Denon AH-D5000 owners
Apr 16, 2008 at 4:31 AM Post #16 of 36

Hunted Charlie

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Just got mine a few days ago.

My setup will be, once my EMU 0202 arrives:

Apple Lossless --> iTunes --> MacBook --> EMU 0202 --> Pocket Amp 2 Version 2 --> Denon D5000

I think it's rather obvious that the amp in there is sort of the weak link. The quality sounds pretty good, but it is a portable amp (I also use it for my portable setup) and that's noticeable. So I'm hoping to buy a dedicated amp for home.

I've heard tube amps really work well with the Denon D5000, enhancing the "warm" feel. Anybody tried a tube amp with them? Reviews? How much does changing the amp enhance the sound quality on them? How about the DAC?
 
Apr 16, 2008 at 1:46 PM Post #17 of 36

Gradofan2

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunted Charlie /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I've heard tube amps really work well with the Denon D5000, enhancing the "warm" feel. Anybody tried a tube amp with them? Reviews? How much does changing the amp enhance the sound quality on them? How about the DAC?


I've tried the D5000s with the DV332 tube amp, as well as the Graham Slee Solo, and Shellbrook MaxiMoy portable SS amps.

While my D5000s are still in the "burn in" phase (at about 100 hrs), the SS amps sound much better with them than the DV332... and... I suspect other SS amps control them even better (i.e. say, the GS-1, and the Rudistor amps).

Although, I suspect better tube amps (e.g. the SP Extreme, etc.) may sound better with them than my DV332 - I've not heard those together.

But... you should note that... the "Father of the D5000" on this forum, who has almost single-handedly created the "stampede" to the D5000s (or... lead us all to the "promised land") here... drives them with SS amps like the Rudistor RPX-33 - $2000+ amps - some pretty "princely sums."

And... they report that they finally achieved "their sound" with them (or... "beheld the kingdom of heaven"), only after they've completed the "Markl Mods," and, perhaps, even a new cable ("after wandering 40 years in the wilderness finally seeing the light") - reporting that the clarity of their sound finally rivals the R-10s, as their overwhelming bass is finally brought under control. Some even proclaim, their sound is better than the K1000s and other noteworthy phones.

Now those are some pretty amazing claims... which are a bit difficult to accept... based on their "right-out-of-the-box" sound. And to believe them is somewhat akin to believing that "this penny stock will make you a multi-millionaire."

Based on my experience with them to this point... I guess you could place me as still being in the "skeptics" camp. Or... at least... somewhat likely unwilling to make the additional investments in the mods, cables, and amps required to finally "realize" their total transformation from "moth to butterfly" or "poor stepsister into a princess." At this stage of their burn-in... they still have yet to impress me, as having the potential to so greatly surpass the great sound of the HD580/600s, AD2000s, or RS-1s... as to justify those significant additional "princely sums."

Now... I'm not "sayin' they won't, or can't... "I'm just sayin'" you have to be a "true believer" to "enter the kingdom of heaven." As for me... I guess you could say I'm still a "doubting Thomas," who may be unwilling to "make the leap of faith."

I guess that may be why... I may never become a "multi-millionaire," or "behold the kingdom of heaven" - although I hope to.
 
Apr 16, 2008 at 2:00 PM Post #18 of 36

Cool_Torpedo

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LOL, nice post Gradofan2
smily_headphones1.gif


IMHO the D5000 are good cans even stock for their price, with some nice features and also some flaws. The mods and a good amp help a lot to take a better performance from them.
I won't claim they sound better than the R10, not even that they're close. Bass-light R10 are a class on their own regarding tonal accuracy, resolution and musicallity. What they do, they do extremely well, but they lack some bass depth and slam.
The D5000 give you a glimpse of what R10 provide, and deliver the deep and slammy bass the R10s lack. Overall deciding what do you like better depends on your own taste and most listened musical styles. I'm sure a hard rock lover could live with the D5000, wouldn't like the R10 at all, and would be quite happy with some Grado R2. For the expense, he'd better go for Grados than anything else.
Are the D5000 worth the expense of modding them, getting a good amp and maybe rewiring? I don't know, but ask a Senn 600/650 if going balanced with them was worth the recabling cost and having to buy a balanced amp. It's more or less the same thing. When the sound of some cans "touch" you in some aspects, you know that having that sound improved and fine-tuned, might be your ticket to sonic bliss. But it's just for you and the people sharing your taste and sonic preferences.

Rgrds
 
Apr 16, 2008 at 6:55 PM Post #19 of 36

orkney

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I've tried the D5000s with the DV332 tube amp, as well as the Graham Slee Solo, and Shellbrook MaxiMoy portable SS amps.

While my D5000s are still in the "burn in" phase (at about 100 hrs), the SS amps sound much better with them than the DV332... and... I suspect other SS amps control them even better (i.e. say, the GS-1, and the Rudistor amps).

