Etymotic ER4-S Burn In?
Jul 7, 2009 at 5:15 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 11

Knightingale

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ive been reading and heard different opinions on balance armature drives benefiting from burn in and i've got no definite or concrete enough answer.

So, Calling all ety ER4 owners/users:
Please share your experience whether your ER4 benefited from burn in and how long is the recomended burn in time?
atsmile.gif
 
Jul 8, 2009 at 1:55 AM Post #2 of 11
Burn-in, if it applies to ER4S, will eventually happen as time goes by if you keep using it. If not, then it doesn't really matter at all. So, why don't you start using the IEM and enjoy the music?
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Jul 9, 2009 at 1:51 AM Post #5 of 11
Quote:

Originally Posted by Spyro /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Your ears burn in, not the IEM's.


<claps>

Although there is some adjustment in properties from wear of the mechanical device, most of the burn in that happens is more the person then the hardware. It's amazing how much our minds play games with us sometimes.
 
Jul 9, 2009 at 3:57 AM Post #6 of 11
I believe in burn-in as both a physical and psychological process. At least one poster I've crossed laptops with has likened burn-in to a fantasy, a delusion, even a religion. While I think he's generally full of crap, there is definitely a subjective aspect to burn-in. To me, that part of it is more like getting glasses or contact lenses for the first time. While I find no fault with my eye exam, I must admit it took a while to adjust to wearing glasses. I don't think the glasses went through "burn-in." I did. My brain was processing vision through my astigmatic eyes - and by my late 20's, it was used to doing so. When I got "corrected" vision, I couldn't help but notice how warped everything was. At first, I thought there was something wrong with the lenses, but then marveled at how warped my vision became when I took my glasses off. I sheet of paper, which was larger on the left than on the right, became larger on the right than on the left. It took some time for my brain to get used to the new visual presentation, and when it did, I stopped noticing how these weird after-effects of having glasses.

That happens with all forms of sound reproduction. It's why my car stereo sounds so good, even though it's not. I'm used to how it sounds. I don't want a great car stereo. I'm used to this presentation, at least when I jump in my car. Then again, I'm one of those people who recognizes that there's no such thing as the perfect presentation. There's more than one way to do sound. But each strategy needs to be given time, to let the brain process.

That said, I still believe in burn-in, though I'm skeptical of all the hype. With certain parts, it takes time to break the part in. That is an accepted part of the hi-fi world, specifically with speakers. But it's not equally the case with all speakers. There are speakers whose suspension could use a little warm up time. Right out of the box, they sound 90% or more like they're going to sound in ten years, but there's that last 10% where the driver might be a little stuff, et cetera. I'm not ruling out psychology as playing a big part in speaker drive-in. Even so, I think there's a physical aspect to this, at least with drivers large enough for suspension break-in to be noticeable.

I don't think it applies to wire. I don't think it applies to a lot of simple components. I certainly do not think it has any application with respect to balanced armatures. BA's don't have suspension coils like other types of drivers. Open one up and it looks like the world's smallest grand piano, but with metal slats instead of wires.

Most of my IEMs have had limited use, but the one IEM I have used enough to experience burn-in is the UM3X. To my ears, they sound the same as they did the day I bought them. So, for me, IEM burn-in is bunk. But that's my experience. Someone may have a different tale to tell.
 
Jul 9, 2009 at 4:17 AM Post #7 of 11
Burn-in is due where it is mechanically feasible. I've done overnight burn-ins of a couple of my earphones. The main benefit has generally been an improvement of sensitivity as parts wore in. Sound changed some, but the bigger changes were more immediate, more in the first couple minutes then in the first couple hours (or days for some). Typically, nothing amazing happens, and the speaker or headphone doesn't waver greatly from what it always was. My biggest gripes are placing burn-in on something that really can't "break in" and the duration of burn in and what it really means, example 100,000 oscillations versus 1,000,000 oscillations versus 100,000,000 oscillations. How much is really needed before any further change is practically immeasurable? A 50Hz tone played for one day oscillates 4.3 million times. Is flapping a piece of cloth or whatever material flexing 4 million times sufficient to "loosen" it? Was it sufficiently loosened after maybe 100,000 times or 1000 times? I mean how much molecular change does a person expect after the first, oh, million oscillations? That covers the first few hours. What about the other 497 hours it's supposed to take? That's a concept that really bugs me a lot.
 
