[Cannabizzz776n99]

Maybe DT-150?

 

[demoNMaCHiN3]

you may also want to check out the dt990s.

 

[denl82]

Sorry, I didn't want to start a new thread, cuz I'm in the same boat as Squirsier. I have the HP-M1000 fon. For what I listen to (electronic/drum and bass), the bass is very tight, detailed, and extended. The highs are also good too, being extended and sweet. But tonight I did some heavy equalizing and tweaking using my x-fi, and found out that these cans, as good as they are, are far from perfect! Here's what my equalizer now looks like:

31 hz 10.1 db
62 hz 3.8 db
125 hz 6.5 db
250 hz 5.4 db
500 hz 9.5 db
1k hz 10.8 db
2k hz 8.3 db
4k hz 6.7 db
8k hz 2.7 db
16k hz 6.3 db

and the overall db level@ -8.9 db. Any louder than that and things start to sound congested.

As you can see, I bumped up the mids section quite a bit. The overall sound quality is now fantastic, with very crisp highs, and "sharper" mids(or tighter mids it sounds like). The mids are also a lot more upfront. My question is, is it my source(x-fi) that is the cause of the problem when not being heavily equalized and tweaked? Or is it the headphone that is lacking? I'm guessing it may be the source, cuz if my x-fi sounded good stock, then the M1000 would sound good right away. But then again, my old dt880's needed absolutely no equalizing to sound great, except needing a little more bass impact and extension.

If it's not my source, (and here's why I'm posting here), what headphone should I be looking at? I've considered the dt990'05(heard the bass is decent, while the mids are slightly recessed--and I NO longer want sub par mids), the dt880 again(with a better source/amp to bring out more bass impact and extension suitable for electronica), ultrasone 750/2500(read of really great bass on the 750, but slightly recessed mids. And I even was told the 2500 has even more laid back mids. Both of these cans have seem to have weird soundstages that don't have good background depth due to s-logic, and not good enough height and width, compared to the dt880s I guess). I also looked at the d2000, but the general impression I get from reading about them is they bring nothing exceptional to the table, unlike the dt880s with their soundstage, and my M1000 with their bass.

It'll be a few months before I can plunge for a new fon, but I guess my budget after taking care of necessities would be around $300-400. I would love to know if there is something out there for me

 

[Mr_Junesequa]

Recabling ur dt770 or JVC will bring the mids up.

Is the JVC that good in terms of highs? Is it a large headphone? how does the size compare to the d1001 or dt770?

 

[denl82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Junesequa /img/forum/go_quote.gif Recabling ur dt770 or JVC will bring the mids up. Is the JVC that good in terms of highs? Is it a large headphone? how does the size compare to the d1001 or dt770?

Thanks Mr Junesequa. I've looked at the recabled(and also woodied) dt770's through these forums, and while it seems that the mids are brought upfront by the modding, the bass doesn't seem to shoot off into "awesomeness" as far as tightness and extension goes(well tbh, haven't read much about the effects of modding on the dt770's bass extension). But I have thought of recabling the JVC's, just not sure how much of an improvement recabling will bring. And yea, the M1000's highs are excellent imo, being on par with the dt880's without doing an a/b to discern any subtle differences. One of the best parts is I can put my x-fi's "crystalizer" on maximum and not experience any harshness the dt880s displayed when crystalizer was on a lower setting.

The JVC's earcups seem smaller than the dt770's earcups, but not sure about the d1001. It may or may not be smaller because it has an oval shape, rather than a round shape of the dt770s=]

*edit* Oh yea, the dt880s highs are a lot more sparkly than the m1000's. Both are sparkly though.

 

[Wilashort]

The bass in the DT990 is not 'Decent'; is great. Excellent quality (naturalness), speed, extension (it got deeper than your DT880 and is stronger in that extension (more rumble in lower bass frecuencies), slam, Good quantity (Never get boomy if the record isn't/has boomy bass), texture, etc).
Ah, the crystalizer and a right amount of CMSS3D, helps the mids (add more air and liveliness). The crystalizer add punch to the bass (about a 25% more) and sparklyness to the highs.
The mids aren't recessed at all, are the upper mids that are something laidback (something that i don't like with the music that i like most...)
In other hand, according to that you said about EQ. If you use that lot of EQ (including the crystalizer) then is your heaphone that is lacking, specially in bass and mids.
Ah, and i agree with you about the D2000, not offering something exceptional.
As i said above, the kenwoods can be a great alternative (and a upgrade to your JVC M1000 headphones, which i put the eye some time ago).
Quote:

