[davjac84]

If you do end up scoring a pair of the RW-3000s make sure you come back here and let me/us know how they work out for you. BTW, the cable that comes with them is very nice quality and I don't find it to be that heavy either. That said, one of the cool things about MMCX buds like the 3000s is that you can change to whatever cable you want.

Sure will I'll be back and let you know if they are Yay or Nay
You are right about that, MMCX/2pin/other is nice, being able to choose your own cable

 

[samandhi]

Sounds promising this Thanks for the input.
The cable will be interesting, I prefer fairly light cables, braided cables are often more heavy, but they are tangle proof which is a big plus.
The ultimate cable would be light, durable and tangle proof. I wonder how such a cable would look like, oh and I wan't mic on my cables...

This isn't the heaviest cable that I have had on an earbud, but also not the lightest. Here is a picture of the RW3000 and the Smabat M2s Pro, which DOES have the thinnest/lightest cable (also using the super soft type of outer jacket). When I first got this pair I thought that this cable was way too thin and wouldn't last very long. Turns out it is a whole lot more durable that I gave it credit for being. At one point I even contacted Smabat to see if I could buy this cable (by itself) for some of my other buds. BTW! The answer is no, they don't sell them separately...

Spoiler

 

[fooltoque]

I bought mine from Penon, but we didn't mesh so they moved on. The hybrid configuration in an earbud is an interesting idea, but the fit/seal requirements to get the best out of the BA seems to be something that Dunu didn't execute all that well for me. Worn like a normal bud, I found them to be pretty lackluster. Worn with their stabilizing fin thing, it was much better, but only if I didn't move and didn't speak, smile, take a drink, etc.

Ah, yeah I've been there before. It doesn't work, however much you want it to.

This isn't the heaviest cable that I have had on an earbud, but also not the lightest. Here is a picture of the RW3000 and the Smabat M2s Pro, which DOES have the thinnest/lightest cable (also using the super soft type of outer jacket). When I first got this pair I thought that this cable was way too thin and wouldn't last very long. Turns out it is a whole lot more durable that I gave it credit for being. At one point I even contacted Smabat to see if I could buy this cable (by itself) for some of my other buds. BTW! The answer is no, they don't sell them separately...

Spoiler

That Smabat cable reminds me of some of the cables I was looking at today at e-earphones store from Nobunaga labs. Very thin/light.
I think they were these ones.

Spoiler

http://nobunagalabs.com/nobunagalabs/recable/spica/

 

[mt877]

Do you have any output specs for us? This thing looks way cool!

I would be eager to hear about its specs also?!

Load resistor	Left Vrms	Right Vrms	Output Power (V x V)/R = P (in mW)
15.7Ω (Closest value to 16Ω)	2.653	2.640	445.61
33.5Ω (Closest value to 32Ω)	2.772	2.745	229.37
82Ω (Closest value to 80Ω)	2.835	2.794	98
150Ω	2.851	2.812	54.18
300Ω	2.864	2.823	27.32
580Ω (Closest value to 600Ω)	2.867	2.827	14.17
1000Ω	2.866	2.823	8.19
Output Impedance = 1Ω

Procedure:
Input: 1khz sine wave @ 1Vrms (2.83Vpp)
Connect left and right 15.7Ω (16Ω) loads
Adjust internal gain pots for equal (matching) maximum sine wave output without clipping.
Measure Vrms of both left and right channels with the loads listed.

I created a thread in the DIY forum as well: Oatley K272C-NEW with Burson V6 Vivid amp build

Spoiler: Here's a top view pic of the board

 

[agonynine]

In taobao . Here is the name shop

Cool, thank you @VisalEziomi, I’ll see if I can work out how to get a set across to England, there must be some kind of proxy service somewhere.

 

[samandhi]

Ah, yeah I've been there before. It doesn't work, however much you want it to.


That Smabat cable reminds me of some of the cables I was looking at today at e-earphones store from Nobunaga labs. Very thin/light.
I think they were these ones.

Spoiler

http://nobunagalabs.com/nobunagalabs/recable/spica/

Oh, nice... I may have to check into one of those. Thanks for the link.

 

[Sam L]

I am sending @Ronion (pretty much) my entire collection of buds so that he can measure them to get a good database that can be reliable. The Maria II will be part of that equation.... I am pretty excited to see how they all fare against one another.

Nice! Glad you could do this. I have no time to continue my experiments with measuring and creating wavelet compensation files, otherwise I would of totally offered to fly out where ever you are and measure everything.

 

[Sam L]

I think that the Maria II have the best soundstage (still), and they are indeed very good for watching movies. No the bass isn't boosted like some of the others that were suggested but (and this might just be my ears being different from others here) these DO have a lot of subbass when called for. The mid bass isn't boosted, so there isn't quite as much punch overall; the bass is much more linear across the board. But these can reach much lower and have deeper sounding bass than the others mentioned (except maybe for the FF3, they really do have amazing bass presentation). Now, when called for it does indeed have pretty big bass.

