[nsge]

Hello.
What's difference between DAC, AMP and PreAMP?
I want to buy ATH-M50X in future or DT990 600Ohm.
What's best combo in this price?
I'll be using headphones with my PC not CD player etc etc.
 
My mobo: Z170A G43-Plus (Audio socks) and my current soundcard is SoundBlaster Omni 5.1 (Cuz I had laptop and bought PC maybe 2 months ago).
 
Please help me cuz im newbie and need to know what's difference between them and what's best in this price. I can pay more but not like 2x more than 300$ im not that rich. Also I don't need them now. DAC or AMP in 3/4 months and then AMP or DAC 1/2 year later. So what's best for now? Also can I use SB Omni 5.1 as DAC or not? I heard it has built-in AMP (600 Ohm?). So don't know if it works. Please help newbie :/

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

What's difference between DAC, AMP and PreAMP?

I want to buy ATH-M50X in future or DT990 600Ohm.

What's best combo in this price?

I'll be using headphones with my PC not CD player etc etc.

 

My mobo: Z170A G43-Plus (Audio socks) and my current soundcard is SoundBlaster Omni 5.1 (Cuz I had laptop and bought PC maybe 2 months ago).

 

Please help me cuz im newbie and need to know what's difference between them and what's best in this price. I can pay more but not like 2x more than 300$ im not that rich. Also I don't need them now. DAC or AMP in 3/4 months and then AMP or DAC 1/2 year later. So what's best for now? Also can I use SB Omni 5.1 as DAC or not? I heard it has built-in AMP (600 Ohm?). So don't know if it works. Please help newbie :/

 

DAC is Digital to Analogue Converter. It will take a digital signal in 110001001010101001100101001011001010101100001001110 that you won't be able to listen to (other than if you were Tank, you're on the Nebuchadnezzar, and the Machines are hunting you) and then convert it to an analogue electrical signal that will then be amplified by the amplifier into a stronger signal capable of moving a transducer - speaker or headphone - which needs to move in order to move air in turn and create sound that you can hear.

 

A preamp is basically what happens before the amplification stage, typically a way to control the voltage of the input signal and therefore the overall volume. Technically any headphone amplifier or an integrated amplifier has a preamplifier in it, but what they all do is feed into the amplifier stage. What some have is a preamplifier output so you can send the signal that you control with that potentiometer (ie the volume knob) to a separate amplifier which doesn't have a preamp. Like pure power amps in speaker amps, or studio monitors that have only gain controls and they're independent on each side (so you set the gain and then all adjustments later on will be on the preamp you can easily reach).

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 

Also can I use SB Omni 5.1 as DAC or not? I heard it has built-in AMP (600 Ohm?). 

 

That doesn't actually mean anything. Manufacturers will claim that their amp can drive 16ohms to 600ohms but you have no idea if it has a high output impedance (which is a problem for low impedance loads) or how much distortion there is vs power at very high impedance. 

 

That would be like if a car manufacturer claimed you can use their 1.6liter engine on anything from a bike to a pick up truck, without telling you how impractical it would be to mount that large engine on a bike and cause issues with weight distribution (too far forward you wheelie all the time given all the torque, or you can barely sit on the bike) or it can barely pull the pick up truck empty much less with cargo on the bed.
 
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

I want to buy ATH-M50X in future or DT990 600Ohm.

What's best combo in this price?

I'll be using headphones with my PC not CD player etc etc.

 

My mobo: Z170A G43-Plus (Audio socks) and my current soundcard is SoundBlaster Omni 5.1 (Cuz I had laptop and bought PC maybe 2 months ago).

 

Please help me cuz im newbie and need to know what's difference between them and what's best in this price. I can pay more but not like 2x more than 300$ im not that rich. Also I don't need them now. DAC or AMP in 3/4 months and then AMP or DAC 1/2 year later. 

 

Get the DT990 and skip the M50X. High impedance with high sensitivity is at least still easier to drive (especially on high gain mode on these soundcards) than having to deal with a lower impedance that will either sound like a tin can with inarticulate bass or sound like a tsunami of molasses.
 
