[visionaryBlend]

Hello, this is my first time posting on Head-Fi Forums, so please do bear with me.
 
I recently purchased the DT880 Premium, 250 ohm version. This is my first foray into high end headphones, excluding Grado SR80i's. (which I enjoyed, until I had issues with rattly drivers on bassy freqs.) I also own Shure SE215's as a portable solution, which I find to be generally alright with it's strong mids, and thumping bass. The highs are average for me, failing to bring out detail sometimes, but they serve well as a beater pair with it's fun signature.
 
I find the sound to be hollow/dry in the midrange, and the spike within 9/10khz is also somewhat irritating, however the midrange is the most of my problems. EQ'ing it didn't give me much help, however that may be just because I don't equalise often, and I am not too good with it.
 
Other than that, I love the build quality and detail they bring forward. The lower mids may also be a tad too recessed for my liking, however.
 
I have it plugged it into a dated Panasonic Hifi system purposed for speakers (the "SA-HD52"), so I am uncertain if that is what is causing my issues.
 
I am seriously considering on switching these for Sennheiser HD600/650's, however other recommendations as to what I can do to help with this problem would be appreciated. I additionally considered in investing in a Maverick TubeMagic A1 coupled with a Matrix Mini-I Pro, but the sooner a solution (Since I still have about 30 days to return them through amazon) the better.
 
Here is my last.fm for additional headphone recommendations on the music that I listen to.
 
Thank you.

 

[billybob_jcv]

I am a bit skeptical of that amp's ability to properly drive the Beyers, but I really don't know and I can't say if a different amp would be any better or different. Have you tried them directly from you PC? I wouldn't expect that to be very good either, but it might at least be different. In general, I'm a believer that if you don't like the way the headphones sound, an amp probably won't help as much as different headphones will.

 

[superjawes]

Yeah, you might try an amp before you jump to the Sennheisers. After all, the HD600/650 will DEFINITELY require an amp (I don't have experience with the Beyers to know if they 100% need one), and speaker amps aren't necessarily going to be designed with high impedance loads in mind.

 

[visionaryBlend]

I am a bit skeptical of that amp's ability to properly drive the Beyers, but I really don't know and I can't say if a different amp would be any better or different. Have you tried them directly from you PC? I wouldn't expect that to be very good either, but it might at least be different. In general, I'm a believer that if you don't like the way the headphones sound, an amp probably won't help as much as different headphones will.

 
 

Yeah, you might try an amp before you jump to the Sennheisers. After all, the HD600/650 will DEFINITELY require an amp (I don't have experience with the Beyers to know if they 100% need one), and speaker amps aren't necessarily going to be designed with high impedance loads in mind.

I plugged my beyers into my Maximus VII Hero motherboard, it was able to drive it a decent amount, but I am unsure if it sounded any better (only done a little bit of comparison, the hifi system may have been better). Furthermore, I do not have much money to afford an additional amp/DAC. Unless tube amps can really help the midrange and warm down the highs, then I may go for the HD600/650, because looking at freq. response graphs it seems to solve those problems.
 
I also resorted to burn in w/ Pink Noise. I ran a 20 hour session, and another one is at progress as we speak. The sound changed a little bit, although it wasn't too noticeable, and I don't think it helped the mids.
 
However, these headphones are described as a bit veiled, will that be a large problem for the type of music I listen to and for my preferences in signature? (mainly many genres of electronica/hiphop/rap, but I tend to branch out with other artists.)

 

[Youth]

DT880 are suposed to have good mids so it might be because they need amplification.

 

[Shaffer]

[...]

I have it plugged it into a dated Panasonic Hifi system purposed for speakers (the "SA-HD52"), so I am uncertain if that is what is causing my issues [...]

The Panasonic you're using is absolute garbage. If you post it on any of the dozens of FB audio groups, folks will think you're pulling a joke. Sorry, someone had to tell you. Your DT880 are very revealing headphones that are not very easy to drive. You're hearing what lies downstream.

What are you using for source material?

 

[visionaryBlend]

The Panasonic you're using is absolute garbage. If you post it on any of the dozens of FB audio groups, folks will think you're pulling a joke. Sorry, someone had to tell you. Your DT880 are very revealing headphones that are not very easy to drive. You're hearing what lies downstream.

What are you using for source material?

Thank you for letting me know. I might consider investing in an O2 ODAC since it's not too expensive.
What do you mean? I have the system plugged via aux into my PC motherboard, and I use (mainly) 320 mp3's.
 
Incidentally, I tested a little bit with my motherboard which can amp headphones relatively well, and I still have the hollowness in the mids. This is probably all down to my personal taste and the 880's are not a headphone for me, which is why I am considering HD600 in the same price bracket.

 

[Me x3]

- DT880s are very neutral headphones, just a bit on the bright side. Coming from a 'fun' sound signature it can take quite a lot of time to become comfortable with their sound.
- DT880 250 Ohm are harder to drive than HD600 and HD650.
- Do not expect any night and day differences from solid state amps. Some tube amps can colour the sound quite a lot / add distortion so look there if you want to change your sound.
- Headphones like DT880 are very good for well recorded music, not that great for most hip hop, rap, pop, mainstream, etc.
 
Plug your DTs into your computer and try these samples:
http://www.hdtracks.com/alexis-cole-a-kiss-in-the-dark
http://www.hdtracks.com/sessions-from-the-17th-ward-binaural-134366
 
That's how they sound.
Add something like the O2 in the chain and you'll have a more refined treble and tighter bass, but essentially the same sound signature.
 