Agreed the Maria II have a soundstage that is freakishly wide. While I still listen to them regularly, I can't use them for long periods of time because the they're a bit too aggressive in the upper frequencies. A really unique earbud, truly.

 

[samandhi]

Nice! Glad you could do this. I have no time to continue my experiments with measuring and creating wavelet compensation files, otherwise I would of totally offered to fly out where ever you are and measure everything.

I fear @Ronion will be doing all the work, I am just sending them to him.... LOL I only wish I had more sets than I do for a more complete DB.

Agreed the Maria II have a soundstage that is freakishly wide. While I still listen to them regularly, I can't use them for long periods of time because the they're a bit too aggressive in the upper frequencies. A really unique earbud, truly.

Same here.

Speaking from the first quote, have you made a compensation Auto-EQ file for the Maria II? I would be interested in hearing it. I don't use Wavelet, but I use Neutron, which either imports directly from Github or I can just create and enter my own values. I might even be able to import the file directly, I have not tried so I am not sure.

 

[samandhi]

Speaking of which, here is the list of the ones I am sending for testing (even though he has the FF3, it might make sense to see if they both read the same).

• Yinman 2.0 600
• FiiO FF5
• FiiO FF3
• DUNU Alpha 1
• Yincrow RW3000
• Yincrow RW2000
• Smabat ST10S Pro B&G (150ohm)
• OG Apple classic
• NiceHCK EB2S
• Moondrop Chaconne
• Maria II

 

[samandhi]

Load resistor	Left Vrms	Right Vrms	Output Power (V x V)/R = P (in mW)
15.7Ω (Closest value to 16Ω)	2.653	2.640	445.61
33.5Ω (Closest value to 32Ω)	2.772	2.745	229.37
82Ω (Closest value to 80Ω)	2.835	2.794	98
150Ω	2.851	2.812	54.18
300Ω	2.864	2.823	27.32
580Ω (Closest value to 600Ω)	2.867	2.827	14.17
1000Ω	2.866	2.823	8.19
Output Impedance = 1Ω

Procedure:
Input: 1khz sine wave @ 1Vrms (2.83Vpp)
Connect left and right 15.7Ω (16Ω) loads
Adjust internal gain pots for equal (matching) maximum sine wave output without clipping.
Measure Vrms of both left and right channels with the loads listed.

I created a thread in the DIY forum as well: Oatley K272C-NEW with Burson V6 Vivid amp build

Spoiler: Here's a top view pic of the board

Nice! So, did you have to adjust for biasing of the new opamp, or does it have an auto-biasing feature?

 

[JAnonymous5150]

Load resistor	Left Vrms	Right Vrms	Output Power (V x V)/R = P (in mW)
15.7Ω (Closest value to 16Ω)	2.653	2.640	445.61
33.5Ω (Closest value to 32Ω)	2.772	2.745	229.37
82Ω (Closest value to 80Ω)	2.835	2.794	98
150Ω	2.851	2.812	54.18
300Ω	2.864	2.823	27.32
580Ω (Closest value to 600Ω)	2.867	2.827	14.17
1000Ω	2.866	2.823	8.19
Output Impedance = 1Ω

Procedure:
Input: 1khz sine wave @ 1Vrms (2.83Vpp)
Connect left and right 15.7Ω (16Ω) loads
Adjust internal gain pots for equal (matching) maximum sine wave output without clipping.
Measure Vrms of both left and right channels with the loads listed.

I created a thread in the DIY forum as well: Oatley K272C-NEW with Burson V6 Vivid amp build

Spoiler: Here's a top view pic of the board

So aside from the Burson V6 is yours built with the parts that come with the kit you can order from Oatley?

 

[samandhi]

So aside from the Burson V6 is yours built with the parts that come with the kit you can order from Oatley?

You've probably been so busy you must have missed this bro...

Besides what you get with the kit, it's bare bones, meaning I had to source all the other components, battery, charging board, aluminum case, volume pot, 3.5mm and 4.4mm sockets and do the layout.

Edit: It's a wonder you have time to spend with us at all being as how popular the BeeGees still are...

 

[mt877]

Nice! So, did you have to adjust for biasing of the new opamp, or does it have an auto-biasing feature?

The opamp circuit design is generic enough that it works for all opamps that have the same pinout as the venerable NE5532P. I actually tried the NE5532P (included), OPA2134 (add-on purchase), LME49720NA, MUSES02 and last, but definitely not least the Burson V6 Vivid. Regardless of what some people may say you can definitely hear differences between different opamps. I know you guys won't hold me to a double blind ABX test and I wouldn't do it anyways... In the end the Burson V6 Vivid was my choice.

So aside from the Burson V6 is yours built with the parts that come with the kit you can order from Oatley?

As @samandhi already mentioned I had to get all the peripheral parts. The kit comes with the board and a bag of loose components to stuff the board. The sub-mini pentodes came in small boxes.

I believe what you're asking is did I upgrade any of the stock components. I didn't upgrade any of the components except for the Burson. If I was gonna upgrade parts, I would start with the resistors. I would probably stick with carbon resistors but get some with 1% tolerance. I did make sure to measure every resistor and put the same or close value resistor in the same spot for both left and right channels. If I was gonna upgrade the caps, I would get better coupling caps, just because they are in the signal path.