Jul 9, 2009 at 5:24 PM Post #8 of 11
wow. that's some deep technical philosophical and psychological writings.

i've been listening to the er4s unamped and i hear some annoying sibilance.
any advice on how to reduce or terminate the sssssssssss?

i'm playing directly out from my pc's 3.5mm output.

could it be my source causing the sibilance?
saving up for an amp and a dac.



by the way could somebody recommend an amp that has good synergy wit the ER4S yet still leaves a part of my wallet intact.

after some checking local options for amps and budget:
does AMB mini3 pairs well with ER4S?

edit: whoops i forgot to mention i'm listening to lossless or 320kbps all of the time.
 
Jul 12, 2009 at 5:29 PM Post #10 of 11
Quote:

Originally Posted by mvw2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
A 50Hz tone played for one day oscillates 4.3 million times. Is flapping a piece of cloth or whatever material flexing 4 million times sufficient to "loosen" it? Was it sufficiently loosened after maybe 100,000 times or 1000 times? I mean how much molecular change does a person expect after the first, oh, million oscillations? That covers the first few hours. What about the other 497 hours it's supposed to take?



Fun with math.
biggrin.gif
I never considered just how many oscillations are given for just one day.


@Knightingale- I may have missed it somewhere but if you're using silicone tips, try a foam instead to control sibilance.
 
Jul 17, 2009 at 9:17 PM Post #11 of 11
Quote:

Originally Posted by Knightingale /img/forum/go_quote.gif
wow. that's some deep technical philosophical and psychological writings.

i've been listening to the er4s unamped and i hear some annoying sibilance.
any advice on how to reduce or terminate the sssssssssss?



Do you get the same sibilance when the headphone is amped?

Sibilance is a little like nausea. Several different causes can have the same effect. Sibilance is part of what we hear (even if we tune it out). In recording and broadcast, it poses a challenge because the equipment designed to accurately produce high frequencies naturally picks up this sound, which has more body to it (and a slower rate of decay). The attempt to emphasize HF ends up reproducing the sibilance as well.

Sibilance is also the result of poor equipment or poorly adjusted equipment. If you've got too rich a mix of HF, you're going to get more sibilance than you bargained for. If you've got equipment overemphasizing certain frequencies, with sharp spikes and troughs, you can also get more sibilance. There's plenty of equipment that poorly reproduces the bass or mids, so the attempt to crank it up while drive a nail through your skull. There are also cheap component parts, with poor accuracy, so again, you get sibilance issues galore.

To bottle the ends, you could have a sibilant recording, a sibilant player or a sibilant amp - if not all three.

When it comes to earphones, sibilance is the result of two factors: driver sibilance and ear-canal acoustics. Small wide-range drivers may overly produce HF or underproduce LF. Either way, you may end up with a mix that leans toward the HF - giving you excess sibilance. The ear canal is also an acoustical environment that favors sibilance. Some creatures - like s-s-snakes - are sensitive to LF, which they "hear" through their bellies. I suppose, for a snake, that's important because the snake's survival depends on its ability to hear its dinner taking a walk. We, on the other hand, are highly sensitive to mids and HF, which probably gave our ancestors a different set of cues. We don't crawl around on our stomachs so our awareness - of both breakfast and predators - depended on a different set of frequencies, from a different vantage point. What were our ancestors listening for? Movements in the grass? The snapping of twigs?

But I digress. The point is that this pair of sound horns, strapped to the sides of our skulls, along with the long ear canals, may not be as far-ranging as that of some animals, but its earliest use was geared toward survival, not pleasure. It doesn't matter that the sounds it picked up were less than euphonic. What mattered was its efficiency. Its job was to pick up as much as it could; the brain developed a kind of filter for tuning out what it didn't need. This leaves the ear and ear canal sensitive to sounds we pipe right in. The proximity of the sound, along with the cupping design of the ear and ear canal, make it very easy to get overwhelmed by the HF. For that reason, earphone drivers are designed to have an HF roll-off. Even then, the drivers need a filter to avoid overwhelming the ear, which is already more than tuned to these sounds.

Even custom IEMs, with their claim to employing integrated passive crossovers, use filters to attenuate the HF. If the filter is inadequate or damaged, you'll get sibilance. What's more, the ER4S uses higher impedence, which enhances the HF. Chances are, you have a damaged filter (Ety filters are non-reusable). The alternative is to use a different kind of filter, which will change the performance of your phones, but by simply blocking out more HF.
 

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