risks of rescuing these abused animals.

It really doesn't matter what they were bred for or not, they make great pets, very loving, very gentle and very playful, if raised with love, just as any other dog. To make a blanket comment that they are bred for fighting so they aren't good pets, as lutwey stated, is ignorant.

It's really amazing, reading some of the responses here, that non-human life is so belittled. To even suggest the greatest tragedy of this is how Vick is wasting his own talent is truly unbelievable. Vick is a worthless piece of garbage, and belongs in prison with the worst of them.

 

[EyeAmEye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Emphasis mine. And this is from a Pit Bull rescue site.

That warning is for rescued pit bulls, and I'm certain any abused dog would pose a danger. Suggests nothing about raising a pit bull from a pup.

 

[trose49]

He is one of my favorite NFL player but I can Honestly say if this turns out true I wont be routing for him anymore

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EyeAmEye /img/forum/go_quote.gif It really doesn't matter what they were bred for or not, they make great pets, very loving, very gentle and very playful, if raised with love, just as any other dog. To make a blanket comment that they are bred for fighting so they aren't good pets, as lutwey stated, is ignorant. It's really amazing, reading some of the responses here, that non-human life is so belittled. To even suggest the greatest tragedy of this is how Vick is wasting his own talent is truly unbelievable. Vick is a worthless piece of garbage, and belongs in prison with the worst of them.

Where did I say they did not make good pets? I have never had this kind of terrier as a pet. How would I know that?

From a site that want people to adopt these animals: [size=large]"Even in dogs that are not recently bred from fighting lines, the urge to fight can arise at any time. Not to strongly emphasize this fact would be negligent."[/size]
Here they are talking about the inbred urge to fight, not rescued dogs. This kind of terrier is more predisposed to fight because of genetics. The site trying to communicate that, that these dogs may at any time attack--because they were bred for fighting. Sad but true.

Before you go calling someone "ignorant"--especially me--have your ducks in a row.

 

[plainsong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where did I say they did not make good pets? I have never had this kind of terrier as a pet. How would I know that? And it does matter what they are bred for. AGAIN: [size=large]"Even in dogs that are not recently bred from fighting lines, the urge to fight can arise at any time. Not to strongly emphasize this fact would be negligent."[/size] Here they are talking about the inbred urge to fight, not rescued dogs. Before you go calling someone "ignorant"--especially me--have your ducks in a row.

I'm sorry Red, but in this case you don't seem to know much about dogs or dog breeding. The only thing you have touched on here is that you should know your dog's pedigree going back at least 4 generations, and that the dog should come from proven stock. That would be true of ANY breed you were looking to buy.

Are we talking about pit bulls or staffies? Does it matter? Confirmation-wise, of course, but they're more related than not, and to rule out an entire breed based on a few bad breeders is just insane.

FYI - Any rescue group for any breed will tell you their breed has special needs and only the right people are suitable for their wonderful breed. They rescue. That's what they do.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plainsong /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm sorry Red, but in this case you don't seem to know much about dogs or dog breeding. The only thing you have touched on here is that you should know your dog's pedigree going back at least 4 generations, and that the dog should come from proven stock. That would be true of ANY breed you were looking to buy. Are we talking about pit bulls or staffies? Does it matter? Confirmation-wise, of course, but they're more related than not, and to rule out an entire breed based on a few bad breeders is just insane. FYI - Any rescue group for any breed will tell you their breed has special needs and only the right people are suitable for their wonderful breed. They rescue. That's what they do.

Yes but not just any dog has been bred for fighting other dogs. Why would I check 4 generations of a poodle? Or a mastiff? What we are talking about is a genetic predisposition for aggression. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

[EyeAmEye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where did I say they did not make good pets? I have never had this kind of terrier as a pet. How would I know that? And it does matter what they are bred for. AGAIN: [size=large]"Even in dogs that are not recently bred from fighting lines, the urge to fight can arise at any time. Not to strongly emphasize this fact would be negligent."[/size] Here they are talking about the inbred urge to fight, not rescued dogs. Before you go calling someone "ignorant"--especially me--have your ducks in a row.

