[jlbrach]

there are already quite a few people using the hugo 2 with the blu2 as a cheaper way of accessing the blu2 million taps....different strokes for different folks

 

[ray-dude]

I think it is safe to say that people that are buying the Blu2 are primarily buying an mScaler, which happens to be a pretty kick ass CD transport. Given that, I believe there is a market for people that buy a Quetest so they can use a Blu2 in their 2 channel setup (much more affordable than a DAVE, for example). For example, I know several people that are buying Hugo2's to be able to use a Blu.

 

[514077]

I have sympathy for the wish for 'just' an MScaler.

In reality though Blu2 and Dave are at the top of the DAC game and Chord are selling them as fast as they can make them. Rob and John have said quite clearly that they see Blu2 Dave as world leaders for a few years to come. Also, see it from their side. They have plenty of other projects to bring to the market without the distraction of a next generation MScaler. Whilst Blu2Dave is selling well at the premium end of the market it does not seem to make business sense to pull the rug out from under that market by introducing an MScaler that does more or less what Blu2 does but at (say) a third of the price. In any case I doubt that the processing chips exist at the moment to make an MScaler that could sell for Hugo2 money. Not only that but a solo MScaler is likely to need a high degree of input versatility and chances are it will accumulate other features as well as just MScaling.

Personally my money would be on a Dave2 with integral MScaler perhaps 2 years away from now.

Sorry but I think my £5 wager is safe this year.

It is however quite good fun to discuss things that we know nothing whatsoever about.

John and Rob must chuckle every now and then if they ever bother to read what we write.

I expect you're right about the chuckling. I can hope @AndrewOld wins, but I know you will. It would be shortsighted of them to release a Hugo2-range M Scaler while the Blu2 is doing well. Some people have already paired H2 and Blu2. So, as I said, it'll be a while before the tech is cheap enough.

 

[AndrewOld]

..
I want as many people as possible to enjoy the benefits of M scaler tech, so we are trying our best to reduce costs.

Rob

Either Rob Watts and Chord stand by that post, or they don’t.

 

[Triode User]

Either Rob Watts and Chord stand by that post, or they don’t.

Selective quoting is not clever. The full quote give a more accurate picture. And "....trying our best" is meaningless. My £5 is safe.

"I have already looked into that, and its possible that eliminating the ADC won't actually make a great deal of difference. The majority of the BOM cost is metalwork, FPGA, PCB and power supply. The ADC savings (analogue integrators and pulse array) is actually quite small and would probably be outweighed by the costs of producing two products.
I want as many people as possible to enjoy the benefits of M scaler tech, so we are trying our best to reduce costs.
Rob"

 

[AndrewOld]

Selective quoting is not clever. The full quote give a more accurate picture. And "....trying our best" is meaningless. My £5 is safe.

"I have already looked into that, and its possible that eliminating the ADC won't actually make a great deal of difference. The majority of the BOM cost is metalwork, FPGA, PCB and power supply. The ADC savings (analogue integrators and pulse array) is actually quite small and would probably be outweighed by the costs of producing two products.
I want as many people as possible to enjoy the benefits of M scaler tech, so we are trying our best to reduce costs.
Rob"

That’s why the Qutest is the same price as the Hugo2, because eliminating the volume control, Bluetooth, battery, remote control and producing completely new casework didn’t make it cheaper either.

 

[Triode User]

That’s why the Qutest is the same price as the Hugo2, because eliminating the volume control, Bluetooth, battery, remote control and producing completely new casework didn’t make it cheaper either.

Yep, now you are seeing the light.

(PS, just watching an amazing programme on the beeb about mind boggling surgery. I take my hat off to those guys. It makes all this talk about MScalers seem trivial.)

 

[JaZZ]

Maybe it won't be launched this year – too many other projects with priority (2Go, Qutest, PowerPulse amp, Davina) –, but I don't think we have to wait two years either. A reason to be optimistic is the first mention of an affordable M-Scaler for Hugo₂ and Qutest – which actually was to be expected (imagine a Hugo₂/Blu 2 combo!). Also, the M-Scaler does exist already, it just needs a dedicated housing, moreover it finds a further application in Davina, thus is sort of a module for three (or more) different products, of which the stand-alone M-Scaler will be the easiest to produce.

 

[Pappadave]

I have not, mainly because they do t have the bass extension (I’m spoiled rotten by my B&W 802d3’s).

I have a JL Audio F112v2 in the mix, which is lovely and very musical and transparent with the BluDAVE (fast, low distortion, etc. I’m driving them from the XLR outputs of the DAVE)

I’m guessing a 10” JL Audio would be more that sufficient for almost all music, but have the same sub in my surround setup for movies, etc

Ray-dude, one more question on Omegas,

While waiting for my SAMs to arrive, I am pondering whether the system will benefit from an active crossover (JL Audio's CR-1). How much of a necessity it is and how much of degradation it might introduce, compare to Dave direct (and will Dave have enough power to have another element in the chain)? As I have never dealt with subs, I am not sure what to expect. Would love to hear your views?

 

[ray-dude]

I'm not a big fan/expert on subs, so I can share my experience.

