Eastsound CD-5 Did I Make A Mistake When I Tried this Out?

[Senn20]

ProLogic or no, you're still hearing a re-processed signal. Even your analog inputs get reprocessed.

I have no doubt that the signal going to the front and rear channels is the same, but it's not the same signal that came out of the Eastsound.

Your reciever doesn't send the analog input directly to the amplification stage. It gets converted to digital, upsampled, processed to 5.1, converted back to analog and then[/i] sent to the amplification stage.

I repeat. You are not hearing the pure analog signal from the Eastsound.

 

[B-side J]

So what if you set your 5.1 system on 2.1? Would it bypass the internal DAC or would it still convert to digital? I'm asking because if i hook by Zhaolu to my system and set it to 2.1 is sounds 10 times better than anyother setting (as I said befor). I'd like to know what the reaon is.

Thnx,

JB

 

[Hershon2000]

Would appreciate youu clarifying a few things for me please & realise I'm not being sarcastic. Please comment with the following if you agree or not & if you have time too, the reasoning behind it. For purpose of definition, my definition of reprocessing means an alteration of the output of the sound on each channels output. If does not mean that because the CD player is using the receivers DAC that the output is being reprocessed.

1. When you plug your CD player directly into a 5.1 A/V Receiver by analog (RCA) connections:

A. If you play it on the 2 front channel & a sub mode, you are using the CD players DAC & the sound is not being reprocessed.

B. If you play it on the 5 channel all natural sound mode, you say I think you are not using the CD players DAC but the receivers DAC & the sound on the left & right front speakers are being reprocessed & not producing the same output for the front speakers that are produced in the back speakers.

2. When you plug your CD player directly into a 5.1 A/V Receiver by digital (optical or coaxal) connections:

A. If you play it on the 2 front channel & a sub mode, you are using the receivers DAC & the sound is not being reprocessed.

B. If you play it on the 5 channel all natural sound mode, you are using the receivers DAC & the sound on the left & right front speakers are being reprocessed & not producing the same output for the front speakers that are produced in the back speakers.

Also on my system, if the CD player is connected in the 5.1 mode by analog cables it sounds alot different then digital cables (sometimes better, sometimes worse, depenjding in the player.
Am I right in saying that you think if a CD players is connected by RCA cables to a receiver in a 2.0 or 2.1 setting, only then will the sound, sound correct & if its connected by digital cables in a 2.0 or 2.1 setting, the sound will not be correct? Any connection in the 5.1 all channel natural not prologic setting will not produce the correct sound? All I can say is that for my ears, my Pioneer by digital connection in the 5.1 setting sounded night & day better then the Eastsound in both the 2.0 & 5.1 settings, cconnected digitally or by analog.

Thanks for your comments whter you disagree or not.

 

[Hershon2000]

I'm assuming you play some rock stuff. If you do, take a half an hour & if you have a spare optical cable (which you might be using for your DVD plaer) or coaxal cable (a cheap RCA video out cable that you use for a VCR will suffice), assuming your speakers for say DVD are properly balanced, connect your CD player by digital cable to your receiver & then listen in the all natural 5.1 (stereo) mode on your receiver, if you have that mode which I'm pretty sure you do. Note this is not ProLogic. You might prefer this better as to me it gives a much more fuller, in depth, three dimensional type sound. If you play classical music, well I can't comment if that would sound better or not.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senn20 ProLogic or no, you're still hearing a re-processed signal. Even your analog inputs get reprocessed. I have no doubt that the signal going to the front and rear channels is the same, but it's not the same signal that came out of the Eastsound. Your reciever doesn't send the analog input directly to the amplification stage. It gets converted to digital, upsampled, processed to 5.1, converted back to analog and then sent to the amplification stage. I repeat. You are not hearing the pure analog signal from the Eastsound.[/i]

Exactly why I love my analogue vintage marantz 2216b. I was considering a stereo reciever, but I think I'll keep this for now. The best part is that I can use the inputs / outputs without the reciever being on

.
PS, I think you should sell this playera nd let somebody else enjoy it, you obviously have a 5.1 setup where this player just won't suffice.

 

[Hershon2000]

I don't have the Eastsound CD-5. I actually & it was worth it & the seller was a real good guy, just decided after trying this out for a few hours, decided not to purchase it. I offered the seller, who lives about an hour away, $100 if I didn't want to buy it for I think $600 or so, if he would come down & let me try it out as I definately was planning to buy it based on what I read on this forum. When you think the guy had to drive for 2 hours, pack & unpack the player, $100 was fair.

In regards to the Marantz 2216B, out of curiosity I looked it up & people said good things but there is no sub connection & at least with my speakers that wouldn't work. How do you listen without a sub?

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershon2000 I don't have the Eastsound CD-5. I actually & it was worth it & the seller was a real good guy, just decided after trying this out for a few hours, decided not to purchase it. I offered the seller, who lives about an hour away, $100 if I didn't want to buy it for I think $600 or so, if he would come down & let me try it out as I definately was planning to buy it based on what I read on this forum. When you think the guy had to drive for 2 hours, pack & unpack the player, $100 was fair. In regards to the Marantz 2216B, out of curiosity I looked it up & people said good things but there is no sub connection & at least with my speakers that wouldn't work. How do you listen without a sub?

I use it with headphones, and it's a low end vintage reciever. You can use the 2nd speaker system ports for a sub I believe. It's all analogue though.