Just so everyone knows, this amp actually has higher output power. When I first tuned it I started with the 32Ω load and went up to 1kΩ, then I checked 16Ω afterwards.
With the 16Ω load I couldn't turn the volume to max (almost to max) without severe clipping, so I took a measurement of the 16 just before clipping occurred. I was thinking about leaving the tuning I set with the 32Ω, but I settled on retuning starting with the 16Ω which reduced the power.

In reality, nobody would ever feed in consumer line level audio (1Vrms) and turn the volume to max with 16Ω head gear. You would blow your ears out. I could see feeding line level and turning the volume up to a comfortable listening level which would not even get near the potential signal clipping range. The other reason I settled with the 16Ω tuning is because I listened to some tunes with the higher output tuning and it sounded too clinical, edgy, no fun. Lack of a better way to describe it, the lower power tuning had a better overall balance. Just sounded better to me.

EDIT: I went back and adjusted to the high gain. My initial impression with high gain adjustment was based on listening to 16Ω earbuds with my DAP at full volume input to the "Koala Amp". The high gain is beneficial to driving higher impedance head gear which is why I built this amp in the first place. For lower impedance head gear I just lower the volume of my DAP and turn the volume knob up on the Koala Amp and everything sounds great now.

Here's the higher output numbers:

Load resistor	Left Vrms	Right Vrms	Output Power (V x V)/R = P (in mW)
15.7Ω (Closest value to 16Ω)	2.627	2.594	439.56
33.5Ω (Closest value to 32Ω)	3.605	3.605	387.9
82Ω (Closest value to 80Ω)	3.750	3.764	171.49
150Ω	3.797	3.794	96.11
300Ω	3.820	3.823	48.64
580Ω (Closest value to 600Ω)	3.829	3.823	25.28
1000Ω	3.830	3.824	14.63
Output Impedance = 1Ω

 

[JAnonymous5150]

The opamp circuit design is generic enough that it works for all opamps that have the same pinout as the venerable NE5532P. I actually tried the NE5532P (included), OPA2134 (add-on purchase), LME49720NA, MUSES02 and last, but definitely not least the Burson V6 Vivid. Regardless of what some people may say you can definitely hear differences between different opamps. I know you guys won't hold me to a double blind ABX test and I wouldn't do it anyways... In the end the Burson V6 Vivid was my choice.


As @samandhi already mentioned I had to get all the peripheral parts. The kit comes with the board and a bag of loose components to stuff the board. The sub-mini pentodes came in small boxes.

I believe what you're asking is did I upgrade any of the stock components. I didn't upgrade any of the components except for the Burson. If I was gonna upgrade parts, I would start with the resistors. I would probably stick with carbon resistors but get some with 1% tolerance. I did make sure to measure every resistor and put the same or close value resistor in the same spot for both left and right channels. If I was gonna upgrade the caps, I would get better coupling caps, just because they are in the signal path.

Just so everyone knows, this amp actually has higher output power. When I first tuned it I started with the 32Ω load and went up to 1kΩ, then I checked 16Ω afterwards.
With the 16Ω load I couldn't turn the volume to max (almost to max) without severe clipping, so I took a measurement of the 16 just before clipping occurred. I was thinking about leaving the tuning I set with the 32Ω, but I settled on retuning starting with the 16Ω which reduced the power.

In reality, nobody would ever feed in consumer line level audio (1Vrms) and turn the volume to max with 16Ω head gear. You would blow your ears out. I could see feeding line level and turning the volume up to a comfortable listening level which would not even get near the potential signal clipping range. The other reason I settled with the 16Ω tuning is because I listened to some tunes with the higher output tuning and it sounded too clinical, edgy, no fun. Lack of a better way to describe it, the lower power tuning had a better overall balance. Just sounded better to me.

Here's the higher output numbers:

Load resistor	Left Vrms	Right Vrms	Output Power (V x V)/R = P (in mW)
15.7Ω (Closest value to 16Ω)	2.627	2.594	439.56
33.5Ω (Closest value to 32Ω)	3.605	3.605	387.9
82Ω (Closest value to 80Ω)	3.750	3.764	171.49
150Ω	3.797	3.794	96.11
300Ω	3.820	3.823	48.64
580Ω (Closest value to 600Ω)	3.829	3.823	25.28
1000Ω	3.830	3.824	14.63
Output Impedance = 1Ω

Right on! Thanks for the breakdown. You're right, I was asking because I was wondering if you upgraded anything beyond the op amp. I have a Douk U3 mini headphone amp that I have modded the heck out of over the 3 years that I've owned it and I have the amp/DAC combo I built this summer so I'm always interested to hear how people build their projects and ehat tweaks and mods they have done to them.

I was also wondering because that looks like a pretty cool little amp so I was thinking about ordering the kit to build one myself when I have some time. It sounds like a fun/cool project to do. How long would you say it took to complete?