Originally Posted by denl82 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sorry, I didn't want to start ational new thread, cuz I'm in the same boat as Squirsier. I have the HP-M1000 fon. For what I listen to (electronic/drum and bass), the bass is very tight, detailed, and extended. The highs are also good too, being extended and sweet. But tonight I did some heavy equalizing and tweaking using my x-fi, and found out that these cans, as good as they are, are far from perfect! Here's what my equalizer now looks like: 31 hz 10.1 db 62 hz 3.8 db 125 hz 6.5 db 250 hz 5.4 db 500 hz 9.5 db 1k hz 10.8 db 2k hz 8.3 db 4k hz 6.7 db 8k hz 2.7 db 16k hz 6.3 db and the overall db level@ -8.9 db. Any louder than that and things start to sound congested. As you can see, I bumped up the mids section quite a bit. The overall sound quality is now fantastic, with very crisp highs, and "sharper" mids(or tighter mids it sounds like). The mids are also a lot more upfront. My question is, is it my source(x-fi) that is the cause of the problem when not being heavily equalized and tweaked? Or is it the headphone that is lacking? I'm guessing it may be the source, cuz if my x-fi sounded good stock, then the M1000 would sound good right away. But then again, my old dt880's needed absolutely no equalizing to sound great, except needing a little more bass impact and extension. If it's not my source, (and here's why I'm posting here), what headphone should I be looking at? I've considered the dt990'05(heard the bass is decent, while the mids are slightly recessed--and I NO longer want sub par mids), the dt880 again(with a better source/amp to bring out more bass impact and extension suitable for electronica), ultrasone 750/2500(read of really great bass on the 750, but slightly recessed mids. And I even was told the 2500 has even more laid back mids. Both of these cans have seem to have weird soundstages that don't have good background depth due to s-logic, and not good enough height and width, compared to the dt880s I guess). I also looked at the d2000, but the general impression I get from reading about them is they bring nothing exceptional to the table, unlike the dt880s with their soundstage, and my M1000 with their bass. It'll be a few months before I can plunge for a new fon, but I guess my budget after taking care of necessities would be around $300-400. I would love to know if there is something out there for me

 

[denl82]

Thanks for your help Wilashort

The thing that put me off about the dt990's were the mix opinions on them that can sometimes lead to confusion, without hearing one with my own ears! For instance, one review by someone who's listening skillz I trust says the bass is great. Another person told me that while it's good, it's bested by the Pro 750 handily. In the end, I want the soundstage of the dt990's, but the supposed bass of the pro 750, so it would not be a step down from the M1000's bass performance. And don't get me wrong, the M1000 is a great headphone, the best I've owned for the music I listen to.

I did some further a/b'ing between those equalizer settings and a flat eq. setting, and I came to understand what JVC was aiming at when placing the mids to where they were. The sound overall is a lot more calmer, leading to a less fatiguing listen, and the soundstage is wider. So in itself, the stock sound of the X-fi/M1000 combo isn't bad, but just for different tastes.

When I had the dt880's, I found everything to be perfect, except for the bass amount, impact, and to a lesser degree, extension. When I turned up the bass on my x-fi or receiver, the bass would smother the air in the soundstage, something I just didn't like. If I can find a fon that has plenty of bass without losing any air, or a source/amp that would somehow bring out the dt880's bass while keeping it well intergrated with the rest of the sound, that would be sweet. As for now, I'm waiting for more detailed reviews on the new Kenwood headphone. It sounds like it has potential.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilashort /img/forum/go_quote.gif The bass in the DT990 is not 'Decent'; is great. Excellent quality (naturalness), speed, extension (it got deeper than your DT880 and is stronger in that extension (more rumble in lower bass frecuencies), slam, Good quantity (Never get boomy if the record isn't/has boomy bass), texture, etc). Ah, the crystalizer and a right amount of CMSS3D, helps the mids (add more air and liveliness). The crystalizer add punch to the bass (about a 25% more) and sparklyness to the highs. The mids aren't recessed at all, are the upper mids that are something laidback (something that i don't like with the music that i like most...) In other hand, according to that you said about EQ. If you use that lot of EQ (including the crystalizer) then is your heaphone that is lacking, specially in bass and mids. Ah, and i agree with you about the D2000, not offering something exceptional. As i said above, the kenwoods can be a great alternative (and a upgrade to your JVC M1000 headphones, which i put the eye some time ago).

 

[wavoman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by denl82 /img/forum/go_quote.gif it's bested by the Pro 750 handily. ... When I had the dt880's, I found everything to be perfect, except for the bass amount, impact, and to a lesser degree, extension

I have Pro 750's re-cabled by Drew at moon-audio with split-entry Silver Dragons, and I drive them with a Predator (just like the OP specified). Ultrasone's have a "sound", and if you like it, you will find this is one of the best closed-can configs you can buy (Ed 9's would be better I suppose). People at the NJ meet were astounded (unless they were Ultrasone sound haters).

I also have the beyer DT880's, the new consumer 600-0hm "MANUFAKTUR" version, and they are sensational! They correct IMO all the problems with the standard DT880's you mention. I have 250-Ohm pro DT880's too, and the A/B tells all.

Hope this helps!