As for the eastsound, it'de be much fairer I think to buy it from him, and re-sell it somewhere else. $100 for 2 hours and an inconvience really might not be enough for some people and what there time is worth, I know for me I'de be angry.

Oh, and you can't really get a good estimation of quality of an Audio product like an high end CDP after a few hours, you need to give it some time. Some people believe in burn in, so they give their players hundreds of horus before giving an definitive opinion.

Generally vitnage recievers are used for their preamp abilities I believe anyway.

 

[Hershon2000]

Well he agreed to this beforehand so I don't feel bad at all.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershon2000 Well he agreed to this beforehand so I don't feel bad at all.

I would had bought it, and probably resold it to somebody for $500 (which would be doing an amazing deed as I think they go for much more) or resold it for $600. $50 an hour + an pain in the ass experience is awful for myself if you ask me, but that's just me. Like I said, if your really going to listen to RBCDS on 5.1 and not going to buy SA-CD/DVD-A encoded in 5.1, you should probably invest all of your money into your reciever.

 

[doctorjuggles]

I'm going to try and answer what I can here, I'm not entirely sure if you're making a statement that needs to be challenged, if you're asking a question or what, but here goes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershon2000 1. When you plug your CD player directly into a 5.1 A/V Receiver by analog (RCA) connections: A. If you play it on the 2 front channel & a sub mode, you are using the CD players DAC & the sound is not being reprocessed. B. If you play it on the 5 channel all natural sound mode, you say I think you are not using the CD players DAC but the receivers DAC & the sound on the left & right front speakers are being reprocessed & not producing the same output for the front speakers that are produced in the back speakers.

A is incorrect. 2 channel stereo is exactly that. 2 channels. If there's a sub in there, then your receiver is processing the signal and deciding what low frequencies are being sent to the sub and what's being sent to the 2 speakers. Therefore, in audiophile terms, you are not getting pure 2 channel stereo.
Whether you prefer this sound or not, I'm not here to argue, I'm just trying to answer the question.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershon2000 2. When you plug your CD player directly into a 5.1 A/V Receiver by digital (optical or coaxal) connections: A. If you play it on the 2 front channel & a sub mode, you are using the receivers DAC & the sound is not being reprocessed. B. If you play it on the 5 channel all natural sound mode, you are using the receivers DAC & the sound on the left & right front speakers are being reprocessed & not producing the same output for the front speakers that are produced in the back speakers.

A is again incorrect. If you're feeding a signal to the receiver by digital signal, by very definition is HAS to be reprocessed, as digital signals wouldn't make music unless it's reprocessed. And once again, the receiver has to decide what LF signals to feed the sub and what signals to send to the speakers.

Your receiver should have a "Pure Direct" mode or something similar, which attempts to mimic a normal stereo amplifier. In pure direct mode, it will be calibrated to play in stereo, ignoring subs, and it should perform best for stereo music in that mode.
Again, though, as far as I'm aware there's a degree of processing happening here, because the very nature of a receiver is a processing beast, and it's stereo mode is mimicry. Compromises have to be made, but those compromises could actually perform something that sounds better to you than standard stereo amplifiers. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just your preference.

However, most audiophiles agree that an AV receiver against a dedicated stereo amplifier will usually result in the stereo amp sounding better with 2 channel music, all other things being equal.

I suspect with a pure 2 channel amp, you might have had different experiences with the Eastsound, but this is conjecture.
AV receivers introduce too many variables into the equation and I suspect this is why people on the forum are having difficulty with some of your statements.

 

[murrmax]

For a start your creating a bit of an imbalance with pairing a high end peice of equipment like the E5 with a midfi ht reciever, this cd player is awesome if the rest of your gear has the potential - Schumacher behind the wheel of and old chevvy with bald tyres can only do so much... cables,speakers,amp it all adds up...

 

[Enverxis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershon2000 What I'm having trouble understanding is, if a recording sounds great in 2 channel format on a CD player like the Eastsound CD-5 is suppose to (haven't heard so I can't state this as fact), shouldn't it also sound as good if I'm playing this in all natural 5.1.

If the recording is not natural 5.1 (recorded as such) then no it will sound worse.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enverxis If the recording is not natural 5.1 (recorded as such) then no it will sound worse.

Well, I guess that is a big argue about DSPS. I personally don't understand DSPS algorithims as they are probably far too complex for me, but I believe that unless it's been mastered in a studio, a DSP can't do a very good job at figuring out what sounds should be in the center or rear as an example.

 

[Enverxis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaGwire a DSP can't do a very good job at figuring out what sounds should be in the center or rear as an example.

precisely what I mean.

besides I'll bet some of the information would be lost in the upsampling as well.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enverxis precisely what I mean. besides I'll bet some of the information would be lost in the upsampling as well.

I think that keeping your conversions between analogue and digital as simple as possible is the best, correct? I.E. vinyl is all analogue, and if you use a cd player to a dac or just the cd player, and from either the dac or cd player to an amp, your only converting digital to analogue once. When your going between recievers through analogue outputs, your changing from digital to analogue to digital to analogue, etc. In the process, your doing crazy stuff. A lot of people are fans of DSPS, but honestly, the best surround sound imho is done in studios where peoples human ears are testing sounds in different channels, not an artificial thing like a DSP.