Skip the DAC-HPamp for now, and then later buy one that has SPDIF inputs. That way you can hook it up using the soundcard, and then the DSP on the soundcard can be utilized rather than bypassed. Either you can enjoy the DT990 better with whateveer amp you buy or buy one that will also drive lower impedance if not also lower sensitivity headphones.

 

[nsge]

 

 

DAC is Digital to Analogue Converter. It will take a digital signal in 110001001010101001100101001011001010101100001001110 that you won't be able to listen to (other than if you were Tank, you're on the Nebuchadnezzar, and the Machines are hunting you) and then convert it to an analogue electrical signal that will then be amplified by the amplifier into a stronger signal capable of moving a transducer - speaker or headphone - which needs to move in order to move air in turn and create sound that you can hear.

 

A preamp is basically what happens before the amplification stage, typically a way to control the voltage of the input signal and therefore the overall volume. Technically any headphone amplifier or an integrated amplifier has a preamplifier in it, but what they all do is feed into the amplifier stage. What some have is a preamplifier output so you can send the signal that you control with that potentiometer (ie the volume knob) to a separate amplifier which doesn't have a preamp. Like pure power amps in speaker amps, or studio monitors that have only gain controls and they're independent on each side (so you set the gain and then all adjustments later on will be on the preamp you can easily reach).

 

 

That doesn't actually mean anything. Manufacturers will claim that their amp can drive 16ohms to 600ohms but you have no idea if it has a high output impedance (which is a problem for low impedance loads) or how much distortion there is vs power at very high impedance. 

 

That would be like if a car manufacturer claimed you can use their 1.6liter engine on anything from a bike to a pick up truck, without telling you how impractical it would be to mount that large engine on a bike and cause issues with weight distribution (too far forward you wheelie all the time given all the torque, or you can barely sit on the bike) or it can barely pull the pick up truck empty much less with cargo on the bed.
 
 

 

Get the DT990 and skip the M50X. High impedance with high sensitivity is at least still easier to drive (especially on high gain mode on these soundcards) than having to deal with a lower impedance that will either sound like a tin can with inarticulate bass or sound like a tsunami of molasses.
 
Skip the DAC-HPamp for now, and then later buy one that has SPDIF inputs. That way you can hook it up using the soundcard, and then the DSP on the soundcard can be utilized rather than bypassed. Either you can enjoy the DT990 better with whateveer amp you buy or buy one that will also drive lower impedance if not also lower sensitivity headphones.

 
So let's say I bought DT990 600Ohm...
I need to buy AMP or DAC then? How to connect it with my motherboard? (or to SB omni 5.1)
Can I use SB Omni 5.1 as DAC or something? It has way better sound than soundcard on my mobo and it has SPDIF too just like my motherboard.
 
What would you recommend to me for ~300$? Buy DT990.
In one review someone used this DACs: Audio In Motion SC808, Aune S16, Aune T1 MK II, Matrix Quattro DAC, NuForce DAC-80, NuForce Icon HDP,
http://www.audiofanatyk.pl/recenzja-beyerdynamic-dt990-edition-600-ohm/
 
And he said that SC808 for price was best with those headphones.
Btw. Is DT990s cable detachable? Do you know any headphones as good as DT990 600Ohm with detachable cable? And what's difference between PRO vs Edition vs 600/250/80?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

So let's say I bought DT990 600Ohm...

I need to buy AMP or DAC then?

 

You do not absolutely need a DAC. I already explained this. Your soundcard has a high gain mode that for the most part will likely have less trouble on the DT990 high impedance version than have its high output impedance have issues with a low impedance headphone.

 

It is not the best either but it's something you can use while you're saving up for a significant upgrade.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 

How to connect it with my motherboard? (or to SB omni 5.1)

Can I use SB Omni 5.1 as DAC or something? It has way better sound than soundcard on my mobo and it has SPDIF too just like my motherboard.

 

This is another reason, which I also explained in my previous post. Less expenive DAC-HPamps tend to favor USB, and if you get the few that do have SPDIF, usually the amp sections aren't all that capable.