 

[Wilashort]

Ok, of nothing.
In other hand, i don't think that the Pro 750 bass bested the DT990 for much (can be slightly technically superior (a little bit deeper/faster)). It can got a little deeper, but it isn't stronger overall, except and maybe the lowest bass.
In other hand, yes; the M1000 is a good headphone (i read your review twice and others two).
The DT990 is a diagonal upgrade (not a sidestep or a very step up (but near)) to the M1000 (according to the review that you did vs your DT880).
Oh, another thing tha i forget to say in the DT990 bass, is that it is refined.... That was that i noted since that i first listen to them.
Quote:

Originally Posted by denl82 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks for your help Wilashort The thing that put me off about the dt990's were the mix opinions on them that can sometimes lead to confusion, without hearing one with my own ears! For instance, one review by someone who's listening skillz I trust says the bass is great. Another person told me that while it's good, it's bested by the Pro 750 handily. In the end, I want the soundstage of the dt990's, but the supposed bass of the pro 750, so it would not be a step down from the M1000's bass performance. And don't get me wrong, the M1000 is a great headphone, the best I've owned for the music I listen to. I did some further a/b'ing between those equalizer settings and a flat eq. setting, and I came to understand what JVC was aiming at when placing the mids to where they were. The sound overall is a lot more calmer, leading to a less fatiguing listen, and the soundstage is wider. So in itself, the stock sound of the X-fi/M1000 combo isn't bad, but just for different tastes. When I had the dt880's, I found everything to be perfect, except for the bass amount, impact, and to a lesser degree, extension. When I turned up the bass on my x-fi or receiver, the bass would smother the air in the soundstage, something I just didn't like. If I can find a fon that has plenty of bass without losing any air, or a source/amp that would somehow bring out the dt880's bass while keeping it well intergrated with the rest of the sound, that would be sweet. As for now, I'm waiting for more detailed reviews on the new Kenwood headphone. It sounds like it has potential.

 

[denl82]

Thanks for the replies guys=]
You know how you read in junior head-fi'ers first threads,"Hi, I've researched here, and the more I read the more confusing it gets"? Well, I've been here for 3 years almost, and it's still happening to me too! To be honest, I'm not quite sure if I would like to take the plunge in an Ultrasone when funds free up, not just yet anyways. And that's mainly because the s-logic. While I do believe pro 750/2500's frequency response will be good or even great, I am a gamer, and need a headphone that would produce good height, and particularly good background that I've heard the Pros' specially placed drivers aren't capable of producing(this is just from what I've read).

In contrast, I have always had a place in my heart for Beyers. I've had both the dt770s and dt880s, and both were very enjoyable to own prior to my tastes in music changing. I would certainly like to hear the dt990s, since after switching from one headphone to another, I've learned that you never really know how a headphone will sound without some first-hand experience with them. I'm in no rush, however, cuz like I said, it'll be a few months before I can splurge on the luxury of owning yet another headphone.

As for the dt880'600 ohm edition, I've had an eye on that also. I wonder if my receiver can drive them well. I have a Pioneer VSX-305, but I can't find the specs of them on the web

 

[sikki-six]

I've had the DT770/80ohms for several years now, and I just received a pair of D2000s. The Denons are probably not quite burnt-in yet, but the bass is HUGE - I'm actually hoping the burn-in will tame it a bit. These cans have bass-volume AND punch in spades... I just compared 'em to my Beyers and they couldn't compare with the Denons in the bass department (or in sound-stage, mids, detail, highs...).

I'm EQing the bass down with the Denons, I cannot understand why someone would think they don't have bass - that seems ridiculous

 

[Punnisher]

I took my pair of 770s and modded them with Grado drivers, and they deliver exactly what you are looking for. They have deeper bass than open grados, and still have the crisp mids and highs that they are famous for.

The bass is as deep as the 770s, but not as overpowering or as plentiful (a good thing). Definitely more bass than normal grados though. The soundstage is also much more open. The extra detail actually makes the stage seem bigger than the 770s ever could. A definite improvement in all areas.

 

[Wilashort]

What grado drivers you use and where you got them??. I am interested in get a pair of drivers for my HFI-780 enclosure ((today i install a pair of drivers from a very old headphone (they was from my old brother) that doesn't work...) and they work somewhat much better than they did in his original enclosure....
Thank you very much.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Punnisher /img/forum/go_quote.gif I took my pair of 770s and modded them with Grado drivers, and they deliver exactly what you are looking for. They have deeper bass than open grados, and still have the crisp mids and highs that they are famous for. The bass is as deep as the 770s, but not as overpowering or as plentiful (a good thing). Definitely more bass than normal grados though. The soundstage is also much more open. The extra detail actually makes the stage seem bigger than the 770s ever could. A definite improvement in all areas.

 

[RayleighSilvers]

Sorry to bring up an old thread, just wanted to know did you guys find what you are looking for? All this talk of recessed mids is putting me off the beyers but I want a headphone capable of producing awesome bass without sacrificing vocals. 

 

[LithoJazoSphere]

Assuming you are properly driving them, it depends upon what kind of music you're listening to and what sort of sound you're looking for.  Their frequency response is one of the most extreme v-curves out there, but they're still quite clear, even in the mids.  If you're looking for a headphone that is best for vocally-dominated music, they're probably not the best choice, but for that powerful, deep bass and supreme comfort, they're so hard to beat, and I still find myself grabbing for them often even though I have numerous cans that cost twice as much.  But there is definitely some trade-off between having monstrous bass and mid-presence.  It's an acceptable compromise for me, but it's really hard to say whether you'll find it worth it without hearing them.