I wasn't calling you ignorant at all, the comment was aimed at Lutwey's original comment about them not making good pets (reading over my post I can see why you thought I was referring to you, sorry about that). The only comment I directed at you was stating that the alleged breeding of the animal doesn't mean they can't make good pets.

Let me put it to you this way, no pit owner, breeder, or anyone else that has had prolonged exposure to a pit bull raised as a pet, shares the opinion about their alleged dangers. All the warnings and fear are from those who don't own one. Their opinion is completely invalid, because they base this on the portrayal of pit bulls by our glorious and always unbiased media, and the only crap coming from them is the negative, because they are being raised by gang morons and other violent idiots who raise them to be as viscious as their owner.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EyeAmEye /img/forum/go_quote.gif I wasn't calling you ignorant at all, the comment was aimed at Lutwey's original comment about them not making good pets (reading over my post I can see why you thought I was referring to you, sorry about that). The only comment I directed at you was stating that the alleged breeding of the animal doesn't mean they can't make good pets. Let me put it to you this way, no pit owner, breeder, or anyone else that has had prolonged exposure to a pit bull raised as a pet, shares the opinion about their alleged dangers. All the warnings and fear are from those who don't own one. Their opinion is completely invalid, because they base this on the portrayal of pit bulls by our glorious and always unbiased media, and the only crap coming from them is the negative, because they are being raised by gang morons and other violent idiots who raise them to be as viscious as their owner.

There is a division between responsible pet owners who treat their dogs right, and those who abuse there dogs. Pit bulls that are abused will attack other dogs, and are strong enough to kill them. Other breeds, not so much. Just because you are a responsible pit bull owner does not mean everyone is. These poor terriers were BRED to attack other dogs. Because yours do not does not make a convincing cross-section of the dog's behavior.

 

[plainsong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by redshifter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes but not just any dog has been bred for fighting other dogs. Why would I check 4 generations of a poodle? Or a mastiff? What we are talking about is a genetic predisposition for aggression. What is so hard to understand about that?

Umm, you want to check because you care about having a happy healthy dog? Seriously, no one should breed one dog to another dog if they haven't both either earned a show title, won a tracking/earth dog, etc., competition, or been certified by a judge as suitable for breeding.

Please, don't perpetuate the need for poorly bred dogs. You won't get the best that breed has to offer, and for the dog it can result in less than stellar health. Only buy from breeders that can produce this kind of information and who care about actually bettering the breed.

And yeah, you want to care especially about Mastiffs. Poorly bred Mastiffs can be a bit crazy, aggressive, nervous, and oh yeah, can have all the big dog ailments times 2.

And besides the heartbreak of these big dogs with short life spans, Mastiffs are supposed to not be aggressive, or nervous...or crazy in the bad way.

In fact, in the Finnish Dachshund Club, if you don't follow those rules your butt is kicked out and warnings put in local papers not to buy dogs from you. The doxy club isn't unique with these rules.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plainsong /img/forum/go_quote.gif Umm, you want to check because you care about having a happy healthy dog? Seriously, no one should breed one dog to another dog if they haven't both either earned a show title, won a tracking/earth dog, etc., competition, or been certified by a judge as suitable for breeding. Please, don't perpetuate the need for poorly bred dogs. You won't get the best that breed has to offer, and for the dog it can result in less than stellar health. Only buy from breeders that can produce this kind of information and who care about actually bettering the breed. And yeah, you want to care especially about Mastiffs. Poorly bred Mastiffs can be a bit crazy, aggressive, nervous, and oh yeah, can have all the big dog ailments times 2. And besides the heartbreak of these big dogs with short life spans, Mastiffs are supposed to not be aggressive, or nervous...or crazy in the bad way. In fact, in the Finnish Dachshund Club, if you don't follow those rules your butt is kicked out and warnings put in local papers not to buy dogs from you. The doxy club isn't unique with these rules.

I agree with you, breeding is very important. As an iguana enthusiast, I know first hand the impact good breeding can make on an animal's overall behavior. The current iguana I keep is very well balanced, curious and affectionate. This has a lot to do with how he was bred (his mother was in a breeding program in a controlled situation (a zoo)). My previous ig was wild-caught and although she was a wonderful pet, she had some serious aggression problems, although I have to admit much of that probably had to do with the trauma of being caught.