Best Luck!

 

[tomb]

 

The Panasonic you're using is absolute garbage. If you post it on any of the dozens of FB audio groups, folks will think you're pulling a joke. Sorry, someone had to tell you. Your DT880 are very revealing headphones that are not very easy to drive. You're hearing what lies downstream.

What are you using for source material?

Thank you for letting me know. I might consider investing in an O2 ODAC since it's not too expensive.
What do you mean? I have the system plugged via aux into my PC motherboard, and I use (mainly) 320 mp3's.

Onboard audio with PC motherboards are probably worse than your Panasonic stack's tape and tuner.

 
Top-level headphones (DT-880 is definitely in that class) are meant to wring out every bit of detail and nuance.  Combine that with a PC motherboard onboard audio and it's going to sound lifeless, if not outright lousy.
 
Here's a test: try plugging your Shure IEM's into the headphone output of your motherboard and see what it sounds like.  Further, what you mentioned about your Grado SR80's is a perfect symptom of clipping at lower frequencies.  The SR80 is known for needing more power and has a much better bass response than the SR60's.
 
As for DT-880's at 250 ohm, you're probably choking them with not enough voltage and a crappy source.  HD600/650's are not going to do any better until you clean up your source and amplification.  One reason people may suggest tube amps is not because of the better midrange and warmth, but because tubes typically swing with much higher voltage peaks than a solid-state amp (usually).

 

[Youth]

  - DT880s are very neutral headphones, just a bit on the bright side. Coming from a 'fun' sound signature it can take quite a lot of time to become comfortable with their sound.
- DT880 250 Ohm are harder to drive than HD600 and HD650.
- Do not expect any night and day differences from solid state amps. Some tube amps can colour the sound quite a lot / add distortion so look there if you want to change your sound.
- Headphones like DT880 are very good for well recorded music, not that great for most hip hop, rap, pop, mainstream, etc.
 
Plug your DTs into your computer and try these samples:
http://www.hdtracks.com/alexis-cole-a-kiss-in-the-dark
http://www.hdtracks.com/sessions-from-the-17th-ward-binaural-134366
 
That's how they sound.
Add something like the O2 in the chain and you'll have a more refined treble and tighter bass, but essentially the same sound signature.
 
Best Luck!

 
Because most of it is compressed, right? I've just learned about the Loudness War.

 

[visionaryBlend]

I am coming close to a conclusion.
I will most likely swap these out for HD600. I don't care about drawing out insane amounts of detail, if the HD600 performs similarly, and if it means sacrificing upper mids. The overall hollow nature of the headphone is extremely off-putting for me, and I will invest in an Amp and DAC in the future to complete the setup. I doubt that it's my amplifier and source that is causing the upper mids to be so visibly hollow, since other people complain about this nature on Head-Fi. I ran 40 hours of burn-in with pink noise, and nothing.
 
Apologies if I wasted some of your time, but I hear so much about the HD600 being as closest to perfection as it gets for it's price, and I have a 30 day return policy.

 

[Shaffer]

Thank you for letting me know. I might consider investing in an O2 ODAC since it's not too expensive.
What do you mean? I have the system plugged via aux into my PC motherboard, and I use (mainly) 320 mp3's.

Good sound starts with the source material. In essence, the media you choose to play, as in a CD, a LP, a file, etc. To my ears, 320 MP3s sound like stainless steel compared to the real thing, as in the actual physical media (god, I loathe that term). With a headphone like the DT880, this quality is magnified. BTW, I own DT880.

To sum up, you need a decent system - amplifier, DAC - and quality source material for these headphones to shine. Often folks buy higher quality headphones expecting the sound to be better, but the reality points to the opposite. The better the headphone, the more transparent and revealing. If the supporting gear and source material are not up to par, that's what one is going to hear.

 

[visionaryBlend]

Good sound starts with the source material. In essence, the media you choose to play, as in a CD, a LP, a file, etc. To my ears, 320 MP3s sound like stainless steel compared to the real thing, as in the actual physical media (god, I loathe that term). With a headphone like the DT880, this quality is magnified. BTW, I own DT880.

To sum up, you need a decent system - amplifier, DAC - and quality source material for these headphones to shine. Often folks buy higher quality headphones expecting the sound to be better, but the reality points to the opposite. The better the headphone, the more transparent and revealing. If the supporting gear and source material are not up to par, that's what one is going to hear.

So you are saying that FLAC files are the way to go when I move up from the £100 range of headphones, due to transparency being brought out more and more? That seems fair enough.
 
Either way, I will give my DT880's a few more days and return them for the 600's. If they sound inferior, I am getting my 880's back. I am comparing both to a poor amp, so I should be giving both headphones a relatively fair chance.

 

[Shaffer]

So you are saying that FLAC files are the way to go when I move up from the £100 range of headphones, due to transparency being brought out more and more? That seems fair enough.

Coincidentally, I was looking at HDDs last night. A 3TB HDD can be had for ~$100. That holds a lot of lossless files

Either way, I will give my DT880's a few more days and return them for the 600's. If they sound inferior, I am getting my 880's back. I am comparing both to a poor amp, so I should be giving both headphones a relatively fair chance.

The HD600, I own them, may have a more pleasing tonal balance. This being said, they're capable of almost startling resolution with proper supporting gear. Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Edit: typo

 

[Me x3]

   
Because most of it is compressed, right? I've just learned about the Loudness War.

It's a very interesting topic.
 
Here you have a huge DR database (Over 75.000 albums)
http://dr.loudness-war.info/