 

If you get a really good DAC-HPamp with SPDIF then not only are you getting a good DAC and a good headphone amplifier, you can utilize the soundcard's DSP chip. Hook it up via SPDIF from the soundcard, and all the processing done by the DSP will affect the digital signal that the DAC receives.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsge /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 

In one review someone used this DACs: Audio In Motion SC808, Aune S16, Aune T1 MK II, Matrix Quattro DAC, NuForce DAC-80, NuForce Icon HDP,
http://www.audiofanatyk.pl/recenzja-beyerdynamic-dt990-edition-600-ohm/

 

And he said that SC808 for price was best with those headphones.

 

Google translate isn't really working for me right now but you're still better off saving up.  Not sure how he hooked them up since I can't read it and all, but if he's using the soundcard with its DSP and then he can't send an SPDIF signal to the DAC-HPamps ,then the soundcard can do better when using its DSP. Also among those listed many are USB input only. 

 

Oh and the HDP is phased out, so they're kind of hard to find new and even used. Problem with the HDP though is that I was getting overexcursions on my HD600 driven by the HDP. it wasn't even that loud - I was listening at around 11am position on the dial. That suggests some kind of bass boost and then the amp apart from being Class A isn't really all that good.

 

 

 

  Btw. Is DT990s cable detachable? 

 
As far as I know, it isn't.
 

  Do you know any headphones as good as DT990 600Ohm with detachable cable?

 
Better. HD600. That said, it depends on whether you'd prefer the louder upper bass and treble on the DT990 vs the smoother response curve on the HD600.
 
 

 
And what's difference between PRO vs Edition vs 600/250/80?

 
There are small variances in response but overall it's mostly just the impedance.

 

[Albion5275]

Good info, thanks.

 

[nsge]

 

 

You do not absolutely need a DAC. I already explained this. Your soundcard has a high gain mode that for the most part will likely have less trouble on the DT990 high impedance version than have its high output impedance have issues with a low impedance headphone.

 

It is not the best either but it's something you can use while you're saving up for a significant upgrade.

 

 

This is another reason, which I also explained in my previous post. Less expenive DAC-HPamps tend to favor USB, and if you get the few that do have SPDIF, usually the amp sections aren't all that capable.

 

If you get a really good DAC-HPamp with SPDIF then not only are you getting a good DAC and a good headphone amplifier, you can utilize the soundcard's DSP chip. Hook it up via SPDIF from the soundcard, and all the processing done by the DSP will affect the digital signal that the DAC receives.

 

 

 

Google translate isn't really working for me right now but you're still better off saving up.  Not sure how he hooked them up since I can't read it and all, but if he's using the soundcard with its DSP and then he can't send an SPDIF signal to the DAC-HPamps ,then the soundcard can do better when using its DSP. Also among those listed many are USB input only. 

 

Oh and the HDP is phased out, so they're kind of hard to find new and even used. Problem with the HDP though is that I was getting overexcursions on my HD600 driven by the HDP. it wasn't even that loud - I was listening at around 11am position on the dial. That suggests some kind of bass boost and then the amp apart from being Class A isn't really all that good.

 

 

 
 
As far as I know, it isn't.
 
 
Better. HD600. That said, it depends on whether you'd prefer the louder upper bass and treble on the DT990 vs the smoother response curve on the HD600.
 
 
 
There are small variances in response but overall it's mostly just the impedance.

He was using only one DAC then plug headphones to other DAC etc. Not all of them at the same time if u meant that.
HD600 is "little" out of my budget.
 
So for know you say that I need to connect my motherboard soundcard to my USB soundcard via SPDIF? Or I think wrong?
Btw. Thanks for lecturing ! Finally learned a lot.

 

[nsge]

REF

 

[ProtegeManiac]

  He was using only one DAC then plug headphones to other DAC etc. Not all of them at the same time if u meant that.

 
No, what I meant was you do not need to buy one for now. You can use the audio circuit in your motherboard. That has a DAC chip in it. Save up for a much better upgrade.
 

  So for know you say that I need to connect my motherboard soundcard to my USB soundcard via SPDIF? Or I think wrong?

 
Dead wrong - you can't hook up a motherboard soundcard to a USB soundcard. Whether you have a good built-in DSP on the mobo or you have a soundcard on an expansion slot, if you use USB, you will bypass both.

The only way to use USB, a soundcard, and a DAC is if it's a USB soundcard, which then allows for using its DSP chip to process the signal and send out an SPDIF digital signal to the DAC.