Although, I suspect better tube amps (e.g. the SP Extreme, etc.) may sound better with them than my DV332 - I've not heard those together.

But... you should note that... the "Father of the D5000" on this forum, who has almost single-handedly created the "stampede" to the D5000s (or... lead us all to the "promised land") here... drives them with SS amps like the Rudistor RPX-33 - $2000+ amps - some pretty "princely sums."

And... they report that they finally achieved "their sound" with them (or... "beheld the kingdom of heaven"), only after they've completed the "Markl Mods," and, perhaps, even a new cable ("after wandering 40 years in the wilderness finally seeing the light") - reporting that the clarity of their sound finally rivals the R-10s, as their overwhelming bass is finally brought under control. Some even proclaim, their sound is better than the K1000s and other noteworthy phones.

Now those are some pretty amazing claims... which are a bit difficult to accept... based on their "right-out-of-the-box" sound. And to believe them is somewhat akin to believing that "this penny stock will make you a multi-millionaire."

Based on my experience with them to this point... I guess you could place me as still being in the "skeptics" camp. Or... at least... somewhat likely unwilling to make the additional investments in the mods, cables, and amps required to finally "realize" their total transformation from "moth to butterfly" or "poor stepsister into a princess." At this stage of their burn-in... they still have yet to impress me, as having the potential to so greatly surpass the great sound of the HD580/600s, AD2000s, or RS-1s... as to justify those significant additional "princely sums."

Now... I'm not "sayin' they won't, or can't... "I'm just sayin'" you have to be a "true believer" to "enter the kingdom of heaven." As for me... I guess you could say I'm still a "doubting Thomas," who may be unwilling to "make the leap of faith."

I guess that may be why... I may never become a "multi-millionaire," or "behold the kingdome of heaven" - although I hope to.



Good post! I have since moved on to other cans but the D5000s worked very well out of the low-Z output on the Opera and superbly with the MAD Ear, again out of the low-Z output. In both cases clarity was preserved while low bass well-controlled. I never found the D5000s to be "recessed" in the mids but feel that they are harder to drive in practice than is perhaps assumed and that a clean and powerful amp is required to get the best out of 'em -- not all of these will be uber-expensive, I expect, though they sounded lousy with my old Perreaux, which again suggests that lots of clean power and not euphonic warmth may be the way to go with these cans.

best,

o
 
Apr 16, 2008 at 10:00 PM Post #21 of 36

daveDerek

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
And... they report that they finally achieved "their sound" with them (or... "beheld the kingdom of heaven"), only after they've completed the "Markl Mods," and, perhaps, even a new cable ("after wandering 40 years in the wilderness finally seeing the light") - reporting that the clarity of their sound finally rivals the R-10s, as their overwhelming bass is finally brought under control. Some even proclaim, their sound is better than the K1000s and other noteworthy phones.


i'm hoping that nikongod jumps in here as he has modded d5ks, as well as r10s, k1ks, hp2s, early rs-1s, and a few other choice phones currently and has perviously owned some other fine cans including a variety of stax. he also has some interesting amps including a singlepower supra. i'm pretty sure that, while he likes his denons a lot, he doesn't prefer them to the aforementioned cans.
i own some recabled d2ks (as well as many of the well regarded around here cans) and they are very nice, but they aren't the best things going. they're worth the money but they aren't the world's finest phone imo.
 
Apr 18, 2008 at 1:26 AM Post #23 of 36

rdavid

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Cool_Torpedo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
LOL, nice post Gradofan2
smily_headphones1.gif

Are the D5000 worth the expense of modding them, getting a good amp and maybe rewiring? .



The Denon D5000s were my favorite headphones until I accidently bought
the W5000s. I do not seem to have a fit problem, and these showed me
that the D5000 does have more bass than I wanted.

In an attempt to salvage the D5000s, I sent them (and money) to Markl.
They are back.

I find now that the W5000 has less bass than I want. The modded D5000
is, for me, outstanding, and is getting almost all my headtime.

By the way, Markl is a pleasure to do business with.
 
May 1, 2008 at 3:38 AM Post #24 of 36

nikongod

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
But... you should note that... the "Father of the D5000" on this forum, who has almost single-handedly created the "stampede" to the D5000s (or... lead us all to the "promised land") here... drives them with SS amps like the Rudistor RPX-33 - $2000+ amps - some pretty "princely sums."


you should note his listening levels...

the amp which he commented on clipping was my mpx3. at the time of review it had black gate cathode caps and premium resistors EXCLUSIVELY after the power filter. it would clip, as any amp will eventually. I actually tried it with a pair of grados to see when it would happen. the grados were sitting on my chair, and i turned the volume up. before i got the amp to clip (and i did, it happens) i thought of building a Tri-amped speaker system using a SINGLE pair of grado drivers for mids driven by the MPX3. they were functional as loudspeakers.
Quote:

And... they report that they finally achieved "their sound" with them (or... "beheld the kingdom of heaven"), only after they've completed the "Markl Mods," and, perhaps, even a new cable ("after wandering 40 years in the wilderness finally seeing the light") - reporting that the clarity of their sound finally rivals the R-10s, as their overwhelming bass is finally brought under control. Some even proclaim, their sound is better than the K1000s and other noteworthy phones.


heres what to expect:
The bass does not get much tamer as the headphones burn in. perhaps my opinion is based on the fact that i bought them used and they were already burnt in, but the bass at the end of the tunnel is as loose and uncontrolled as you hear it. As part of my D5000 burn-in process was testing when my SUPRA (with high voltage option) would clip, this was right around the time of markl's coments ont eh underpoweredness of tube amps. eventually the supra does clip, although at a much higher volume than the MPX3 did. The d5000 drivers should be placed in a nice horn, my mom thought they sounded good from outside the room. I played the headphones at above my average listening levels for a couple days on end, and overnight at VERY far above average levels.

based on my (aggressive) burn-in methods, the bass never gets tamer unless you do the the markl mods which do EXCEPTIONALLY well for controlling the bass and pretty much everything. i would HIGHLY recommend sending the phones off to markl, or if your DIY handy doing it yourself.

dave and cool_torpedo pretty much hit the nail on the headphone for my opinions. My D5000 at the moment is traveling to can-jam here is the list of mods:
stuffed pads
blue-tac'd drivers (will be replaced with dynomat when the heapdhones get back)
stuffed cups (very lightly with carded lambs wool)
LIGHTLY stuffed "port" this was spurred by the fact that the R10 does this...
i have not dynomatted my D5000, but want to a LITTLE bit.

The D5000 do not replace the K1000 when the k1k is properly amped.
The R10 STILL takes the D5000 and looks down on it. For 10 to 15 as much money it better.

The strength of the markl D5000 is that it has an overall coherent sound. Everything fits together and functions as a system. I think that its "sonnic faults" are largely overshadowed by this fact. It is not like some other headphones where the bass came from a hatchback civic sitting at a stoplight, the mids from an opera singer in the shower, and the highs from a metalshop that ran out of oil: 3 worthless sounds combined to make something even worse still (as if that was possible.) all of the sounds coming from the D5000 fit together properly.

I think the R10 and the D5000 both share in the "good fit of all sonic parts" category, but the R10 romps on the D5000 as far as final polish goes. this is where the moded D5000 gets you close to the R10.
 
May 1, 2008 at 5:37 AM Post #26 of 36

Solan

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Anyone tried D5000 out of an Apogee mini-DAC?
 
May 1, 2008 at 9:52 AM Post #27 of 36

Cool_Torpedo

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Hi mates,

I can't specifically reply reporting my own experience to Solan and Siddiquehanif, but for what I've been trying with my modded D5000, I'd say they're very resolutive and rather demanding cans.

When powered from low power outputs like the HPout of a TV set, iPod, computer's soundcard, HPout of a CD player, etc. they offer just "decent" sound, but highs get harsher and bass is not as taut and precise as it should be, losing good timbre, which the cans are able to deliver. And that's not driving them hard, just listening at low to normal levels.
Of those devices the only one capable of loud sound is the CDP-X707-ES headphone output, and it delivers too bright highs for my taste. It sounds much better using its line-out into the Rudi.

The Apogee as a DAC would sound nice, I guess from my brief experience with it feeding a tube amp for speakers, but I don't know if its headphone out would have enough power to deliver good sound without clipping.
I have no experience at all with the Pico, so my opinion is just a wild guess. I think it would have enough power for the D5000, but its sound signature might be a bit in the lean and analytical side of things, and the D5000 would tell you.

Rgrds
 
May 1, 2008 at 12:01 PM Post #28 of 36

Gradofan2

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Quote:

Originally Posted by siddiquehanif /img/forum/go_quote.gif
hi,

I have the pico and AD2000 using laptop as source. Now i am considering to trade my AD2000 with D5000 but dont know how it will sound. Any body have the experience pairing the pico with D5000? How is the synergy?

thanks.



The AD2000s are more efficient phones, and much easier to drive. They also sound faster, brighter, much tighter and have more PRAT, overall. If you like their, somewhat "gradoish" sound, you may not be as pleased with the darker, bass heavy sound of the D5000s (unless you apply the "Markl Mods"). Think... RS-1's (AD2000s) compared to HD650s (D5000s).
 
May 1, 2008 at 2:40 PM Post #29 of 36

Kabeer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by siddiquehanif /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I have the pico and AD2000 using laptop as source. Now i am considering to trade my AD2000 with D5000 but dont know how it will sound. Any body have the experience pairing the pico with D5000? How is the synergy?


I personally havent tried it yet (Pico is on pre-order). But Skylab and HeadphoneAddict both commented that the D5000/2000 had a positive synergy with the pico, specifically when comparing to other portable amps.
 

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