The SAMs naturally extend down to ~50Hz before they start falling off. You'll want to tune a low pass filter to your sub to match the natural fall off of the SAMs. To get that magic, the key is to have nothing between your DAVE/Hugo2 and the SAMs (drive them directly from the analog RCA outs, no cross over between the BluDAVE/BluHugo2 and the SAMs)

You then need to match the sub to the SAMs, using the cross over/filters in the sub or an active cross over. In the case of my JL Audio F112v2, the controls on the sub are more than good enough to have the sub basically become invisible, so I haven't played at all with active crossovers

On the F112v2, I first ran the room correction routine to calibrate the sub for my room. I then used the master volume level to match the output of the sub to the SAMs (I drive the F112v2 directly from my DAVE, via the XLR outputs of the DAVE). Lastly, I tuned the low pass filter (the frequency and the slope) so that the transition between the SAMs and the F112v2 is a smooth one. Fine tuning is playing with the polarity setting on the sub to get things to sound smoother.

I did all of this with a 20-200Hz sweep, and by ear. One could also use a calibrated mic and make adjustments with a tone sweep, but I found it pretty simple to set a low pass filter like this by ear (room correction is tough, setting a low pass filter is pretty easy).

Different subs will have different things you can manually set on the sub. If you don't have the levers to set on the sub, you'll need something like an active cross over. Just make sure that you stick it between the DAVE/Hugo2 and the sub, and not between the DAVE/Hugo2 and the SAMs. You'll be tuning the cross over to the sub to match the natural fall off of the SAMs.

 

[Pappadave]

I'm not a big fan/expert on subs, so I can share my experience.

The SAMs naturally extend down to ~50Hz before they start falling off. You'll want to tune a low pass filter to your sub to match the natural fall off of the SAMs. To get that magic, the key is to have nothing between your DAVE/Hugo2 and the SAMs (drive them directly from the analog RCA outs, no cross over between the BluDAVE/BluHugo2 and the SAMs)

You then need to match the sub to the SAMs, using the cross over/filters in the sub or an active cross over. In the case of my JL Audio F112v2, the controls on the sub are more than good enough to have the sub basically become invisible, so I haven't played at all with active crossovers

On the F112v2, I first ran the room correction routine to calibrate the sub for my room. I then used the master volume level to match the output of the sub to the SAMs (I drive the F112v2 directly from my DAVE, via the XLR outputs of the DAVE). Lastly, I tuned the low pass filter (the frequency and the slope) so that the transition between the SAMs and the F112v2 is a smooth one. Fine tuning is playing with the polarity setting on the sub to get things to sound smoother.

I did all of this with a 20-200Hz sweep, and by ear. One could also use a calibrated mic and make adjustments with a tone sweep, but I found it pretty simple to set a low pass filter like this by ear (room correction is tough, setting a low pass filter is pretty easy).

Different subs will have different things you can manually set on the sub. If you don't have the levers to set on the sub, you'll need something like an active cross over. Just make sure that you stick it between the DAVE/Hugo2 and the sub, and not between the DAVE/Hugo2 and the SAMs. You'll be tuning the cross over to the sub to match the natural fall off of the SAMs.

That's where my thinking is currently as well, thank you for confirming it. Now it is waiting time...

 

[ray-dude]

That's where my thinking is currently as well, thank you for confirming it. Now it is waiting time...

A word of warning on the Omegas (esp if you're feeding them with BluDAVE or BluHugo2), since we just went through this with my friend's new Compact Alnico Monitors: they will sound like absolute ass when you get them from Louis (no joke, you'll think something is wrong).

Even after a 100 hours of burn in, even though they sounded very nice in some frequency ranges, some vocals still sounded like they were hung over after a bender. After being banished to the casita for another week of burn in, they came out as sweet as anything you've ever heard.

The drivers need a lot of time to break in, esp. for the amazing reproduction BluDAVE/BluHugo2 is capable of (it takes so remarkably little to diffuse the Chord magic).

Give them a listen when you get them (just so you can see what ass sounds like , but be prepared to find someplace that won't drive anyone crazy, point them at each other, invert the wiring to one of them so they're out of phase, crank it up, and come back 7-10 days later.

 

[hieukm]

I am honestly excited about the prospect of Chord new digital amp driving my 96db sensitivity speaker. Would be cool if someone from Chord could update its progress.

 

[Pappadave]

A word of warning on the Omegas (esp if you're feeding them with BluDAVE or BluHugo2), since we just went through this with my friend's new Compact Alnico Monitors: they will sound like absolute ass when you get them from Louis (no joke, you'll think something is wrong).

Even after a 100 hours of burn in, even though they sounded very nice in some frequency ranges, some vocals still sounded like they were hung over after a bender. After being banished to the casita for another week of burn in, they came out as sweet as anything you've ever heard.

The drivers need a lot of time to break in, esp. for the amazing reproduction BluDAVE/BluHugo2 is capable of (it takes so remarkably little to diffuse the Chord magic).

Give them a listen when you get them (just so you can see what ass sounds like , but be prepared to find someplace that won't drive anyone crazy, point them at each other, invert the wiring to one of them so they're out of phase, crank it up, and come back 7-10 days later.

Hmm, with this process I will certainly face some marital issues. Have to find a bunker... but no pain, no gain.

 

[Whazzzup]

I would find that incredible that folks would consider a 6-7 times the cost of Hugo as a source. To each their own as well. My thoughts are more 1 to 1 like blu Dave. Or antipodes to tt or aurilic Aries to Hugo type match ups but this is only my perceived performance price guide.